An Answer to Six Reasons of Thomas Pound, Part 4
The fowrth Reaſon.
YOur fowrth Reaſon is, for that by appealing to the Scripture, we ſeeme (as you ſay) to giuegive men lybertie to denie all vnwritten verities, which we hauehave receyued of the Church, eyther by expreſſe definition, in generall Councell, or but by tradition. &c. And firſt, you delyght your ſelfe with a frumpe at Crowley and his fellowes, that wil laugh (as you ſay) ſo ſoone as they heare of vnwritten verities. And it ſéemeth that you perſwade your ſelfe that you hauehave done it verie finely. And therfore I hauehave named this Reaſon of yours Fā taſticall.
But yet a little to temper our follie (you will not ſay our pride) you will aſke vsus how we prooue the Trinity of perſons, and the vnitie of ſubſtaunce in the Godhead, by expreſſe Scriptures. &c.
Nine verities we muſt prooue by Scriptures, which are not (as you ſay) written in the Canonicall Scriptures. Well, to ſtaie your wiſdome, I wyll (by Gods mercifull aſſiſtance) doo what may be done in this matter. And I hope to prooue as many of them, as be neceſſary to be knowne to ſaluation: euen by plaine ſcriptures. And the reſt. I hope I ſhall be able to prooue, in ſuch ſort as the Fathers hauehave prooued them, againſt ſuch as hauehave at any tyme denied them. And firſt, I muſt prooue, that in the Godhead, there be thrée diſtinct perſons, and but one ſubſtaunce. This and the ſecond, that is, that in Chriſte there be two diſtinct Natures, and but one perſon: I thinke I ſhall eaſily prooue.
The Prophet Dauid, hath written thus. Pſal. 110. The Lord hath ſayde to my Lord,Pſal. 110. ſyt thou at my right hande, tyll I make thine enimies thy foote ſtoole. The Lord ſhall ſend out of Sion, the Scepter of thy power, beare thou rule in the myddes amongſt his enimies. Thus much in the two firſt verſes. And in the fift verſe he ſayth thus. The Lord at thy right hand, hath wounded euen Kinges in the day of his wrath.
That the Prophet Dauid, dyd in theſe verſes of this Pſalme, ſpeake of the diuine Maieſtie, and of the ſecond perſon Chriſt: it is manifeſted by that which S. Mathew writeth in his twenty and two Chapt. Vos quid dicitis de Chriſto? cuius filius eſt? What doo you ſay of Chriſte? whoſe ſonne is he? &c.
The Lord. That is God the Father. Sayde to my Lord. That is to God the Sonne. &c. Héere hauehave we two diſtincted perſons, the Father, and the Sonne. And in the ſeconde verſe, he ſayth: The Lorde ſhall ſend out of Sion, the Scepter of thy power, which is, the worde of the Goſpell. And this Scepter was ſent out of Sion by the holy Ghoſte, in the feaſt of Pentecoſte: when he reſted vppon the Apoſtles, in the ſhape of …rie tongues deuided. So that héere we hauehave the thyrde perſon, and ſo conſequently thrée diſtinct perſons. The Father ſayth to the ſonne, ſit thou at my right hand. &c. And the holy Ghoſt ſendeth the word, which is the ſcepter of the power of the Sonne out of Sion. And in the fift verſe he ſayth. The Lorde at thy right hand, ſhall wounde euen Kinges in the day of his wrath. Thus ſpeaketh the diuine Maieſtie: God the Father, God the Sonne, God the holy Ghoſte, one diuine Maieſtie: to the Church of Chriſte hée re milytaunt vppon earth. So hauehave we the vnitie, of the thrée diſtinct perſons in the deitie. And Chriſte him ſelfe, expounding the firſt verſe of this Pſalme to be ſpoken of him ſelfe, dooth a warrant vsus, that he béeing Dauids ſonne after the fleſh, is neuertheleſſe Dauids Lorde, and therefore God. And ſo bothe God and man, and yet but one Chriſte. For be ſayth: What ſay you of Chriſte?Math. 22. Whoſe ſonne is hée?
This might ſuffiſe to ſhewe, that theſe two verities are not vnwritten, as you do terme them. But to ſatiſfie you to the full: looke what S. Mathew hath written, in the laſt Chapter, & laſt words of his Goſpell: reporting the wordes of our Sauiour, who ſayth thus there. All power bothe in heauen and earth, is giuen vntounto me. Goe your way therfore, and teach all Nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, of the Sonne, and of the holy Ghoſt: teaching them to obſerue all thoſe thinges that I hauehave commaunded you. And behold, I am with you euerie day, euen to the ende of the world.
