A Case for the Spectacles, Response to text · Chapter 4 – Chapter 5
CHAP. IV. The summe of his Answer to my Fourth Section.
TO this Section, the title whereof is, That many learned Romanists have falne from the Catholike Faith to be Protestants, he saith, the Catholike Faith is indivisible, and they that renounce it in part, renounce it in all: Hee affirmeth that in Priests, who cannot conteine, to marry, it is a greater sinne than to keepe a concubine. This is the substance of his fourth Chapter, in answer to my fourth Section.
The Reply.
I shewed in my fourth Section, that many learned Romanists, convicted by evidence of truth, either in part, or in whole, renounced Poperie before their death.Pag. 58. That some have renounced the same in part (say you) is foolishly said, for no man can renounce the Catholike Faith in part, it being indivisible.
If I shall prove your assertion to bee a strange Paradoxe, the foolishnesse will returne into your owne bosome. For the better illustration therefore of your Tenet,Oratio in laudem Athanasii. heare what division Gregory Nazianzen makes upon that ground: When one taketh up water in his hand (saith he) not onelyonly that which he taketh not up, but that also which runneth forth, and findeth passage betweene his fingers, is divided and separated from that which he holdeth and incloseth in his hand: so not onelyonly the open and professed enemies of the Catholike Faith, but they also that seeme to be her best and greatest friends, are sometimes divided one from another. What thinke you of this ancient Father? Is your Faith indivisible by his Doctrine? or will you say it is foolishly spoken of him? But (say you) he that ceaseth to beleeve one point, ceaseth to beleeve any one as he should: And is this wisely spoken thinke you? Is not this your latter error greater than the first? For proofe therefore of your assertion, shew mee that man, who before the Councell of Trent held all the points of your Faith, as they are now taught and received in your Church; I say, give me but one since the Aposles time, who within the compasse of fifteene hundred yeares beleeved all your doctrines of Faith, entirely in all points, and for that one mans sake, I will confesse your Faith is indivisible, and submit my obedience to your Church.
Your Index Expurgatorius discovers the weaknesse of your opinion: I speake not of Authors which were condemned in your first and third Classis for Heretikes, but of those Romanists who in the second Classis are purged for their suspected doctrine (as you terme it) and yet never forsooke your Church;Propter suspectam doctrinam Ind. lib prohibit. I dare confidently avow, that there are above foure hundred of those Classicall Authors, all members of the Roman Church, never excommunicated, never condemned for heresie in your Church, and yet are commanded by your Inquisitors to be blotted out in some particular points of doctrine, which make against your Trent Faith. If these men therefore have renounced your Faith in part, how is your Faith indivisible? Or If they cease to beleeve one point, why doth your Church cite their testimonies, and allow their opinions in other doctrines consonant to your Church, when as (by your Tenet) he that ceaseth to beleeve one point, ceaseth to beleeve any one as he should? If you should forsake all Authors that forsake your doctrine in part (or in some particular points) you will generally suffer a Recoverie against your owne Church. I will give you but one instance. It is the common Tenet of the Roman Church at this day, that the blessed Virgin was conceived without originall sinne: yet the contrarie Tenet is likewise maintained by the members of your owne Church. Ludovicus Vives tells us, that two orders of Friers, Ludov. Vives in lib. 20. de Civit. Dei. cap. 26. p. 828.both fierce, and both led with undaunted Generals, set this question a foote; the Dominicans by Thomas Aquinas, and the Franciscans by Duns Seotus: the Councell of Basill decreed, that shee was wholly pure without all touch of sinne, but the Dominicans objected that it was no lawfull Councell, and the Minorites of the other side avowed that it was true and holy, and called the Dominicans Heretikes for standering the power of the Church; so that the matter had come to a shrewd passe, but that Pope Sixtus forbad this Theame to be any more disputed.
To proceed to the rest of your observations. I produced for a witnesse Paulus Vergerius, who renounced Poperie, being a Romish Bishop, by the testimonies of Sleidan, and Osiander; I cited the Councell of Basil, for dispensing with the cup to the Lay people; Aeneas Sylvius for Mariage of Priests; Mr. Harding against your private Masse; Mr. Casaubon for your translating of the Scriptures; Lord Cooke for the Papists frequenting our Churches, till the 11th. of Qu. Elisabeth: Now let the Reader judge of your moderate and learned confutation: First,Pag. 59. Sleidan and Osiander (say you) are notorious fellowes both for lying and heresie; Paulus Vergerius, when he dyed, cast forth a horrible stench, and roared most fearefully like an Oxe; The Councell of Basile (you know) is of little or no authoritie with Catholikes, as being reproved by the Sea Apostolicke; Aeneas Sylvius, what hee wrote in the time of that Councell, is revoked by him in his Bull of Retractations; Touching Casaubon, you say there is shame enough in store for us both; Touching the Lord Cooke, he was soundly answered by a Catholicke Divine, and so exposed to the scorne of the world for his notorious falshoods.
