The Universalist Examined and Convicted, Chapter 16
CHAP. XVI. Of the fourth Objection.
A Fourth Argument is this.
Thoſe to whom he would not vouchſafe to manifeſt himſelfe, or to pray for, for thoſe he would not die. John. 17.9.
But he would not manifeſt himſelfe to, nor pray for the world of ungodly and wicked men.
Ergo, He did not die for the world of ungodly or wicked men.]
Before I come to his anſwers, I ſhall take notice of his dealing with the argument to make it fit for his purpoſe.
1. He confoundeth two arguments together; for [Manifeſtation of him ſelf,] that belongeth to an other argument; neither can he give any preſident of jumbling theſe two together, which confuſion will make the argument not clear, and the anſwers obſcure.
2. He cannot produce any that citeth John, 17.9. to prove the Major.
3. Nor any that maketh the Minor to runne thus. [But he prayed not for the world of ungodly; or the concluſion to run thus. [Ergo, [He dyed not for the world of ungodly,] all theſe are purpoſely foyſted in to make the argument ſeeme vile; this is no faithfull dealing as he promiſed, the argument runneth thus, in the ſeventh Argument in Hag. Col.
Thoſe whom he reconciled he interceded for. John. 17.9.
But He interceded not for all and every ſon of Adam. John. 17.9.
Ergo, He reconciled not every ſonne of Adam. John. 17.9.
The Major is thus grounded, Rom. 8.32. he ſaith, [If he give us his Sonne, he wil much more give us all things,] The Argument is this, if he gave us the greater, he will certainely much more give us the leſſe; ſo if he die for us, he will pray for us; ſo in the negative we conclude, if he pray not for the world which is the leſſe, he did not die for or reconcile which is the greater. Now to perpend his anſwers, he giveth this generall and facile refutation. [This objection is falſe many waies.] And that which he driveth at I gueſſe to be the ground of the reaſon, that is the ground of proceeding from the leſſe to the greater negatively, that he would prove it is no good reaſon to ſay becauſe he would not pray, therefore he would not die for the world, and he urgeth thus.
[It is not right reaſon to ſay God would not make Heaven, &c. whom he would not preſerve in that good eſtate.] But had he beene in his right reaſon he would have ſeen this very impertinent to our purpoſe; our argument proceeds from the leſſe to the greater negatively; but his inſtance proceedeth from the greater to the leſſe negatively: which is unſound and quite contrary to the buſineſſe in hand; for to preſerve in a good eſtate is a greater mercy then to create in ſuch eſtate onelyonly; ſo that though this is not ſound, he will not create becauſe he will not preſerve; yet this is good, if he will not create which is the leſſe, he will not preſerve which is the greater; and this ſerveth us, the leſſe may include the greater negatively, but the greater cannot the leſſe.
As for thoſe expreſſes that touch that part of the argument, viz. [the manifeſting of himſelfe to the world,] it is not to this argument; which mixture of Heterogeneous expreſſes will pertu…be the reader in the cleare deciſion of this argument; therefore I wave them. Againe he urgeth.
[If Chriſt had ſaid he never did nor would pray for the world, (which he never ſaid) yet it were evill in us to uſe that as an argument to deny the truth of his own words as that he dyed for all and every one.] But rather an evill in himſelfe, to obtrude ſuch a ſenſe on thoſe places that contradict Chriſts owne words, or the true conſequences from the ſame; it is no evill in us to gaineſay the phanſy or gloſſe that the Author puts on thoſe Texts: from this I can gather little, but that the Author would have all the ſayings of our Saviour to take the modell of their interpretations from his own conceits upon thoſe places. 1 Tim. 2.6. Heb. 2.9. which is not a reaſonable poſtulatum; as for that parentheſis (which he did not) if he once ſaid he did not, and it cannot be proved that ever he did pray for that world, we may preſume he meaneth, he never had nor would pray for them.
[This confoundeth his love of compaſſion, common to all, and of delight peculiar to Beleevers.] It is hard to divine his meaning herein, unleſſe he meaneth that his dying for, be only the love of compaſſion, and his (praying for) the love of delight; and ſo to pray for us, to be a greater love then dying for us; for ſo he maketh the love of delight to be the greateſt love; but this is not apparent by any Scripture; and how this argument confoundeth compaſſion and delight, the Author would have done well to have diſcovered to them that ſee it not.
