A Second Reply to an Answer Made by Doctor Whitgift Part 1, Reply 25

A Second Reply to an Answer Made by Doctor Whitgift Part 1 · Reply 25

p. DCXXXIIIThe maintenance of the reply to the Biſhop off Saliſb. anſwer towching certein Articles againſt the D.

Chap. 4. Diuiſ. 1. pag. 422.

THat the Biſhop is directly againſt the D. in affirming that there be no Apoſtles, Euangeliſtes, or Prophetes, pag. 424.ys manifeſt. his ſhift wherewith he would accord him ſelf with the biſhop: is is before bewraied. That the taking away off the Apoſtels / Prophetes / and Euangeliſtes / hindreth In Tra. 3. pag. 229.not the perfect nomber off preaching miniſters hath bene declared: beſide p. DCXXXIIIIthat yt is groſſe to ſay that the diuiſion is not perfect becauſe certein partes of it are not now extant: as if the law of deuiding extended not it ſelf to thinges both paſt / and to come. He that parteth the church into that before: and vnderunder the Goſpell: doth he therfore make an euill particion / becauſe there is now no church before the Goſpell / that is / vnderunder or before the law? Here the D. leaueth Diuiſ. 3. Pag. 424.the biſhop to his owne defenſe / towching that he affirmed a biſhop not conteined in the place to the Epheſ. The diuiſion there being giuen (as hath beue ſaied) off thoſe miniſters onelyonly vvhichwhich vvith gouernement handle the vvord: both here / and in the fift diuiſion the D. doth but trifle in the examples off the elder and deacon: ſeing we hould / and will (God willing) ſhewe them not to hauehave to doo with the word. Wher hereuppon he woulde bring in his archbiſhop, and archdeacon: yt is but repetition off that aain di. 18. 19. pag. 309. &c.before / where he hath āſwer. Yf there be a preaching elder, not cōteined vnderunder a Paſtor: ſeing he maketh a Paſtor. and Doctor all one (onles he fly to his phanſie off Apoſtles / &c.) there is by his ſaying a preaching miniſterie / not tawght in the ſcripture. If there be / let him ſhew it.

Where I gaue the Catechiſing vntounto the Paſtor: I will hauehave it ment where there is no Doctor: otherwiſe I hauehave in the ſecond Diuiſ. 4. pag. 425.edition amended that / aſſigning yt as more proper to the D. So that the Doctor being inſtituted to the Epheſ. he whom they called Catechiſt / which tawght the groundes off religion / ys likewiſe: albeit S. Pa. calleth al māner of preaching Cathechiſing. Gal. 6. 6.Gal 6:6That publike reading in the church is as ſolēne a matter as Catechiſing the youth, is a peece off the former phrenſie (reading is as good as preaching) already confuted. That a reader hath bene counted neceſſarie is ſaied withowt proof: and if it were / it was falſly counted: there being no neceſſarie miniſtrie not ſpecified in the ſcripture. And when they were firſt / notwithſtanding them / the church miniſtrie was (as hath bene ſhewed) deuided into biſhops / elders / and deacons: ſo that they came not then ſo much as into account of the miniſtries. Yf they be conuenient at any time: that there is ſcripture to warrant them / euen as the Sexten that kept the church dore key hath bene **In the 1. Tract.ſhewed. That the archbiſhops, archdeacons, and our p. DCXXXVbiſhops hauehave no ſuccour by this / being ſuppoſed the principaleſt miniſteries / and therfore ſuch as owght to hauehave bene commaunded: hath bene likewiſe diſputed / where thes colewortes are anſwered. In this Tract. c. 1.That the Deaconſhip as I take yt is no gouernement, but a ſimple ſeruice, is idly alledged / cōtrary to nothing here ſet downe. Yt may ſeeme againſt that alledged before / where I comprehend it under the miniſters which gouerne onelyonly: which I did not to ſet it in 36. din. pag. 816.in the ſame kinde off gouernement with the elders / but for that yt ordering the church money / and ouerſeing the poore / might in a generall ſignification be ſo called.

If the D. can ſhew one lettre / that I euer wrote or ſpake / that the place to the Epheſ. conteineth all thinges neceſſarie for the church: Diuiſ. 6. pag. 426.then this that he writeth may hauehave place. If not: then he is vnworthy to receiue anſwer / ſeing he hath bene gyuen to vnderſtand / how far we extend that place. Therefore whether there were Publike churches, Pulpits, Schooles, vniuerſities in Chriſtian congregations, perteineth not to the queſtion / althowgh it hath partly / and might further be ſhewed: onelyonly I gyue the reader warning that Iudg. …. off thoſe ſaied to handle the pen, whileſt I gaue to much credit to tranſlations / was not ſo fitly alledged / to proue vniuerſities. The three next diuiſ. are idle repetitions / before anſwered. Where I ſhewed that one high prieſt vvas ordeined ouer the Ievves, onelyonly that he might repreſent our S. Chriſt, cheif off Diuiſ. 10. pag. 428.the vvhole church: the D. anſwereth / he was alſo for policie, and gouernement. His reaſon (our Sauiour Chriſt came not to take away eccleſiaſticall policie) …s vaine: as thowgh there could be no eccleſiaſticall policie / onles one miniſter were ruler ouer a whole nation. After he citeth Caluin in the ſame faithe he is wont. For his wordes (no reaſon compelleth to extend that to the vvhole vvorld profitable in one nation) are onelyonly vnderſtanded off that gouernement in Iury before our Sau. Chriſtes coming. which ys manifeſt in that he ſaith / that example ovvght not to be follovved, conſidering it vvas doon in reſpect that the high prieſt vvas a Inſtit. lib. 4. ca 6. ſ…. 2.figure off our Sauiour Chriſt, and the prieſthood being translated that right is likevviſe. And after: that example off the prieſtes p. DCXXXVIgouernement ouer the whole nation / vvas but for a time.ibid. ſe. 3.