These be your severall answers, and this is a confutation of their authorities: but I say to you, if these men have spoken untruth, beare witnesse of their falshood, if otherwise they delivered the truth, why do you reproach them? Either let their proofs bee plainly and moderately confuted, or let the lying lips (saith David) be put to silence, Psalm. 31.20.which cruelly, disdainfully, and despightfully speake against the righteous.
Such as is your charitie, such is your chastitie: for when I cite your Jesuite Costerus for a witnesse,Coster. Enchir. cap. 17. propo. 9. Pag. 64. that a Priest doth sinne more grievously in marrying a wife, than keeping a concubine, you scoffingly returne me this answere: You seeme to take this for a great error, but in Priests who cannot marrie, it is a greater sinne to marrie, for it is not marriage. Thus you.
And is the marriage of Priests no marriage? Was there no marriage in all the Tribe of Levi? What will become of all the sonnes of Aaron? were they all bastards?Ignatius ad Philadelph. I wish (saith Ignatius) that I may be found meet before God to follow their steps which raigne in his Kingdome; as namely, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, and Esay, and other Prophets; of Peter and Paul, and other Apostles, who lived in matrimonie, and used conjugall rites. And in conclusion hee answeres your assertion in these words; If any man call lawfull copulation and procreation of children, Idem, ibid.corruption and uncleannesse, that man hath a serpent, the Devill (that fell from God) dwelling in him.
Againe,Grat. Par. 1. dist. 56. fol. 67. Osius Palea. your owne Gratian tells us from Pope Damasus, that many Bishops of Rome were Priests sonnes, as namely Pope Hosius, Bonifacius, Agapetus, Theodorus, Silverius, Deusdedit, Faelix, Gelasius, all these were Popes, and Priests sonnes: and then he concludes;aCōplures etiam alii inveniantur, qui de sacerdotibus nati, Apostolicae sedi praefuerūt. Ibid. There were many others also to duplicate page duplicate page be found, who were begotten of Priests, and governed in the Apostolike See. Athanas. ad Dracontium. p. (mihi) 518.And Athanasius writing to Bishop Dracontius, tells him, that in his dayes many Monkes were Parents of children, and Bishops likewise were Fathers of Sonnes; and this was 340. yeares after Christ.
But I presume you will not say, that the marriage of those Priests was no marriage, and their brood was spurious and illegitimate. Those who account it a Capitall offence for a Priest to marrie, and a veniall sinne to keepe a concubine, doe rightly resemble the old Heretike Aërius, who used to say,Epiph. haeres. 76. To have the company of a woman out of marriage, is no more sinne, than for a man to claw his eare. St. Austin puts the question,De bono Matrim. dist. 27. Quoniam. and resolves it in this manner; Some say they be adulterous that marrie after they have made a vow; but I tell you (saith he) they sin grievously that put such asunder. And elsewhere more particularly hee concludes against your Tenet;Augustinus de bono viduitatis cap. 10. They that say the marriage of such men or women as have vowed continencie, is no marriage, but rather adulterie, seeme unto mee not to consider discreetly and advisedly what they say. And in his Tract of holy virginitie he plainly shewes the Antiquitie of your error,August. de sancta Virgin. c. 34. and refutes it, where speaking of vowed persons, he tells us; that many of them are kept from marriage, not for love of their godly purpose of Virginitie, but for feare of open shame; which shame proceedeth of Pride, for that they are more afraid to displease men than God: they will not marry, because they cannot without rebuke, yet better were it for them to marrie, than to burne, that is to say, with the flame of their concupiscence to be wasted; they are sorrie for their profession, and yet it grieveth them to confesse it. Chrys. contra Judaios Gentil. & haeret. serm. de nuptiis Cana in Galil.In like manner Chrysostome in the same age doth elegantly illustrate the honour of marriage in Spirituall persons. Our Lord honoured Marriage with his presence, and sayest thou that Marriage is a hindrance unto godlinesse? I tell thee Marriage is no hinderance. Had not Moses a wife and children? Helias, was not hee a virgin? Moses brought downe Manna from Heaven, so did Helias fire: Moses caused Quailes to flie in the heaven, and Helias shut it with a word. What hurt did virginity to the one? what impediment was wife and children to the other? See Helias coached in the ayre, and Moses travelling through the Sea. Behold Peter a Pillar of the Church, he had a wife, therefore finde no fault with Marriage.
