Romes Ruin(1), Answer · Paragraph 5 – Paragraph 6
PARAG. V. Concerning the perpetuity of the true church, and her immunitie from all fundamentall 'errours in poynts necessarie to salvation.
CHALENGE.
Whence we say it followeth, that not for six hundred years only, as many protestants grant, there was a true church free from spot of errour: but likewise in all ages following there ever wa…, and must be such a church, in the union whereof all might be saved.
Answer.
That from the creation of the first Adam and his consort, till the comming of the second Adam to judgement, there hath been and shall continue a true church in the world, to which all that belong to Christs kingdom may and ought to repair for the means of salvation, we doubt not. And of this church we believe, that though it consist of men subject to error, as well in doctrin as in practise: yet that it is so preserved, by the spirit of truth promised by Christ, from all fundamentall errours in points necessarie to salvation, that Io. 14. 16. 2…. &c. 16. 13.neither the militant and visible church universally, nor any true member thereof finally, shall ever be stained with any spot of such errour. But errours of lesse dangerous consequence which may be called pulvisculi, navuli, or aspergines, spots indeed, but not stains, the visible church upon earth hath seldom or never been free from. For to let passe the first six hundred years, because on both sides we rather appeal to them, than any way appeach them. Beda, who flourished in the year 730. bemoans the state of the church; saying, every man seeth with wet eys how the state of the church daily grows worse and worse; and well might he complain in such sort, for, Genebrard a popish chronicler confesseth, that in succeeding Ex Wolfio. cp. ded. videt quis que non sine lachrymis rem indignā, quantum ecclesiae status ad pejora quotidie & infima devolvatur. Geneb. chron. l 4. ad an. 901: per annos fere centum quinquaginta, a Iohanne scilicet actavo, qui Nichola… & Adriano secundo sanctis pontificibus successit, usque ad Leonem nonum, qui primus a deo vocatus (velut alter Aaron) antiquam pontificum integritatem è coelo in sedem apostolicam revocavit à virtute majorum prorsus defecerunt, apotactici, apostaticive potius quam apostolici. Benn, card. Sella pontificia terribiliter dei nutu scissa est in plures partes; ut manifeste daretur intelligi sessores illos pontificis sedem & ecclesiam Christi crudeliter dissipare. Lamb. Zizania totum sacri gregis corpus quasi tabe quadam infecerunt. Otho. R…ma crevit in divitiis & potentia, decrevit in veritate & justitia. Ioachi. l. de concord. disserit qu… …nge aliena sit omnis hodierna religio aforma primitivae ecclesiae; & sup. Esa. ecclesia senesc…s, sicut Solomon, idol…latrica factaest.times, from Iohn the eighth, till Leo the ninth, all that sate in the apostolike chair, fell away from the vertue of their auncestours, & deserved rather to be termed apotacticall and apostaticall than apostolicall. And after the thousand year, when satan was let loose, even till the happie reformation of the church by Martin Luther, let us heat what the witnesses of the truth in their severall ages have deposed touching the church failings, especially in the western parts.
In the year 1050. Benno writeth, that the popes chair was fearfully cut into more parts; and that prodigie boded that those popes who were to sit in it should miserably rend the church of Christ.
In the year 1078. Lambertus Geasonburgensis writeth, that tares ran over the whole field of Christ, and that the whole body of Christs flock pined away in a consumption.
In the year 1160. Otho Frisingensis observeth, that Rome grew in wealth and power, but decayed in truth and justice.
In the year 1200. Ioachimus, a religious Abbat discourseth, how far the religion practised in his time differed from the form and manner of the primitive church, and how the church now growing old, like Solomon, fell into idolatri….
In the year 1290. Robert Gallus had a vision, wherein he saw a Gallus. Vidi pontificem missam peragentem capite arido & macilento, acsi esset ligneum; & dixit spiritus ad me, hoc ecclesiae Romanae statum significat. ubertinus. hodierna ecclesia dicitur nova Babylon, quia est meretrix magna, quia verus cultus & amor sponsi sui Iesu est turpiter adulteratus, & spiritus justorum hujus temporis supra modum opprimitur, & velit nolit in mult is ejus actibus meretrici servire compellitur. Occham; op. n… nagint, dierum. ut intentum suum horrendum ad finem perducere possint, defendentes veritatem per sequuntur, interimunt innoxium sanguinem fundunt; quique hoc faciunt sunt ipsi qui videbantur regere & docere populum, ipsi ponti fices, egressa est enim iniquitas è Babylone. Gerson. negare non possum multa inter christianos simplices sub specie religionis introducta esse, quorum sanctior esset omissio: Plat damnat mandata Christi qui se ejus vicarium dicit, & …redentes in verba dei e…urit: & beu miseram certe condition…m coecorum hominum; qui, quia contra conscientiam in errore persistunt, se…pso… in aternum c…itium prosternunt!pope saying masse with a lean, meagre, and dry head, like as if it had been made of wood; and the spirit said unto him, this signifieth the state of the Roman church.
In the year 1304. Ubertinus a Casali chargeth the Roman church with grosse and foul adulterie: the present church is called new Babylon, which is the great whore, because the true worship and love of her spouse Iesus is fouly corrupted in her, and the spirit of righteous men in this time is oppressed above measure, and is compelled, will they, nill they, in many things, to serve the where in her unclean acts.
In the year 1320. William Occham thus declaimeth against the popes tyrannie and crueltie in wasting the church of God, and suppressing the truth; the bishops who now seem to govern and teach the people of God, that they may compasse their wicked ends, persecute those that defend the truth, even to death, and shed innocent blood.
In the year 1370. S. Brigetta describeth the miserable state of the church in her days, in her writings extant in Bibliotheca patrum.
In the year 1416. Gerson the famous chancellor of Paris inge…ously confesseth, that many corruptions and abuses were brought into the church under the colour of religion, which it were far better and more pious to omit, than retain.
In the year 1460. Platina brandeth Christs vica… with crueltie against the true servants of Christ. He, which calleth himself Christs vicar, condemneth Christs commands, and burneth them that believe in his words.
And in the life of Bennet the eighth he breaketh out into a bitter exclamation of the guides of the people in his time. O the miserable condition (saith he) of these blind men; who, because they persist in errour against their conscience, cast themselvs into everlasting perdition!
He that is not satisfied with this taste, may glut himself if … please, with store of such bitter fruit gathered to his hand by the author and supplementer of Catalogus testium veritatis, especially in the 14 centurie, and Petrus de Alliac… de planctu curiae Roman…, and de reformatione ecclesiae, and Wicelius method concord.
PAR. VI. Touching the visibility and invisibility of the church in a different notion.
CHALLENGE.
For to say (as some protestants do) the church was long invisible (besides that it is contrary to many clear prophecies and predictions of the old testament) it barreth the heathen of necessary means to salvation, whilst he seeketh not the true church with which to joyn h…ds: and amongst christians this invisibility supposed, it were very hard to hold communion with her in the administration of the sacraments.
Answer.
What protestants affirm that the catholike visible church, to wit, the company of those who professe the true christian faith, was a long time invisible? We deny that the church was ever driven to such straights, or reduced to such a paucitie or obscuritie (much lesse invisibility) but that new proselytes might have accesse unto her, and her own members communicate with her in the pledges of salvation, though not always without danger to their persons and estates. And therefore when you fight against an invisible church professing christianity, you fight also against an invisible adversary, and pursue your own fancie, as Antipho in Aristotle imagined that he drave his own image in the ayr before him. Of this see more at large in the Preface.