That the preſsing off the example off the high prieſt amongeſt the Ievves, dravveth a Pope: I leaue to be conſidered off that before written: eſpecially ſeing the high prieſt was not onelyonly gouernour off the Iewes / when they were pa…ed in the land in 31. diu. pag. 380 Act. 2. 4.Acts 2:4off Canaan: but euen then alſo when (as it is knowen) they were ſcattered thorowgh owt all natiōs in the world. For as S. Luke ſaith it to hauehave bene / immediatly after the aſcenſion off our Sau. Chriſt: ſo was it many yeares before his coming into the world. So that he which will frame an Archbiſhop by that example / eſtabliſheth the Eccleſiaſticall charge off one / ouer thoſe which were ſcattered thorowghowt all the corners off the earth. It would be alſo obſerued / how here the D plaieth on both handes. For when we reaſon ſometime onelyonly off the proportion off the law to the goſpell / other ſometime off the perpetuall law off God: we receiue anſwer that we are Iewiſh ennemies to the libertie of the church. But where there is any thing vnderunder the law / coming within a furlong off his cawſe: he gripeth it for goſpellike / and which owght to be folowed. I ſee / that M. Nowel thincketh a Metro poltane may be ouer a Chriſtian prouince, as the high prieſt was ouer the Iwes: wherin / I can be but ſory that all the Godly learned / are not off one mind. As for Hyperius, he ſeemeth to reaſon vponupon a ſuppoſition: that yf the example off the gouernement off the high prieſt vnderunder the law ſhould be folowed (which he before denied): that then a man might conclude an Archbiſhop ouer a Prouince / but not a Pope ouer the whole churche. This to be his meaning I thinck the D. him ſelfe will accord me: els let him tel me what to Hypperili. 3 meth Thed.anſwer to him / that ſaith: that yt is not red in the ſcripture / that euer any off the Apoſtels / toke vntounto him ſelf autority or primacy ouer thother Apoſtels / but that a moſt perfect equality is ſhewed to hauehave bene in all: that Chriſt did preſcribe them equall offices in all thinges: that that māner of dominion which was not in thappoſtles Hypperius 4 lib. de ratione ſtud. Theolog.time owght not to hauehave bene admitted in the ages which followed. Likewiſe what he will anſwer to him / which condemneth as new found orders Archdeacons Archelders and vicares. Wherof the 2. firſt hauehave (as I haueſhewed) better teſtimonie of p. DCXXXVIItheir auncientie then the Archbiſhop: and are / yf not off the ſame birth / yet off the ſame kinde that he.

Where I ſhew the titles of cheif off the Synagoge, of the Diuiſ. 11. pag. 429.Sāctuarie, of the hovvs of god, to make directly againſt him, cō ſidering that particular churches are novv in ſteed off thē, and therfore there ovvght to be ſuch not in eueryevery Prouince or dioces but in eueryevery particular cōgregation: the D. as amazed ſpeaketh he can not tell what. Firſt / that the Iewes had particular Synagoges, as we particular congregations, and that I hauehave confeſſed that before. As if I had any where denied it: or had not euen here in effect affirmed it: or it helped him for anſwer / which is the ruine off his cauſe. For their Synagoges being the ſame that our particular churches / in eueryevery one off them being not one / but many princes: the vrging off that example / bringeth diuers cheif gouernours / or archbiſhops in eueryevery particular church. Then he ſaith / one Chriſtian commen wealth is but one church, which is vntrue. For firſt althowgh the church be in a Chriſtian commen wealth: yet nether is the commen wealth the church / nor the church the commen weaith as ſhall appeare. Beſides / I hauehave ſhewed that the ſcripture (off whoſe manner off ſpeach the queſtion is) vſeth not to call a Prouince / or dioces / a church: but ether the whole vniuerſall / or els a particular congregation. Thirdly if it were ſo / yet the anſwer is inſufficient. For if the name off the howſe off God / were cōmen as well to a church in a Prouince / as in a particular cōgregatiō: yet what right hath he to pull the eccleſiaſticall prieſthood more to his prouinciall / then to our particular church? He ſaith / the ſuperioritie amongeſt the prieſtes: and Leuites, is by the ciuill law of Moſes. Which declareth him rauiſhed off all iudgement: it being manifeſt that they were ether Ceremoniall / or Eccleſiaſticall lawes / wherwith the Lord diſpoſed of the degrees of the miniſterie: wherof the Ceremoniall being aboliſhed / and therfore the chieftie off one prieſt ouer all / we willingly reteine the eccleſiaſticall.

Where to that alledged off Princes off the families off Leuites, I replied that the Lord vvoulde by thoſe titles as by liuely pictures, imprint in the Ivves vnderſtanding the chieftie off our S. Chriſt: he anſwereth / that maketh nothing againſt their offices. Yes: for p. DCXXXVIIIthat thoſe that would conclude therof / one chief / now amongeſt the miniſters in a Prouince / are therby put to ſilence. Where he addeth / ſo the eſtate off a Prince ouer a land ſhould be aboliſhed: be is friuolous / conſidering that that gouernement / hath other ſtaies off the ordinance off God. Where that chieftie amongeſt the miniſters / hath nothing but that it was ceremoniall. And if my anſwer like him not he ſhall hauehave the biſhops / as litle for his aduantage which ſaith: The Prince of the families doth not ſignifie In 4. Art. Diui. 31.any gouernour, or one endued vvith povver, but onelyonly the firſte and beſt man off the companie. He complaineth that the Biſhop ſpeaking off the name, I driue it to the office. If he had bene awake he ſhould hauehave perceiued / that the ſame reaſon I aſſigned why there was primacie in the miniſtrie off the law / vnmeet for ours: ſerueth alſo to ſhew why they might hauehave the title off Princes / which ours may not. For being the counſeil of God / in that ſuperioritie to peint forth the chieftie off our Sauiour Chriſt: it was moſte conuenient that that ſhoulde be alſo written in the names.

Where I ſhewed the diſtribution off the Leuites offices, Diuiſ. 12. Pag. 430.not made off Dauid, but by expreſſe commaundement off God: he ſaith the Biſhop hath anſwered, that ſuch negatiue argumentes are but weake. So hee bringeth him in anſwering this reaſon after his in tract. 1. di. 1. p. 77death: for in his life it was not propounded. Howbeit I hauehave ſhewed how the argument holdeth: and that the D. ſhift / is Hardinges againſt the biſhop / confuted alſo by the biſhop. Nether did the biſhop condemne here ſimply negatiue reaſons / but that negatiue which ſuppoſed there owght to be no name of archbiſhop / becauſe there was none vnderunder the law: which he might worthely. For I ſhewed that we meane nothing leſſe / then to conclude that / of the preciſe gouernement off the churche vnderunder the law. Nether is mine an argument off one example but of cōpariſon. For if Dauid a figure off our S. Chriſt / a man after Gods owne hart / a Prophet / would not meddle with altering any thing in the miniſtries / withowt Gods word: what man is he that ſhall dare doo yt / withowt the ſame warrant? By the Printers ſmall ouerſight / in putting 1. for 2. the D. hath ſtumbled vponupon p. DCXXXIXa notable, place that Ioſaphat apointed Leuites, &c. for deciding the Lordes cauſes not onelyonly in Ieruſalē, but for the whole countrey, and made Amaries the prieſt chief ouer them: yet no commaundement red of, ſo to doo. Which is vntrw. For Ioſaphat did nothing but commaunded off the Lord by aaDeut. 17 8. &c.Deut 17:8Moſes; that there be in Ieruſalem an Eccleſiaſticall Senate wherof the high prieſt ſhould be chief vntounto which they ſhould reſort in difficult caſes / not able to be voided at home. For otherwiſe bb2. Chro. 19: 5.2 Chr 19:5there was a Senate erected by Ioſaphat in eueryevery ſtrong cytie off Iury.