[This confoundeth the death of Chriſt as ranſome (for all) and his advocation that is onelyonly for Beleevers.] I know the Authors underſtanding is not able to reach the difference betwixt confounding, and (not dividing;) the argument contends for the non dividing of his death and advocation, but not to confound them; the argument and them that forme it hold it diſtinct. But we would have his advocation and death to be to the ſame perſons, and ſo his death and ranſome not for all and every ſonne of Adam. 2. Whereas he ſaith, his advocation is peculiar to beleevers, I conclude he hath loſt part of his leſſon, viz. the diſtinction of Arminius of Advocation into generall and ſpeciall; for without this how will he free himſelfe from a contradiction, in that he ſaith here, that his advocation is peculiar to beleevers? yet he contendeth page 110. 111. that he prayed for the world, John, 9.21. for tranſgreſſors, Iſay. 53.12. for crucifiers, Luke, 23.34. all which he oppoſeth to elect and beleevers. 3. How his advocation is proper to beleevers, (that is in act) I ſee not, becauſe he prayed for ſome that after ſhould beleeve, and therefore then did not, ver. 22. 4. That his advocation is proper to beleevers, (that is ſuch as are or ſhall be) I grant; but then why his oblation ſhould be of larger extent I ſee not; they are joyned acts in his mediatourſhip, the one ſhedding,Col Hag. in Arg. the other preſenting that blood as ſhed. Hence the Remonſtrants grant, [pro omnibus Chriſtum imercedere ut pontifices ejus typi ſolebant,] and theſe acts are never diſjoyned but connected, as Rom. 8.34. 1 John. 2.1.2. for him to appeare on earth for them for whom he appeareth not in heaven, Scripture owneth not: and if he can prove Chriſt to have interceded for all, I for my part ſhall grant him to have offered blood for all; and ſeeing he granteth interceſion to be peculiar, ſo ſhall I conclude oblation alſo, they being both of the ſame latitude; and whereas he ſaith, [This confoundeth ranſome (for all) and advocation (for beleevers] is a weake confutation, becauſe in in it there is (petitio principii) a ſuppoſing that his ranſome is for all and every man, which is yet (ſub judice,) nay cleare to the contrary.
Yet upon this weake bat…ery, he can after his uſuall cuſtome manfully conclude that, [The whole argument is fallen without further anſwer.] But why doth he attempt workes of ſupererogation, in producing ſo many leaves in a buſineſſe that is done allready? but his meaning is, (as much as it will with all the reſt that follow;) he then attempt th… to anſwer that Text Rom 8.32. wherein the ſtrength of the propoſition lieth, and from it we urge, if he gave us his Sonne, his Sonne will give us his prayers; if not the latter, not the former; to this he thus anſwers.
[This is not ſpoken in the third perſon, nor of ranſome onelyonly, nor as a propoſition to bring men in to beleeve.] This antidote like an Empericke he applieth to every Text, not conſidering how it is applied to the conſtitution of the ſame; for what though it be not in the third perſon, the conſequence is good, that to whom he giveth his Sonne, to them he giveth all things, and that as firme as if the words had runne thus; [If he hath given his Sonne to every man, how ſhall he not with him give them all things,] what perſon ſoever it be ſpoken in, firſt, ſecond, or third; yet this is firme, that if he give the greater gift, he will not be niggardly of a leſſe: the argument of confidence is not drawne from the perſons to whom, but the gift that was given. 2. Whereas he ſaith, that this phraſe (He hath delivered him up for us all,) meaneth not of ranſome onelyonly, it is falſe and contrary to any common underſtanding; it is cleare that theſe words relate to his death in which he is ſaid to be delivered up for us.
But he urgeth further.