Looke into the Ages following; your Angelicall Doctor Thomas Aquinas resolves the question flatly against you & your fellow Jesuits. If an Acolothyte (saith he) doe confesse to a discreet Priest, The Acolothytes were those that lighted the Tapers at the reading of the Gospel in the Masse.that by no meanes he can containe, the Priest doth not much offend in giving him this counsell, that he should marry privately, and closely blinde the eyes of the Bishop. And if afterwards he be willing to take Orders, we hold it lesse sinne for him to use his wife, than to commit fornication; for it is a lesse offence to accompany with his wife, than to commit fornication against the Divine Precept. They who pretend chastitie, and make a vow to keepe it, when they enter into holy Orders, doe breake it even in this, when they allow a concubine. Aeneas Sylvius was conscious to himselfe of the danger of that sinne, and therefore he wished that marriage were restored to Priests; yea, whilst he was a Cardinall he had his concubine, to whom at last he gave threescore Florens for her Dowrie: and it seemes when he was well in yeares, in or about the time of his Popedome, he confessed; I cannot boast of any merit in my chastity, Magis me Venus fugitat, quam ego illā horreo. Ep. 92.for to tell the truth, venerie doth rather flie from me, than I from it. Neither was it his particular case alone; for the Booke called Taxae Camerae Apostolicae, which your Bishop Espencaeus complained of, doth sufficiently witnesse the damnable effects of such divellish doctrine. The gravest Cardinals in Rome, who were appointed by speciall Commission, and presented their information to Pope Paul the third, doe sufficiently witnesse the forbidden fruits of such an evill tree: The words are these; In this City of Rome the Curtezans passe through the streets, Wolph. Lect. Memor. Anno 1535 p. 403.or ride on their mules, like honest Matrons, and in the midst of the day, Noblemen and Cardinals deare friends attend upon them. We never saw such corruption, but onelyonly in this Citie, which is the example and patterne of all other: moreover, they dwell in faire and goodly houses.
On the other side, you would make us beleeve, that your Curtezans goe altogether on foote; that they have a speciall badge of dishonestie, whereby they may be knowne; that they are despised and reviled of the people, but especially by Cardinals and the Nobles; that they dwelt in out-houses and back lanes: but to ride on horsebacke, to be attyred as honest Matrons and Noble Ladies, to be attended by Priests and Cardinals friends, and to dwell in faire and beautifull houses, this shewes that your dispensation for stewes is occasioned chiefly by the forbidding of marriage; and by this meanes marriage, which is honourable in all, Heb. 13.4.and the bed undefiled, by the Apostles doctrine, is now become a sinne, and your Apostolike See the Mother of Fornications. This occasioned your owne Agrippa to complaine of your casting up of the Bawds rents with the revenew of your Church.Agrip. de vanit. scient. c. 64. de Lenonia. I have heard (saith he) the accompts cast up in this sort; he hath two Benefices, one cure of twenty Ducats, a Priorie of forty Ducats, and three whores in a brothell house.
I list not any longer to stirre this filthie puddle,Camerinam movere. Eras. Adag. which stinkes in the nosthrils of God and good men; the counsell of your Canonist is safe and good in this particular.Panor. de Cler. Conjug. Cap. Cū Olim. The Church (saith he) should discharge the part of a good Physitian, who when by experience he findes one medicine rather hurt than helpe, he removeth it, and applieth another: and there hee gives the reason, Because we finde by experience, that the Law of single life hath brought forth contrarie effects: and the rather, because it is resolved by your learned Cardinall:Cajet. in quodlibet contra Lutherum. It cannot bee proved either by reason, nor yet by authority, to speake absolutely, that a Priest doth sinne in marrying a wife; for neither the Order of Priesthood, in that it is Order, nor the same Order, in that it is holy, is any hindrance to matrimonie; for Priesthood doth not dissolve matrimonie, whether it be contracted before Priesthood or afterwards, if we (setting apart all other Ecclesiasticall Lawes) stand onelyonly to those things which we have received of Christ and his Apostles.