ccDiui. 13. Pag. 430.The Ievves church vvanted nothing to that perfection, vvherin the Lord vvould hauehave it then, and many thinges vvere vndecided by the expreſſe vvord off God: be friendes / and doo well agree. For both the perfection of yt then / as ours now / ſtandeth: if thinges cōſtāt defined vpō / there be alſo generall rules left in his word / wherby thinges variable by circumſtances / may be compaſſed. ddDiui. 14. pag. 431.In the next reaſon / for cauſes there aſſigned / I will procede no further / but leaue it onelyonly to the readers iudgement: eeDiuiſ. 15. pag. 432.likewiſe whether I hauehave ſhewed / that there were vniuerſities amongeſt Gods people / before our S. Chriſtes time: and whether the D. if he had wherewithall / woulde not contrarie it. That Schooles are ciuill in heatheniſh commen wealthes, and Eccleſiaſticall in Chriſtian: is poore diuinity. for ſo a Schoolemaſter teaching Terē ce / or Profeſſor reading Ariſtotle is become an Eccleſiaſticall officer: which hath nether eccleſiaſticall election / not ordinaciō / and is often choſen onelyonly of him that founded the Schoole. Yea eueryevery one that reacheth to play on inſtrumētes / wherby mē may be apter to ſing the lordes praiſes: is one off the D. Eecleſiaſticall officers. His reaſon (ſchooles are like the firſt nources of the true knowledge off God) ys not good. For beſide that the Fathers howſe is the firſt nource / not the ſchoole: by this reaſon the Father off the howſhold that nourtereth his ſonnes / yea the mother that bringeth vp her dawghters in the feare off God / ſhoulde be eccleſiaſticall officers: which are onelyonly oeconomicall / or houſe gouernours. aaDiui. 16. pag. 432. in Tract: 3. cap. 3.That biſhops can not come in place off thapoſtles / ſeing they were together with the Apoſtles: is vnanſwered. That the D. alledgeth off Apoſtles being biſhops: is ^b before anſwered / althowgh it p. DCXLbe nothing to purpoſe. for to hauehave confuted the replie / he ſhoulde hauehave ſhewed that all biſhops are Apoſtles: where his places be / to proue Apoſtles biſhops. For it followeth not if all Apoſtles were biſhops / that all biſhops ſhould be Apoſtles.

Where I ſhew that Archbiſhops could not come in place off Apoſtles, if they vvere (as Eraſmus ſuppoſeth) in their time; Diuiſ. 17. 433.becauſe they ſhould ſo preuent the time, not vvayting for the Apoſtels death: he anſwereth / where the apoſtels could not be them ſelues, there they appointed other: which is fond. For how followeth / it / that becauſe they appointed others where they could not be them ſelues / therfore they appointed archbiſhops? As if they might not appoint Euangeliſtes: or in eueryevery particular church a Biſhop. Off Biſhops appointed by the Apoſtles / to conclude Archbiſ I hauehave aain 10. d. pag. 304.ſhewed how ſikly it is: likewiſe how that biſhops being the Apoſtles bbin 3. di-pag. 231.ſucceſſours / is to be vnderſtanded. ccDiui. 18. pag. 433.Againſt my reaſons / that there is more libertie in inſtituting thinges in the commen vvealth: here is nothing but bare denials. In anſwering generally off all offices in the commen wealth / a man not vtterly forſaken off his iudgement / muſte needes know that I had anſwered the example off Saul. ddDiui. 19. pag. 434.The anſwer to Chryſoſtome, ys made eein di. 55. pag. 339. & 66. 413before. Where I ſhew that Titus preſidentſhip in ordination off biſhops, implieth not perpetuall gouernement, if it did, yet not to helpe the archbiſhop. yt is the D. part to ſhew / that iudgement and gouernement be all one, ſeing he imagineth it a ſtaffe off his cawſe. But the reader may ſee / that allthowgh the D. kepe open ſhop ſtill: yet his wares are vttered long ſythens. For I beſech yow in this defenſe off the biſhops anſwer / beſides his owne colewortes / and bare repeticion off the Biſhops reaſons / with ſome yeas / and naes: what hath he worthy the inuention of the meaneſt? To the next diuiſ. Further then I hauehave I will not anſwer: the next alſo I leaue to the readers iudgement.

THe Councell off Antioch / repeted here with the commentary is anſwered. Where I ſhew no neede vvith vsus of archbiſhops, CAP. V. Diuiſ. 2. pag. 436.conſidering that the cauſe vvhy they vvere ordeined (to call Synodes and propoūd the cavvſes to be hādled in thē) is ceaſſed p. DCXLIvvith vsus▪ the D. in prouing that Emperours called generall Councells, ſhooteth fayre / but cometh nothing nere the mark. For althowgh ſome prouinciall Councells were called by the Emperour: yet yt is manifeſt both by the Coūcell of Nice and by this I alledged / Cap 5. Can. 20.(that decreed there ſhould be 2. prouinciall Councels eueryevery yeare / wherin the Metropolitan ſhould giuegive vvarning to the reſt / that the biſhops might not hould a coūcell withowt his knowledge) that the Metropolitan vvith the biſhops aduiſe / might hould a Prouinciall Councell. It was doen I graunt / by conſent / and ſometime by expreſſe confirmacion off the Godly Princes: as in other thinges perteining to the miniſtery their autoritie aſſiſted / when men refuſed to come to the biſhops / who were not able to compell them: but the order off it vvas with the Biſhops. This althowgh it were not in the 9. canon, yet whē the D. knew it was in that councell (as appeareth by his preciſe denying off it to be in that canon, vvhere otherwiſe he would hauehave ſaied in that Councell): it appeareth that he vſeth leſſe ſynceritie in thes holy matters / then the Heathen …n their prophane. For Alexander counſeilled Plutarch: in his life foreign.to ſet vponupon Darius in the night / anſwered that he vvould not ſteale the victorie: but the D. concealeth from his reader / euen that which he knew my anſwer muſt needes diſcouer.