[It ſerveth not the propoſition; for it ſaith not, how ſhall he not freely give us all things? but how ſhall he not with him freely give us all things? ſo ſpeaking of his free giving him to us, and with him all things.] A wiſe interpretor would ſtand the Author in much ſtead, to explicate his meaning herein; the difference betwixt, [Shall he not give us all things,] and this, [Shall he not with him give us all things] is very obſcure; and had he kept his owne councell, we ſhould have remained expectants of ſome rare diſcovery; but from page 107. we may gather what his abuſe of the Text is, and what he meaneth by this phraſe, [With him give us all things,] there I finde this expreſſe. [They now by beleeving receit having Chriſt and in him life, and being ſonnes thereby, which giveth hope of all good, he concludeth, having freely given us this his owne Sonne, (whom before he delivered up for us,) how ſhall he not with him freely give us all things?] So that hence I conceive his evaſion is this, viz. that phraſe, [With him,] ſpeakes of ſuch a giving his Sonne, as conſiſts in giving his Spirit, by bringing them in to beleeve; and being ſo, a beeing made ſonnes, and having adoption, and thus having him given us, with him thus given we ſhall have all things; but this is injurious to the Text many wayes, as 1. Then the ſenſe muſt be thus, having the Sonne and all things with him, how ſhall he not with him give us all things? this would be abſurd. Let the Author tell me what thingt are they of which he concludes upon the having of Chriſt; are they not all thoſe things mentioned in the Chapter? as redemption of our body, ver. 23. ſpirit to helpe infirmities, ver. 26. the utility of all things for good, v. 28. conformity to his Sonne, ver. 29. vocation, juſtification, glorification: yea as as a ſtrong Remonſtrant affirmeth, [Omnia quae ſpectant ad vocationem & glorificationem noſtram.] Certainely then if vocation and ſpirit,Cornel. A lapid. in locum. be thoſe things that he concludeth from Chriſts being given, then thoſe things are not included in that giving of Chriſt; then it would meane thus; if we have vocation and ſpirit, how ſhall he not with thoſe things give us thoſe things? but this ſenſe I leave to the Author. 2. Is it not as cleare as the light that this phraſe [with him] is no more but with him ſo delivered up for us? there is no mentioning of a giving of Chriſt as diſtinct from his being delivered up for us, as he ſuggeſts. 3. This would intimate that to be brought in to beleeve, is ſet out in Scripture by this phraſe of having Chriſt (given for us,) or having given (to us,) but this I no where finde; where Chriſt is ſaid to be given either by his Father or himſelf, it relateth to his death and ranſome, as Mat. 20.28. Joh. 6.17. Luk 22.19. Epheſ. 5.2. eſpecially where this phraſe, (delivered up for us) is uſed, that is moſt cleare, that word foreign I never read (when ſpoken of Chriſt) in an other ſenſe: but when the Scripture ſpeaketh of giving faith, confidence, Sonſhip, or any of the choice benefits, it ſaith not, he giveth his (Son) but his (Spirit) Luke, 11.12. Rom. 5.5. 1. Theſ. 4 8. and Gal. 4.4.6. the difference is cleare on both parts. He ſent his Sonne, verſe 4. He ſent the ſpirit of his Sonne, ver. 6. So that it is cleare that the Apoſtle draweth this concluſion, not from the receipt of the Spirit of Chriſt in beleeving, but from Chriſts being delivered up for them to die; and good ground: for grace ſaith Sonneſhip, glory; all come ſhort of Chriſt himſelfe; and the argument is ſtrong from the greater to the leſſe; and doth not all that he ſaith appeare rather to pervert, then to ſatisfie the Text?
Thus having done with the propoſition, he invadeth the aſſumption which is, [That he did not intercede for every man, John, 17.9.].
Now againſt this he thus ſaith, [That doth not ſay the world of wicked and ungodly men, as the aſſumption ſaith.] Neither doth the aſſumption ſay ſo, but when it is altered and corrupted by himſelfe; we ſay he prayed not for every ſon of Adam; we have no reaſon to ſay he prayed not for the world of ungodly, becauſe all the wicked and ungodly are not of that world of ungodly that was excluded his prayers.