Héere the man Chriſte, receyueth from the diuine Maieſtie, all power, bothe in heauen and in earth: and by that power he giueth commiſſion to his Apoſtles to goe and teache all Nations, and to Baptize them in the name of the Father, of the Sonne, & of the holy Ghoſt. So that héere againe we hauehave thrée diſtinct perſonnes: and their vnitie, in giuing to Chriſte all power in heauen and in earth: and the two natures, in one perſon Chriſte, in that he receyueth all power in heauen and in earth, and giueth commiſſion to his Apoſtles to teach and baptize.
If this will not ſatiſfie you: I refer you to that which S. Austine hath written in his booke,Tom. 3. De Trinit. There ſhall you finde proofe vponupon proofe, that theſe verities are not vnwritten.
The thirde veritie that you ſay is vnwritten, is that God the Father was neuer begotten. It ſéemeth that you hauehave not read S. Peaules Epiſtle to the Epheſians: for if you had, you muſt néedes hauehave ſéene, that this is no vnwritten veritie. Saint Paule writeth thus. Huius rei gratia flecto genua mea, ad patrem Domini noſtri Ieſu Chriſti, ex quo omnis paternitas in coelo & in terra nominatur. Ephe. 3.For this cauſe (ſayth S. Paule) doo I bowe my knées, to the Father of our Lorde Ieſus Chriſte, of whome all Fatherhoode, bothe in heauen and in earth dooth take name. I trow you will not now ſay that this veritie is vnwritten.
The fowrth veritie, that you ſay is not written, is that the holy Ghoſt procéedeth bothe from the Father and the Sonne, as from one fountayne. If you would reade that which S. Iohn hath written: I thinke you would not ſay that this veritie is vnwritten.Iohn. 15. &. 20. Cum venerit paracletus, quem ego mittam vobis a patre, spiritū veritatis, qui a patre procedit: ille teſtimonium perhibebit de me. &c. When the Comforter ſhall come, whome I wyll ſende vntounto you from the Father, euen the ſpirit of trueth, that procéedeth from the Father: he ſhall teſtifie of me. &c. And in the twentie Chapter he ſayth. Haec cum dixiſſet, inſufflauit, & dixit eis: Accipite ſpiritum ſanctum. When he had ſpoken theſe wordes, he breathed vponupon them, and he ſayde vntounto them: Receyue ye the holy Ghoſt. &c. If breath may be ſayde, to procéede from the perſon that breatheth: then may we ſay, that it is written, that the holy Ghoſt procéedeth from Chriſte, the ſonne of God, euen as it is written, that he procéedeth from God the Father.
I wyll be bolde therefore, without any more a doo, to conclude, that theſe fowre verities, are not vnwritten, but written in déede in the Canonicall Scriptures.
The fift vnwritten verity, is the deſcending of Chriſt into hell: this you muſt hauehave prooued by plaine wordes of Scripture, the lacke whereof (as you ſay) hath cauſed many, nowe a dayes to deny it flatly. I am none of them that doo ſo deny it. But that he deſcended in ſuch manner, as your Catholiques hauehave taught, and as it hath bene ſet foorth in their Stage Playes, and in their payntinges in glaſſe windowes, & elſe where, I thinke would be as harde a thing for you to prooue, any way, as for vsus to prooue by plaine wordes of Scripture, that he dyd in déede deſcende into hell.
I thinke you wyll graunt that the ſpéeche vſed in the Créede, concerning Chriſtes deſcending into hell, is figuratiue, vſed by the figure Synecdoche: wherein the whole is vnderſtanded in the parte. For you wyll not (I thinke) ſay, that Chriſtes body went into hell: For that was buried and reſted in the graue, tyll the tyme that it was reſtored to lyfe againe. Well. Then it was his ſpirite, that deſcended into hell… and not his body and ſpirite bothe. This being graūted (as I think, you wyll not deny to doo) we ſhall eaſily prooue, euen by plaine wordes of the Scripture, that Chriſte deſcended into hell.
Saint Peter, in the thirde Chapter of his firſt Epiſtle,1. Pet. 3. ſayth thus. Quia et Chriſtus ſemel pro peccatis mortuus eſt, iuſtus pro iniuſtis: vt nos offeret Deo, mortificatus quidem carne, viuificatus autem ſpiritu. In quo & his qui in carcere erant ſpiritibus veniens, praedicauit. &c. For euen Chriſte (ſayth Saint Peter) dyd once dye for ſinnes, the iuſte for the vniuſte, that he might offer vsus vntounto God: mortified in the fleſhe indéede, but quickened in the ſpirite, in which ſpirite, comming to thoſe ſpirites that were in priſon: he dyd preach vntounto them. Nowe, I thinke you wyll ſay, that I hauehave prooued by plaine words of Scripture, that Chriſte deſcended into hell.