Where he ſaith / our metropolitan calleth Synodes, althowgh not prouinciall, and propoundeth the matters: firſt is nothing to the purpoſe. for calling onelyonly dioceſan Synodes / he doth nothing which a ſimple biſhop may not aſwell as he▪ and therfore no cauſe vvhy / there ſhould be an archbiſhop in this reſpect. Secondly / all know that thoſe Synodes he ſpeaketh off / are houlden for the moſte pate by deputies at his appointement. So / that vvhichwhich the D. vtterly condemneth in the Diſcipline vve propounde / touching the chuſing off a preſident eueryevery Synod / is doen here / and that at the plraſure off one man / not by conſente off the myniſters: yea by appointement off one for the moſte parte no Eccleſiaſticall perſon / in matters perteining to the miniſtrie. Thirdly / I would know by what right / the archbiſhop may call his dioceſan Synodes▪ yf by Eccleſiaſticall / then vvhy not alſo the Prouinciall? conſidering that they are of one kinde / ether both Eccleſiaſticall / or both cyuill. Yf he do yt by ciuill autoritie: vvhy doth he not aſwel p. DCXLIIvvaite for the magiſtrates commandement in one / as in the other? He ſaith / the archiſhops office conſiſting in ſondry other thinges beſides calling Synodes, propounding matters, ouerſeing the limites: owght not to ceaſſe althowgh he doo none off theſe. Yt being manifeſte that theſe were the cheife cawſes / vnderunder pretence wheroff he was browght in / and eſpecially to thend that controuerſies / and contentions amongeſt the myniſtrie / by Synodes called / and ordered by him / might he ended: yt muſt follow that if wee may ſpare him for theſe / we may eaſely be with owt him for the reſt: and ſo this is not for the amendement / but for the ouerthrow off his ſuriſoiction. Becauſe wee agree in the matter / and I hauehave before ſhewed that Tract. 4. Diuiſ. 2. pag. 237.the metropolitanes were appointed to ouerſee that none paſſed his boundes: I omit the iniury he dothe in ſuppoſing that I ſend him to the ninth Canon for that matter / when as the word there by all indifferency / owght rather to be referred to the councell in the text / then to the canon in the margent.

Where I ſay that this ouerſight off limites / may be withowt an archbiſhop: he ſayth / yt may be beſte by him: whereoff let the reader vponupon the former allegations off both Sydes / iudge. where he affirmeth yt no good argument againſte the archbiſhop, that he doth not kepe the olde Canons owt off vſe with vsus: ſeing our archbiſhop houldeth off thoſe in times paſt / and hath for his cheifeſt defenſe that there where archbiſhops in times paſte: all ſee / if there be not the ſame cauſes off them now that were then / how at the leaſt this hould is throwne downe. Where I ſhew that our archbiſhop in giuing licences to preach in a douſen dioceſes at the leaſte breaketh the ſame order for the keping vvheroff he vvas ordeined: he anſwereth / yt is profitable. Where beſide the vntruth aaTractat. 3. & 4.before ſhewed / he condemneth that order off the Councell off Conſtantinople / that bbSoc. 5. li … 8.decreed againſt that wandring: and ouerthroweth one off the cawſes wheruppon the metropolitans office ſtandeth. ccDiuiſ. 3. …37.That / parte off the difference of the metropolitan from other biſhops, roſe off the commoditie off the citie, and for that yt vvas honoured vvith the Emperours courte: is manifeſt. by the encreaſe and decreaſe / lifting vp and throwing downe p. DCXLIIIoff the authoritie off the Patriarch all ſeates. That the Emperour might make the metropolitan ſeate which he would, I well vnderſtood, ſeing I ſet it downe ddDiui 20. pag. 3…2.before: but the queſtion to / where yt is meeteſt the Archbiſhop ſhould be / if there muſt be one. And my reaſon was / forſomuche as the place moſte fytteſt / hath well and happely wanted him: therfore our churche may be well without him. His trifling in the two tranſlations / argueth that to fill vp / he careth not if his reader peele ſtrawes: for nothing …ether off them / is againſte that I ſetdowne.

The cauil againſt my order / becawſe I come from the councel of Antioche backe to Cyprian: is too ſimple. For yt is not (as his) for one Diuiſ 4. pag 438.matter / but for diuers; beſide that / I reprehended him for that yt ſkilleth much to obſerue the order off times / when queſtion was off the time / and antiquitie of tharchbiſhop / Whether Cyprians wordes do flatly forbid any one biſhop to hauehave autoritie ouer an other / muche les ouer all: I leaue yt be iudged off that ee3. ca. off this tra.before. **2. c. 2. tr.likewiſe how honeſte an exception yt is againſte this ſentence / that yt was ſpoken in a Councell where an error was decreed: alſo in ff2 ca off this treatiſe.what ſenſe I called Cyprian metropolitan: further how vntrwe yt is that gg3. ca. off this treatiſe.he which denieth the autoritie of one biſhop ouer an other, exempteth the miniſters either from cyuill, or eccleſiaſticall ſubiection, or puniſhement. Laſtly / what a hh2. Tract. 6. cap.cauil yt is / that when the correction of the diſorders in the miniſtrie is gyuen to the cyuill magiſtrat, the prince therby is ouercharged. Now if the reader finde vponupon the diſcourſe before / that the churche well gouerned in Cyprians time / had no archbiſhop nor metrapolitane that had autoritie ouer others / when there was moſte neede / conſidering there was then no chriſtian biſhops: Then yt is manifeſte / that there is now les cawſe / when wee hauehave a Chriſtian magiſtrate: which alledged here by me / the D. him ſelfe (althowgh he had good will to bite at) durſt not come neere.

His cauill that I alledged this canon, falſely attributed vntounto the Diuiſ. 5. pag. 439.Apoſtels, is anſwered: beſide that I ii2. Tract.ſhew that yt being falſely aſſigned to them / is notwithſtanding the true canon off the Councell off Antioche. The Canon is as I hauehave alledged / nothing nether p. DCXLIIIIadded nor diminiſhed, which might diſaduātage the D. cauſe any …ote. whether the biſhop according to that canon / may doo that which apperteineth vntounto his owne pariſh without the archbiſhop: whether the archiſhop taketh matters owt off their handes / concludeth them not making the biſhops prime / contrary to the tenure off that canon (which the D. denieth). I leaue to the readers iudgement / his eſpecially which hath ſeene the marchandiſe / and trafique off his courtes. And it may partly appeare by the boke off the 7…. archbiſhops / where Canterbury is made the head off all our churches, all biſhops ſvvorne to canonicall obedience off that archbiſhop and defenſe off all Priuiledges and liberties of that ſeate▪ Where the biſhop off London is his deane to cal ſynodes, to publiſhe his decrees, to make retourne off thexecution: VVincheſter his Chauncelour, Lincolne his vice chancelour, Saliſburie his chanter, VVorceſter his chaplaine, Rocheſter his croſ bearer when that bagage was. Wher his autoritie is ſaid to hauehave no certeine boundes but almoſt as him ſelfe liſteth with other ſuch archbiſhoplicke / and vnminiſterlike loftines / reckened / and earneſtly auouched / and yet notwithſtanding (as he ſaith) ſparingly touched: to thend belike that it might hauehave an eaſyer defenſe. And if the lord biſhops are his vaſſa…e… the poore miniſters what place ſhall they hauehave?