But he further ſaith thus, [The word (world) ver. 9. includeth all the Elect that were in and of the world, and uncalled forth and this appeareth in that for the ſame things for which he prayed for them that did beleeve, ver. 6.9. he prayeth for the ſame, for them that after ſhould beleeve on him, ver. 20.] The contrary whereof doth clearely appeare; for if at the ſame time he prayed for the ſame things, for ſome elect and yet uncalled home, ver. 20. it is cleare that when he excluded the world from his prayers, that word (world) doth not take in the elect uncalled, for whom he prayeth, ver. 20. for then ſuch muſt be both prayed for, and yet excluded his prayers, at the ſame time, and for the ſame things; herein he doth implicate himſelfe. But rather the word (world) is meant of thoſe unregenerate men, that neither did nor afterwards ſhould beleeve in him; for ſuch he prayed not for faith, or union, or perſeverance, or glory. As for that which followeth, viz. [All the way from ver. 9. to 21. there is no petition for any thing, for any before they beleeve, or yet might bring them in to beleeve. [Which is falſe, if he meane neither expreſly, nor implicitely; for implicitely he prayed for faith, whereby they are made one with Chriſt and the Father, unleſſe the Author will ſay that Chriſt prayed that ſuch as did not beleeve, might be one with him, without the conſideration of faith, which I cannot conceive; certainely in praying for the end, he prayed for the meanes incluſively.
But he further urgeth.
[So that the aſſumption rendring the word [World] for the wicked, non elect oppoſed to elect, maketh two ſorts of elect, one ſort prayed for verſe 9. another ſort prayed for verſe 20.] Theſe words deſerve hiſſing, rather then a ſolicitous anſwering, and cannot be reduced to common reaſon; we may affirme the elect prayed for, though in a diverſe ſtate and condition, the elect beleeving, ver: 9. the elect unbeleeving, ver. 20. and this without abſurdity; but then we oppoſe not the elect to the non elect, but beleevers to ſuch as yet do not beleeve, both being elect; neither doe we oppoſe but diſtinguiſh them; we may clearely ſee two ſorts of men. 1. Such as are prayed for, and they are ſuch as did for the preſent or afterwards ſhould beleive: ſuch as did ver. 9. ſuch as ſhould, ver. 20.2. Such as are excluded his prayers, and they muſt be ſuch as they neither did nor ſhould; and I may urge, if by (world) he meaneth elect unbeleeving, then Chriſt did exclude ſuch his prayers. But this is falſe from ver. 20.
[Or elſe it granteth a ſort of people in the world, that are neither of the world nor of the elect.] But this he ſpake at a venture without conſideration. I ſhall againe reaſſume the parts: thoſe prayed for ver. 9. were elect called out of the world; thoſe prayed for ver. 20. were elect uncalled, yet to be called; thoſe excluded his prayers ver. 9. were non elect, of the world and never to be taken out of it; now let him cleare up his ſight, and tell me if we make a ſort of men that are neither elect nor of the world; but this ſerveth with the reſt to fill paper and puzzle his ignorant Reader.
As alſo that which followeth.
[Which way ſoever the aſſumption will have it, it holds forth this falſehood, that none of the elect were, are, or ſhall be beholden to the prayers of Chriſt for all or any of that patience &c. extended before faith; or for the meanes of grace, by which they are brought in to beleeve, or for faith, ſeeing no ſuch thing is prayed for here for any but the world, verſe 21.23.] Wherein theſe two things are granted and affirmed. 1. That Chriſt prayeth for patience, meanes of grace, faith, for the world, oppoſed to ſuch as beleeve, ver. 9. or ſhould beleeve, ver. …0. 2. That he prayed not for faith, &c. for any but that world,] both theſe are falſe; the firſt is falſe, upon this ground, he excluding that world from his prayers, for unity with the Father and the Sonne, would not pray for faith by which they are to be made one; certainely if he exclude from the end, he doth exclude from the meanes. 2. How Chriſt ſhould pray for them that neither did nor ſhould after beleeve, any that acknowledgeth Chriſts prayers not to be fruſtrate cannot comprehend. 3. This is grounded on the 21. ver. where it ſaith, [That the world may beleeve,] and ſo from hence he urgeth that Chriſt did pray for faith for the world: ſo preſuming that the word (beleeve) meanes ſaving ſaith, by which we are made one with God and ſo ſaved. But this is not cleare. I conceive it onelyonly meant of conviction of the minde, and making them to know, as ver. 23. expounds it as the Devils may doe, and ſuch as neither doe nor ſhall beleeve; of the like nature is Pſal. 83. laſt. Pſal. 59.13. The ſecond is falſe; for either he prayed for faith for them, ver. 20. which were not of the world, excluded, ver. 9. or elſe he prayed for oneneſſe with himſelfe, and glory without faith; this latter is improbable.