But howe great a matter were it, If this might not be prooued by any playne Scripture: ſéeing the Nicene Créede (vſed in your Maſſe) maketh no mencion of it.
And Damaſus, that was Biſhop of Rome. 360. yéeres alter Chriſtes aſcencion, when Iulianus the Apoſtata was Emperour, hath in his Créede no worde of it. And yet he concludeth his Creede with theſe wordes. Haec lege, Ieroni. Tom. 4.haec crede, haec retine, huic fidei animam tuam ſubiuga: & vitam conſequeris & premium a Chriſto. That is: Reade theſe wordes, beléeue them, holde them faſte, yoake thy ſoule to this Faith: and thou ſhalt obtayne of Chriſte, bothe life and reward.
I note this, becauſe I ſée that you ſhoote at this marke. To binde vsus, eyther to prooue all your vnwritten verities by Scripture: or elſe, for lacke of ſuch proofe, to beleeue (as true) whatſoeuer your Catholique Church ſhall allowe for trueth, although the ſame be neuer ſo vnneceſſarie to be prooued, or receyued for trueth.
Your ſixt vnwritten veritie, is the cuſtome of Baptizinge Infauntes. For this, I néede not to wryte much.Mark. 10. Our Sauiour Chriſte hath ſayde: Suffer little Chyldren to come to me, and forbidde them not: For to ſuch dooth the kingdome of God belong. And Saint Paule ſayth: That the Children of beléeuing Parents, are holy.1. Cor. 7. Therefore they are not to be holden from Baptiſme: more then the Iewes children from Circumciſion.
Your other thrée whyes are ſcarce worthy the aunſwering. Why ſhould we kéepe the Sunday now at all▪ and not the Saturday? Why ſhould we not abſtaine now ſtyll, like Iewes, from ſtrangled meates, as the Apoſtles decreed? And why may not any Heretike, deny all the thrée Créedes. &c.
The firſt of theſe whyes, ſhall be aunſwered with an other why.Mark. a. As why may not the Church of Chriſtians, being Lordes of the Sabaoth, chuſe for their Sabaoth, one daye in ſeuen, euen that daye, the obſeruing whereof, they ſhall ſée to ſerue beſt for theyr owne edification? And why did the Apoſtles (as it maye be gathered, by that which Saint Iohn hath written in his Reuelation)Apoc. 1. chuſe the firſt daye of the wéeke to be theyr Sabaoth, and not the laſte? And why doo you not remember that Saint Paule dooth number the Sabaoth amongſt ſuch indifferent things, as are Meates and Drinckes,Collo. 2. Feſtiuall dayes, and new Moones: which were but ſhadowes of thinges to come? &c.
And to your ſecond why, I ſay that the Apoſtles ſaw, that it was neceſſarie for the tyme, to forbydde thoſe Chriſtians, that then lately had bene Heathen men: to ſéede vpō ſtrangled or blood. And néeded not to abrogate it afterwarde,Acts. 15. when they were further inſtructed, and knew how to vſe the Chriſtiā lybertie without offence. A man might meruayle, why any wiſe man, would mooue ſuch a why as this.
Your thirde, & laſt why, may be fully aunſwered with theſe wordes. Becauſe there is no thing in thoſe thrée Créedes: that may not eaſily be prooued by the Scriptures. And thus are all your whyes aunſwered.
But, doo you not marke, howe theſe bedlem Catholiques, would ſhake the foundation of our Chriſtian fayth: by bynding vsus to beléeue, that Chriſtes Catholique Church hath ſet foorth (as infallibly true) and to be beléeued vnderunder paine of dampnation) three Créedes, the Articles whereof, they are not able to prooue by the Scriptures? doo not theſe blinde guides (thinke you) leade vsus a trym daunce, towardes ſhameles error and ignorauuce? And thus much to your fowrth Reaſon, which for good cauſe I hauehave called, Fantaſticall. Bothe, for that it ſéemeth that you perſwade your …elwfe, that you handle your ſelfe verie finely, in all that you write therein: and alſo, for that you hauehave vttered nothing therein, that may not well ſéeme to ſpring out of a fantaſticall head.