His repetitions I will not touch. The autoritie out off the Diuiſ. 6. pag. 440counterfaicte Higinus, as I noted him / (that the metropolitan ſhould cōdemne no biſhop before the matter heard, ād diſcuſſed by the biſhops of the Prouince) maketh for vsus more then yf yt had bene out off the true Higinus: conſidering that the archbiſhop in the counterfaicte Higinus time / being growē much our of faſhion / was yet girded in les roume then ours. The like 87. cap.reſtreincte off his autoritie was in the Africane Councell. How fond the D. anſwer is / that our archbiſhop putteth none out withowt due proof, is manifeſt: conſidering that the greateſt monarche that euer was / hath no further autoritie to condemne / then vponupon dew proof. likewiſe what daliance yt is / that he doth nothing but by conſent in 2. Tra. Diuiſ. 1. pag. 170.of al the realme, and therfore off the biſhops: is before declared.

p. DCXLVaaDiuiſ. 7. pag. 440.Where miſſing the nomber off the Canon / I alledged out off the Councell off Antioch / that the metropolitan had not ſo much as the caſting voice, vvhen the biſhops vvere equally deuided: he anſwereth / there is no mention off equalitie off voices, as thowgh he vvere ignorant / that matters in Councells / paſſed by the more parte off voices. Forſomuch therefore as the Councell vppon the diuiſion off the biſhops iudgementes / willeth that other ſhould be called: yt is to be eſtemed that that was / becauſe the biſhops were equally parted. Where he ſaith / therby a metropolitan had autority ouer moe prouinces then one, yt foloweth not. For beſide that the canō is of all metropolitans / ſo that whatſoeuer any off them might doo in an others precincte / that the other might doe in his: by this accounte the elders / yea the Deacons had autoritie ouer the biſhops: conſidering that they accuſed / might call other Councel. 3. carth. cap. 8.biſhops thē their owne. Where he ſaieh / thautoritie of our metropolitā and biſhops, is nothing increaſed but decreaſed, forſomuch as nether he nor all the biſhops can depriue a biſhop withowt the conſent of the Prince, yt is not to purpoſe / ſeing al the biſhops in the world may not / nor euer could off right remoue a biſhop by force / if the Prince vvould kepe him in. Our queſtion is of the eccleſiaſticall ſentence of depoſicion. And if he meane that a biſhop heretike / ſchiſmatike / or corrupte in manners / may not be proceded againſte by an eccleſiaſticall ſentence off depoſition / yea off excommunication (yf the caſe require) onles the Prince vvill conſente: beſide that his endeuour off / flattery is to manifeſte: his meaning is to cut out the archbiſhop ſo / that he ſhall doo nether more nor les then will agree with his eaſe / and wherby he may ſhifte the Croſſe from his ſhoulders. For all know that Chriſtian princes may be / and ſometimes are drawne to fauour thoſe / vvhoſe paſtorall gouernement can not be but harmefull vntounto the churche: in which caſe the Eccleſiaſticall cenſures owght not to ſleepe / to thend that allthowghe he can not be remoued: yet the churche after he be deſcried / and condemned for ſuch as he is / may flie from him. That the biſhop may excommunicate an elder, belongeth to an other tractate: that he may depoſe an elder, is vntrw: and hath appeared in that the councell off Carthage decreed / that an elder accuſed by p. DCXLVI3. Conc. cap. 8.his biſhop, might cal 6. other biſhops, and the deacon three: and likewiſe may by an other / which decreed that being condemned Council. Sard. c. 17off his biſhop ether by right or vvronge, he might appeale vntounto other biſhops. Beſide that / I hauehave ſhewed that he might heare no cauſe withowt his clergie: therfore thoſe condemnations by the biſhop / muſt be vnderſtanded if he be duly / and according to the order preſcribed condemned. He abuſeth alſo his reader / in that he would proue the biſhops autoritie greater / becauſe it was forbidden to thoſe put out by him, to goe to the Emperour. Conſidering that the ſame canon gyueth them remedy againſte the biſhop in a greater aſſembly: yea euen againſte a whole Synode in a more generall then it.

Whether the 4. Firſte principal differences / betwene the biſhops in times paſte and oures now / be trwe, let the reader iudge Diuiſ. 8. pag. 441.off that hath bene alledged. Likewiſe off the fift / vponupon that vvhichwhich hath and ſhall be: againſt which he hath nothing but repetitions. Alſo whether the D knoweth any thing off order, that denieth this to be the place off mentioning the excommunication, in ſuch ſorte as I did. bbDiuiſ. 9. pag. 442.That alledged owt off the Councell of Hiſpalis / touching that the elder ovvght not to preach in the biſhop preſence: is in a ccCouncel Neocaeſar.Councell ſuppoſed more auncient then thr firſte Nicene / likewiſe yt was obſerued in the Africane churches in ddPoſsido. in vita Auguſt.Auguſtines time. And that yt endured vntil the yeare off the Lord 659. when there were …roſſe corruptions, tendeth to further condemnation off our Biſhops / further owt of faſhion in that behalfe / then thoſe degenerat ones. and if this Councell be not to be alledged for the corruptions, then how cometh yt / that Volufianus in the year …65 / a biſhop off a corrupter eſtate / (whoſe maſſe is groſſer / then that off this Councel) is made ſo godly a man? yt is well knowne / that later Councels then this / and therefore (for the moſt part) corrupter: are cited off the godly learned / as teſtimonial traces of the Syncerity in purer times. That the elder by this canon, willed off the biſhop myght preach in his preſence, is vntrw: onelyonly yt is ſaid / that with the biſhops commaundement he might giuegive abſolution to the penitent / which was then (as now with vsus) an other thing p. DCXLVIIfrom preaching. That ther hath bene no time wherin there hauehave bene moe preaching biſhops, then now with vsus: onles all be preachers / is vntrw. ſeing an vnpreaching biſhop was wonte (as M. Cal. proueth Inſtit. 4. l. ca. 4. 3 ſe.(to be a mōſter / and cried owt on in very corrupt times. Yf our biſhops be compared with the Popiſhe in this poincte: they may be thowght dutifull. but diuers compared with biſhops off auncient time / may well be accounted domb. Conſidering their often preaching / the traces wheroff are to be ſeen diuerſly: namely in the Councell off Ments / before by me alledged. Wherunto ſerueth M. Hoopers ſaying / that the churche at the beginning vponupon the eight cō ▪maund.had ſuche biſhops, as did preache many godly Sermons in les time, then our biſhops horſes be a brideling.