But he further urgeth,
[The Text ſaith not he will not, but in the preſent tenſe, in that very time its not in the preterfective tenſe, or future tenſe.] This is a very empty evaſion; for if he once ſaid, I pray not for the (world) [and that indifinitely, without ſuch limitations as the Author pretendeth; as [for theſe things] or [at this time,] which if he had thus ſaid [I pray not for the world at this time, or for theſe things;] this evaſion had ſome colour:] but when he ſaith I pray not for the (world,) and that it cannot be produced either before or after that he did pray for them, it is no better then preſumption to conclude that either he did it before or after pray for the world.
But to this he oppoſeth.
[He did pray for ſuch as were none of thoſe prayed for verſe 9.20. even for tranſgreſſors, Iſay. 53.12. crucifyers, Luke. 23.34.] This is the foreign and height of the anſwer, both of the Author and moſt acute Remonſtrants to overthrow the Minor, but not to ſatisfaction: for thoſe prayed for, ver. 9. were tranſgreſſors, if Iohn be right, 1 John. 1.8. In many things, we ſin all; thoſe prayed for ver, 20. were tranſgreſſours, becauſe not called home, and might be ſome of his crucifyers whom he prayed for and were converted; now how doth it appeare, that ſeeing he prayed for tranſgreſſours and crucifyers, that he prayed for ſuch as were not prayed for, ver. 9.20. or how will the Remonſtrants prove that he prayed for all tranſgreſſours, all crucifyers, which is to the purpoſe? therefore this gloſſe is vaine and empty. Yet he ſeeketh to temper the Text by theſe words.
[I pray not for the world, that is not ſo much, ſo chiefely.] That the word (no…) is ſometimes ſo uſed I grant; but if we ſhall uſe that liberty to expound all Texts ſo, we ſhould deſtroy the Scripture; as for thoſe examples produced by him, as 1 Cor. 1.17. it appeareth that Paul did baptize ſome; when therefore he ſaith [I came not to baptize,] it muſt meane not ſolely, or not chiefely; but this gloſſe cannot be faſtened on Iohn. 17.9. becauſe it appeareth not that Chriſt ever prayed for any that never ſhould beleeve on him; therefore that applied to this Text, is to pervert, not to ſatisfie it.
Againe he urgeth.
[The things prayed for, from verſe 9. to 20. are of an higher nature then thoſe things we are to pray for the world or any in it till they be called.] Which contradicteth not onelyonly himſelfe, but our Saviour alſo. Himſelfe it doth, becauſe he before ſaid, [Chriſt prayed for the ſame things, for them that ſhall afterwards beleeve on him: that he asked for them that doe beleeve on him;] certainely then if he prayed for them that ſhould beleeve, he prayed for them before they were called home. And our Saviour he contradicteth, becauſe for thoſe things he doth pray, v. 20 even for them that yet did not beleeve; therefore he doth charge Chriſt with doing that which is unfit.
Againe he further urgeth.
[Chriſt in Iohn. 17.9. prayed not only as a ranſome-giver and a Mediatour between God and man, as 1 Tim. 2.6. but as a Prince, High Prieſt, the Mediatour of the New Teſtament, which is no where ſaid to be for all.] Wherein,
1. The acuteneſſe of the Au…hor diſtinguiſheth betwixt Mediatour betwixt God and man, and Mediatour of the New Teſtament, which I would have made cleare.
2. Affirmeth that Chriſt in dying and ranſomeing is not a Mediatour of the New and better Teſtament, but that this belongs to his Advocation, not Oblation; which I would have him to prove. Heb 9.15. ſeems to ſpeak otherwiſe: [He is the Mediatour of the New Teſtament, that by meanes of death,] where his dying evidenceth him a Mediator of a better Teſtament.
3. Whereas he ſaith, [The advocation of Chriſt is not ſaid to be for all men,] is to deſtroy his owne words, and grant the aſſumption, which he hath all this while been ſo ſtrongly oppugning; and this I grant, and conclude that becauſe his advocation is not generall, his obligation was not; both are of like extent; and whether he hath overthrowne or rather eſtabliſhed the argument, I leave to any to judge, and it ſtandeth firme thus. Thoſe for whom he would not pray, he would not die; but he would not pray for every Son of Adam. Ergo, he would not die for every ſon of Adam.