Panorm. extr. de Elect. C. Licet. de Vit. Ab.Againe, your owne Panormitan tells us, that the Priests of Grecia, being within Orders, doe marrie wives; and we see they doe it (saith he) sine peccato, without sinne, or breach of Law, either of God or man: And thus by your owne Tenet you stand with the positive law of man against the law of God; you stand in opposition against the Greeke Church, which ever used it; and lastly, you are at difference among your selves,Espencaeus de Continentia. l. 1. c. 11. p. 116. when many prime members of your owne Church utterly condemne it. The doctrine of St. Paul is evident and plaine, It is better marrie than burne. This Law is cleane perverted by your Jesuits doctrine;Utrumque est malum, nubere & uri, imo pejus est nubere, quicquid exclamant adversarii: praesertim ei qui habet votum solenne. Bell. de Monach. l. 2. c. 30. Hist. of Trent. l. 5. fol. 400. & 680. for (saith Bellarmine) Let our adversaries say what they will, it is worse to marrie than burne, especially for him that hath made a solemne vow: So that the Law of God must give way to the Law of man, and chiefly for reason of state and policie. For (saith Cardinall Rodolpho) if the marriage of Priests were tolerated, this inconvenience would follow, the Priests having house, wife, and children, would not depend upon the Pope but on the Prince, and their love to their children would make them yeeld to any prejudice of the Church: they will seeke also to make their Benefice hereditarie, and in a short space the authoritie of the Apostolike See will be confined within the walles of Rome. And to these reasons you may truly adde this, as appendant to the rest; the dispensation of Stewes would be neglected, and consequently the great Revenue of the Roman See would be utterly lost; and therefore the Index Expurgatorius will not lay hold of any such doctrine.
For a conclusion of this point. If you say marriage of Priests be malum in se, evill in it selfe, you comply with the Devillish doctrine of Tatianus; If it be evill quia prohibetur, because it is forbidden onelyonly, then fornication, which is evill of it selfe, and in it selfe, must needs bee the greater sinne.
CHAP. V. The summe of his Answer to my Fifth Section.
OF this Section (saith he) there is not much to be said, for there is nothing in it, but a litle of the Knights own raving. Maldonat approveth and commendeth St. Austins explicacation, but addeth another of his owne. After this, the Knight hath a great deale of foolish stuffe, which needs no answer.
The Reply.
Your answer is short, by your words be somewhat sharpe: and you can finde nothing in that Section but raving and foolishnesse? If it be raving to cite Texts of Scripture against your maimed Commandements, your Invocation of Saints, your Prayer in an unknowne tongue, your worship of Images, and the like: If it be raving to say Purgatorie is created a point of Faith, & that Faith is confirmed by Councels, meerely for the benefit of the Pope and Clergie; that you doe not exercise the power of your Priesthood in binding as well as loosing, by reason no man will give monie to be bound, but to be loosed in Purgatorie: If it be raving to say your Jesuite Maldonat preferres his owne explication of Scripture before St. Austins, onelyonly because it more crosseth the sense of the Calvinists; and withall confesseth that St. Austins opinion is more probable; If this I say may bee deemed raving, then will I confesse your railing is a good answer. But he despaires (say you) of his cause, who seeth Maldonats saying practised by the Church of Rome against his Church and doctrine.
Acts 5.38, 39.I confesse with the blessed Apostle, If our counsell or worke be of men, it will come to nought, and then I might despaire of it, but if it be of God, yee cannot overthrow it, lest happely yee be found even to fight against God. We have no cause (blessed be God) to despaire of our Religion, which in one Age hath spread over the better part of Christendome. But I conceive there is little hope of you or your cause, who have sold your selves either with Ahab to worke wickednesse, and maintaine Idolatrous worship for your owne advantage; or like Maldonat, See Maldonat. Col. 1536. Unum è duobus intelligatur necesse est, aut tunc non scandaliz abimini, cùm videritis filium hominis ascendentē ubi erat prius: aut (contra) tunc magis scandaliz abimini: priorem sensum plerique sequūtur, Chrysost. Augustin. &c. Yet Maldonat followeth the latter.openly to professe greater hatred to Protestants, than love to the truth it selfe. For it is apparent, ex professo, he preferreth his owne opinion without any authoritie, before St. Austin, nay contrarie to St. Austin, and hee gives this reason for it; Because this sense of mine doth more crosse the sense of the Calvinists. But I may say to you, as sometimesaLudov. Viv. de Civ. Dei. l. 13. c. 24. Ludovicus Vives spake upon the like occasion: St. Austin is now safe, because of his age, but if he were alive againe, he should be shaken off as a bad Rhetoritian, or a poore Grammarian. And yet this good Saint was so farre from defending any opinion against the knowne truth, that on the contrarie, he preferreth the interpretation ofbAugust. contr. Cresc. Grammat. l. 1. c. 32. & l. 2. c. 32. p. (mihi) 218. & 241. Cresconius a Grammarian, before St. Cyprian the Martyr, because it seemed to him more probable and agreeable to the truth.