Yf the rare preaching off ſome / be but Mens faulte and not the offices: then our Archbiſhops whether off ſyniſtre fauour or as gyltie them ſelues / play their partes euil. Conſidering that diuers faulte openly in this euen the cheif pointe off their office / and hauehave had for any thing I hauehave heard / good peniworthes off yt. Where ſtill appeareth how daungerous yt is to the churche / to lay ſuch weight off the churches welfare in one man. In the next diuiſ. let the reader iudge how vntrw yt is / that there were biſhops off 100. churches in the Apoſtels times. the two next are anſwered. Whether thes deuiſed degrees / were aain the praef. to the 3. ca. of this tr.ſteppes for the Pope to clime vp, let yt be iudged off that alledged: and namely off that in M. bbvponupon Phil. ca. 1.Beza / whoſe iudgement is the ſame with myne here. how this doth not impeache the holy doctrine of the Sonn off God, confirmed in the Nycene Conncell: I hauehave cc2. cap. off this tra. Diuiſ. 15. pag 445. Euſe. li. 1. de vit. Conſt.ſhewed That I doo confeſſe heere the kinde of gouernement by elders to hauehave ceaſſed, or that one Biſhop was ouer a whole dioceſe, before the councell off Nice: ys vtterly vntrue. The next let the reader likewiſe iudge.

Where he ſaith I repeate Baſile the poore metropolitan, and Theodoret the pore biſhop for want off others, let him know that this was the eſtate of the moſt apparāt biſhops at the Nicene councell / whom themperour made ſo much off touching their apparel vile, vile to loke to: of aaAthana. Apol. 2.Athanaſius / which being metropolitane was poore: off bbCoſterius in the life off Ambro.Ambroſe which had no ſuyt of men after him / ād which was in p. DCXLVIIIhis houſhould ſtuf / and reuenewe / poore: of the biſhōp off ccIerō ad Ruſticum Monach.Th… loſe / which was poore. Yea the richeſt by the churche / and by the churche / beſte prouided for: were content with that wherof they might honeſtly / and ſoberly lyue. And where an other off the D. refuges is / that they might hauehave bene riche: yt is trew they with their competent houſhoulde / owght to be honeſtly prouided for / leſte the care ouer the flock ſhoulde be drawne to thinges off this life. I graunte alſo that they may be riche: but I denie that they owghte to growe riche by the miniſtrie. yt owght to ſuffice them as dd1. Cor. 101 Cor 10the Apoſtle ſaith to liue off the goſpell, not eeIer. vponupon Titus. Ier ad Oceanum.to riot, not to hauehave ā lordly eſtate, not to be rich by yt: as yt is both expounded and confirmed off Ierom.

ffDi. 16. 17 pag. 446.Where I ſhewed owt off the auncient gg4. carth. 14. 15. ca. Tyron c. 5Councells / that the biſhops ſhould hauehave a litle houſe nere the churche, their houſhould ſtuf after the common ſorte, table, and diet poore, not gyue them ſelues to feaſting, get their eſtimacion by good conuerſation: he anſwereth one of the councels decreed that the clerckes ſhould get their lyuing by ſome occupatiō, not meete for our daies But it decreed not that the biſhops / or miniſters of the word ſhould doo ſo / but onelyonly Clerkes: in which number were readers / dorekepers / acolouthes / exerciſtes and other ſuch / which hauing light charges in the churche / were faſhioned in the Biſhops howſe to the miniſtrie. Theſe hauing a great part off their lyuing (as ſhall appeare) off that appointed for the biſhops howſe: were commaunded to get the reſte with their handes at ſuch times / as were nether hinderance vntounto their office / nor their further aduauncement in learning: as it is to be ſeene in thoſe Canons. Now if they afters dinners and ſuppers or others tymes wherin they nether executed office nor were ſo fyt to ſtudie / occupied them ſelues in ſome arte / werby they gained parte off their liuing / and thoſe Clerckſhips were needfull: I ſee no great inconuenience in that order. At the leſt in the time and countrie in which the D. would lurke: ther is no difference. If there had bene any material: he owght to hauehave ſhewed yt. for what cauſe can he aſſigne why our biſhops ſhould liue more lordly then thoſe? both liuing in the peace and welth off the church / and vnderunder Chriſtian magiſtrates. p. DCXLIXThey ſowing alſo more liberally then ours / why ſhould they reape more ſcantly? eſpecially ſeing diuers off their Countries were better hable to fourniſhè them off that riot then ours is.

Where alſo he would make men beleue / that they are come to this exceſſe by Chriſtian princes liberalitie, the trewthe is otherwiſe. For they to whome they ſucceded in this princely eſtat: came to this wealth by church robbery. Seinge yt is eaſy to proue / by diuers aſwell giftes off the Emperours an others / as by ſtatutes and prerogatiues (made in fauour off the church): that yt was very riche in time off thoſe biſhops. Therfore that he alledgeth otherwhere for the continuance off theſe large reuenewes to one biſhop, leſt Pag. 471▪our biſhops (as ſome in Auguſtins time) ſhoulde take occaſion of pillag… is abſurd. Yt is highe time that he were (to ſpeake no greuouſ lier) vnbiſhoped: which will take occaſion off pillage / hauing to liue on a hundreth pound a yeare. And as yt is obſcrued that the In the booke intituled the Diſcipline, &c.church goods were committed vntounto the biſhops truſte / to this ende that he taking ſo muche as would honeſtly mainteine him / ſhould beſtow the reſte vponupon diuers other church neceſſities: ſo the ſame appeareth / in that it was aa4. conc. Cart. c. 32 Sozom. lib. 3. c. 9. Athanaſ. 2. Apol.ordeined / that the biſhop ſhould vſe the church goodes as thinges gyuen to him to kepe, and not as his ovvne. Alſo by the examples off Athanaſius and Auguſtine: wher off for the firſt falſly accuſed of the turning away off the corne gyuen to the church vntounto his owne vſe: was anſwered by the Councell aſſembled at the Alexandria / that he had nothing but the trauaile in diſpoſing off yt. The bbAuguſt. Epiſt. …0.other ſhewing how the Donatiſts had not onelyonly their own when they retourned vntounto the church / but alſo off the church goods: addeth that the church goods vvere both theirs and his, ſeing he vvas poore as vvel they. But if (ſaith he) vve poſſeſſe priuatly as muthe as may ſuffice vsus, then the church goods are none of ours, but the poores: off vvhichwhich goods vvee hauehave the ordering, and doo not chalenge them as proper vntounto vsus, vvhichwhich is a damnable abuſe,

