Answer to a Popish Antichristian Catholic, Offer 4
The fourth Offer.
Offerer.
Fourth. Let the Proteſtants make ſufficient proofe by auncient writers of the Eccleſiaſtiall hiſtories, what church it is, that al theſe fifteene hundreth yeeres paſt, hath continued through out firme and ſtedfaſt, while all other conuenticles and cōgregations, as well of Arians, as of the Neſtorian,, Maniches, Nouatians, Vigilians, Iouinians, and the reſt of Heretikes of all ſortes, hauehave decayed, bin conuinced and ouerthrowne, and that by any other Church, then by the common knowne Catholique church of Chriſt, and I ſhall then yeelde and recant, and not before.
Crowley.
It is very true, yt the knowne Catholike church hath bin, and ſtill is, as for theſe fiftéene hundreth yéeres laſt paſt; it hath bin, the meane that God hath vſed, in the conuinſing & ouerthrowing of Arians, Neſtorians, and the reſt of ye Heretikes that you ſpeake of. It is moſt true alſo, yt the ſame Catholike church hath all this time, continued firme and ſtedfaſt: but how can you prooue yt your popiſh Catholike church is that knowne Catholike church of Chriſt, that you ſpeake of? Héerein lieth ye difficulty. It is not enough for you to ſay, yt your romiſh church is the Catholike church: but you muſt prooue it. Your antiquity, your vniuerſality, & your vnity, with your continuall ſucceſſion of Biſhops, will not ſerue your turne.
Your antiquity is not ſo auncient as ours by 4600. yéeres (almoſt.) For ours began in Adam, & hath continued euer ſince: & yours began to floriſh in ye daies of Phocas the Emperor, ye murdred Mauricius, & his wife and children, & was the firſt that gaue ye title of vniuerſall biſhop, to Bonifacius the 3. then biſhop of Rome. And this was 600. yéeres after the birth of our ſauiour Chriſt. Your church was in hatching, the later 300. yéeres of the 600. but neuer perfected before Phocas time, Wherefore your antiquity is nothing.
Your vniuerſalitie was neuer ſo large as the Romain Empire, your vnity diuided, into moe ſects then euer the heathen Philoſophers were. Your ſucceſſion of Biſhops, is ſuch that no man can iuſtly prooue yt Peter was the firſt, nor that euer hee was Biſhop of Rome. Or if hée were Biſhop of Rome, no man can certainely ſay how longe he was there Biſhop, nor who it was that was the next Biſhop after him. And by the teſtimony of your owne Hyſtorians: ſome in the ſucceſſion of your Biſhops, were as wicked men as euer liued vponupon earth: and one was a woman, & an arrant whore. And biſides all this: your Apoſtolike ſeate of Rome that you bragge ſo much of, hath bin voyde, for the ſpace of one, yea, two yeeres togither & more. You hauehave had alſo, two: yea, three Popes at one time, and much blood hath bin ſhed about the triall of their titles.
But our vniuerſality is (and euer hath bin) as large as the whole world: yea, when in the iudgement of men of the beſt ſorte, our Church ſeemed to bée cleane rooted out, as in the daies of king Achab it ſéemed to bée in the kingdome of Iſraell: yet had God his number knowne vntounto him, although not knowne vntounto men. And therefore, when Elias complayned, and ſaid, The children of Iſraell hauehave forſaken thy couenant, they hauehave ouerthrowne thine alter, they hauehave ſlaine thy prophets, I alone doo remaine, and they ſeeke after my life. 3. Reg. 19.3. Reg. 19. Then did the Lord anſwere, and ſaide vntounto him, I hauehave reſerued for my ſelfe 7000. men that hauehave not bowed their knees to Baall. As then, and there: ſo at all times and in all places, the Lord hath had, hath ſtill, and ſtill will hauehave (in deſpight of all Turkiſh and Popiſh enimies) his number, knowne vntounto him ſelfe, & that number is his Catholique & knowne church. And this church hath God made able at all times, to conuince all hereſies and Heretikes. And at this day hée dooth, & for euer hereafter hee will, make the ſame church able to conuince, all turkiſh & popiſh Heretikes & Hereſies: although not by the ſword, yet by the word, as at this day, you (M. Offerer) and all your popiſh Catholique brethren, may ſée, if you hauehave eyes to ſée, & willes to conſider of that which you doo and muſt néedes ſée.
Our vnitie alſo, in the ſubſtance of religion, is the ſame that was taught by the Patriarches, by the Prophets, and by Ieſus Chriſt, and his Apoſtles: and was by the firſt Chriſtians that were in Roome, and in the reſt of the Citties that then were vnderunder the dominion of the Romane Emperours, receiued, holden and profeſſed. That is, with one full conſent, wée beléeue, hol…e and confeſſe all the Articles that are conteyned in the three Créedes: namely, the Apoſtles Créede, the Nicene Creede, and the Créede of Athanaſius. We beléeue as S. Paule hath taught the Epheſ. to beléeue: that there is but one Lorde, one faith, one Baptiſme, one God and Father of all, which is aboue all,Ephe, 4. and in vsus all. Ephe. 4.
Our ſucceſſion of Biſhops, is ſuch as the ſucceſſion of the Prophets was. We make no account of that ſucceſſion of Biſhops in Rome, which you doo bragge ſo much of (for the Scribes and Phariſies might hauehave bragged of ſuch a ſucceſſion as well as you doo, and might hauehave ſayd to our Sauiour Chriſt as you do to vsus, where was your Goſpel 400. yéeres paſt?) But we doo make account of that ſucceſſion wherein God hath in his good times, ſtirred vp ſome in the ſpirite of Elias, to deale in doctrine with men of all ſortes: as Elias dyd with Achab, and the Iſralities, and as Iohn Baptiſt dyd with Herode, and with the Iewes in his time. The high Préeſtes had theyr ſucceſſion euen from Aaron, as your Popes hauehave had from Peter: ſome of them aſſpiring to that eſtate by one ſiniſter meane and ſome by an other, as by the Hiſtories it appeareth. But in the meane while, God ſtirred vp Prophets but now and then: for the worde of God was precious in the dayes of Elie the high Préeſt, when the Lord ſtirred vp Samuel to bee a Prophet. And when Iohn Baptiſt was ſtirred vp: there had béene no Prophet amongſt the Iewes, for the ſpace of many yéeres together. This was the execution of Gods iuſt iudgement vponupon the Iewes, becauſe they had not regarded thoſe Prophets which he had ſtyrred vp amongſt them. In like manner, in the time that hath béene ſince the Incarnation of our Sauiour Chriſt, becauſe men had giuen ouer themſelues to beleeue lies, & did not regard the trueth. God tooke from them ſuch as had laboured to leade them in the waie of trueth, and gaue them ouer to the efficacie of error. Yea béeing wilfully blinde: hee gaue them blinde guides that might leade them the right way into the ditch of diſtruction.
Thus you may ſée, if you hauehave a luſt to behold the truth: that not your new found Popiſh Catholique Church, but our moſt auncient Chriſtian Catholique Church, is that Church that hath continued thoroughout firme and ſtedfaſt whiles all other couenticles and congregations aſwell of Arians. &c, as of Mahumetans and Popiſh Antichriſtians, and the reſt of Heretickes of all ſortes, hauehave decayed and béene conuinced, and ouerthrowne, and that by none other Church, then by the knowne Catholique Church of Chriſt, builded vponupon the rocke Chriſt, which Peter confeſſed. Math. 16.Math. 16. And vponupon none other foundation. Wherefore I doo require you now to yéelde and recant according to your promiſe.