Further the biſhops in times paſte for that portion alowed vntounto them / kepte not onelyonly them ſelues and their owne houſhoulde: but nouriſhed in their houſes / and at their tables / the foorſaid p. DCLClerkes: as appeareth in aaPoſſido. invit. Au.Auguſtines example / with whom they were at one table / in one howſe / and off the ſame charges. I leaue the teſtimonie of the bbRoma. cap▪ 3.Councell: that (of the churches goods deuided into 4. partes) gyueth one of them vntounto the biſhop and his brethern. Which althowgh yt be corrupt / and not of the auncientie pretende: dyet in a caſe not in queſtiō / and which hath confirmacion off the former times / I might a great deale better vſe then the D. hath donne his counterfaictes. The teſtimonie off M. ccvpō the eight cōmaund.Hooper ſhall ſuffiſe: who ſaith that the biſhops houſhould vvas the ſchole or treaſurehouſe off good miniſters, to ſerue the vvord off God, and adminiſtration off Sacraments. Thus appeareth that the difference betwene our biſhops / and them in times paſt / is not as is pretended / in that the churches were then poore, and now riche: but partly in that the goods which ſerued before for diuers neceſſary Vſes off the churche / ſerue now to the lording and vnneceſſary ſtatelines off one. Partly alſo in that thoſe biſhops hauing a colledg off ſcholers in their howſes / which were the ſeed and ſtore off the miniſtrie / nourriſhed them at the ſame trencher with them: ours (the Clerkes or ſcholers being thruſt out) deuoure al them ſelues.

And that it is not as (he ſaith) in the circumſtance of time and countrie, Euen as he hath heard godly men in in times paſte / forbidding this ſtately pompe and wealth off biſhops in other ages: ſo he might hauehave red yt forbiddē of thoſe of our age. aaCal. inſt. 4. lib ca. …. ſect. 17.M. Caluin writeth thus: hovv the biſhops in times paſte rioted not in ſuperfluous vvealth: that one voice of the Synod off Aquileia. VVhere Ambroſe vvas preſident (the pouertie of the lords myniſters is glorious) doth ſufficiētly declare. Verely the biſhops had then riches, vvhervvith they might hauehave made the church to hauehave a Sightly porte: yf they had thovvght that that had bene their trvve ornament. But vvhen they knevve that nothing is more contrary to the office of a paſtor, then to ſhine and ſvvell in dayintie fare, coſtly apparel, many ſeruantes, princely palaces: they folovved and embraced humilitie and modeſtie, p. DCLIyea pouertie yt ſelfe, vvhichwhich Chriſt conſecrated amongeſte his miniſters. And after: vvas yt meete that they ſhould folovv the magnificence off Princes in the number off vvaiting men, brauerie of houſes, coſtlines of fare and apparel: vvhoſe life ovvght to hauehave bene a ſingular example off frugalitie, modeſtie, continencie and humilitie? hovv muche did this abhor from their office: vvhom the eternall decre off God forbiddeth to deſire fylthy lucre, and to be content vvith a ſimple kind off liuing: alledging to that purpoſe the canons off the Carthage Councel / which I hauehave ſet downe: and ther to calling the biſhops of theſe times / which notwithſtanding the D. ſaith were for thoſe times.

He might alſo hauehave red off the godly learned with vsus: which condemne yt flatly / in our both countrie / and age. For the knowledge wheroff: let the reader reſorte vntounto the ſeuenth Article off Maiſter aaM. Fox in the boke off M. Tindal, &c.Barnes. Likewiſe to that bbVpō the 8. cōmaund.Maiſter Hooper ſaith that the fourth parte of the biſhoprike vvere enovvgh for the biſhop: and that the magiſtrates vvhichwhich ſuffre ſuche abuſe off thoſe goodes be culpable off the fault. Further / to that an ccM. Elm.other calleth them to the tenth parte off their biſhopricke: when he biddeth them come dovvne from their thovvſandes, and take thē to their hundredes. And if it be ſo as M. Hooper ſaith: yt ys ſo farre from that this aboundance is commodious vntounto the common wealth, and honour to Prince (as he dd473.other where ſaith) that it draweth the wrath of God vpō the Prince / and conſequently vponupon the common wealth. Beſide that / the D. can ſhewe no one pointe wherin yt is honorable to the Prince: but onelyonly barely affirmeth yt. And yt is manifeſte that yt being incommodious vntounto the church: yt muſte needes be damagable vntounto the ſtate: the good and Godly wealth wheroff / is the Princes honour.

Where he ſaith riches, faire houſes, and coſtly furniture be no hinderances to a godly man, to doo his dewtie: oneles he ſay a biſhop / and by reaſon / off his miniſtrie / he ſpeaketh not to purpoſe. yf ſo: then yt is before confuted / and more at large purſwed off the forſaide book off diſcipline. That Hypocriſie and pride, lieth hyd vnderunder the name off pouertie, ys from the matter / not onelyonly becauſe the pouertie which p. DCLIIthe Councell ſpeaketh of / is none ſuch / that had not ſufficiēt and honeſt maintenance (as may appeare in eePoſsid. in vit. Auguſt.Auguſtines maner off liuing / which was at the making off the Carthage Canons): but alſo becauſe they ſpake not off a pretended pouertie / but off that which (meete for the eſtate off a biſhop) ſhould be no further in ſhew / then in deed. Althowgh yt were better for the church / that this pride laie hid: then to hauehave ſo many witneſſes off yt / in their howſes hanged. Their tables and cupbordes ſpred / their garmentes died with it / and their manner off life both at home and abrode proclaiming yt. He ſaith alſo that biſhops were wealthy then: becawſe feaſting was forbidden them. In deede they were welthy ſtewardes / but poore lordes: great Baylifes / but ſmall proprietaries This he might wel hauehave gathered / which is trw: that euen then / ther were which (not content with an honeſt meintenance) aſpired to further magnificēce in their howſes / houſhould ſtuf / and fare / then was ſitting for biſhops: and that vnderunder colour off getting eſtimacion to their office. which appeareth both in the for ſaid canons made for that purpoſe: and in ffAd Nepotianū.Ierome.

Where he ſaith that the doctrine off the Goſpell is muche more purely profeſſed by ours, then it was by the oulde Biſhops: and for proofe alledgeth here thes Councells / and ^g otherwhere / that opa. 472.almoſte all the moſte auncient fathers, yea the moſte off the auncienteſt biſhops beleued an abode vponupon earth a thowſand yeares after the riſing againe: that almoſte all the Greke bothe biſhops and writers and the moſte parte off the Latines, were ſpotte with free will, merites, inuocation off Sainctes, &c. Where firſt let yt be obſerued / how rowgh (as in other places before) be is with the old writers / when it ſerueth for his purpoſe: and what equitie there is in this mā which crieth owt / if I doo but treade as yt where off one off their heeles / when he at one ſtroke almoſte all / at once / by condemning them off error in the matter off iuſtification (the foundation off religion) and off free will (which he ^h ſaith is likewiſe) ſtricketh them deadly in the head. Secondly … pag. 83.obſerue / that he dothe yt vntrewly. For beſide that he is not hable to ſhewe the moſte parte off both Greke and Latine moſte auncient writers after Papias, infected with that error off a 1000. yeares: to ſay that the moſte parte off the moſte auncient biſhops were ſo / is a p. DCLIIInotable ſlaunder. And ſeing that the writers ſpeak doubtfuly of merites / inuocatiō off Sainctes / and free will / ſometime for / and ſometime againſte them: likwiſe ſeing that diuers thinges vnderunder ther names are none off theires / but heritiks / which partly corrupted their bokes / partly ſet forth other vnderunder their credit: they deſerued to be ſomewhat more gently handled. And yet theſe are they forſothe / whoſe autoritie is the beſte argument in diuinitie: pag. 200.and from which althowgh wee appeale to the ſcriptures / and in appealing crie in the D. eares / yet he is deafe / and will not heare. But I thincke from henceforth wee ſhall heare no more off Tertullian ſaith yt &c. onles reaſon be annexed / and that owt off the worde off God.

Thirdly yt is to be obſerued / how vnequally the compariſon is made. for in ſteed that he ſhould hauehave compared the corruptions off the biſhops off one prouince / with the corruptions off oures: to make our biſhops Sonne to ſhyne / he matcheth yt with the cioudes off errors / aſſembled owt off all the worlde / and that by the ſpace off 450. yeares / as is to be ſeene. To this coſideration pag. 473.doth pertein / the erors off ſome before noted / the vnſincere preaching of ſome others / partly by allegories / wherin they are as fonde as the fondeſt off the aunciente: partly by vaine pompe and oſtentatiō / that was not in them / which althowgh they were ſtudied in all good letters / yet in their homilies to the people / behaued them ſelues as if they had knowen nothing but Ieſus Chriſt. Laſtly ſo many of them as ſhall be founde to maintaine all therrours in this packe of the D. I dare wil pronounce that they are deplier plōged in error then any of thoſe ould biſhops / which keping the foundacion erred in the reſte off the building wheroff (vponupon that alledged off both partes) let the iudgement be the readers. What their honeſtie off lyfe is, which is another pointe wherin he compareth oures with the elder biſhops / I will not further Pag. 473medle: eſpecially ſeing that whether there life be good or bad can hardly be hidden. Althowgh for any imperfections he ſheweth that waie in the fathers: he might as well hauehave made ours equal with thapoſtels them ſelues / amongeſt whom there was contention as amongeſt the ould biſhops. That the 5. Canon of the 2. Councell of Conc. Ty rō 3 can 5.Tyron he ſtombled one is againſt me, and my likes which leaue our calling, p. DCLIIIIis from the purpoſe / and vntrw as hath bene ſhewed. That my collector deceiued me in the councell, becauſe yt is nether the firſte nor ſecond, is meere trifling: ſeing my allegacion is mainteined / yff yt be (as yt ys in deed) the third: this faulte being by all lykelihood ſome others then mine / Conſidering that I found yt trwly noted in my paper booke from whence I toke yt. I may rather ſay that his deceiued him / and was herin ſomewhat to well ſkilled in Greke: which for Hierapolis a Cytie in Phrygia / wheroff Papias was biſhop / tould him that he was of Ieruſalem.pag. 473. Diuiſ. 18. pag. 447. Cart. c 34

Where I compared the councell which decreed that no biſhop ſitting in any place ſhoulde ſuffer a myniſter or elder to ſtande▪ vvith the behauiour off our biſhops tovvards the miniſters: he ſtaggereth on this and that ſide. But his drifte is that yt is the biſhops right / that they ſhould ſtande and he ſyt: wherein he accuſeth the councell off gyuing yt away from them. Then he will hauehave yt in their diſcretion, that yt may (belike) ſerue for a brake to break prowd ſtomacks. But what if the biſhop being prowd / the miniſters be humble: ſurely by this reaſon yt ſhoulde be rather in their diſcretiō / to make the biſhop ſyt or ſtāde before thē: For they often beaten with pouertie / learned humilitie: which he throwgh ſodain wealth / (yf he had any before) may eaſely forget. Yf there be ſuch high minded miniſters: yt is meete their pride be otherwiſe corrected / then by this vncanonicall crowching both to blowe vp the biſhops heart in pride / and to drawe the reſt with their miniſterie into con…mpt: whileſt both equall in office / and ſometime ſuperiour in giftes / they hauehave harder intertainement off them / then many off the better ſorte off Seruantes hauehave at the handes off their maiſters. So that where they are by the lawe off God / the biſhops fellowes: the poore miniſters thincke them ſelues well dealt with / yf they may be admitted for compagnions off his ſeruantes: as if my lord biſhop onelyonly were Shepard ouer the people / and al the reſt were Swinardes. I omitt that ſome of them are content that a Iuſtice off peace / yea off Quorum, (as I hauehave heard) ſtād before them with their cappes in hand: which how neere yt is to diſpiſing off powers / wheroff the Apoſtle ſpeaketh / let all iudged.Iud. 8. v.Judg 8

p. DCLVTo that alledged off the traine off vvaiting men before and after, condemned in all biſhops in the perſon off Samoſatenus Diuiſ 19. pag. 447. Euſeb. 7. li. ca. 30.he anſwereth / he was condemned for hauing Souldiours, and for walking the ſtreets. which is friuolous. For there was no more likelihood off a capitaine in him; then in our biſhops / ſauing that where he was waited vponupon with ſpeares / peraduenture according to the ſeruing mens faſhion off the countrie: oures are folowed with ſwordes and bucklers. He is generally there ſpokē againſt for his pompe: as that he vvas like vntounto men in vvorldly dignitie, and made him a throne or pulpit like a Prince. And for his men / not onelyonly becauſe they had ſpears but becauſe they were in great nomber. Now if this were damnable in a biſhop to be like a ptince or vvordly potentate: yt is manifeſte that our biſhops for thir traine / are vnderunder the ſame condemnation. Gregorie alſo althowgh Ruffin. 1. lib. ca. 19. Athana. Apol. 2.not in the ſame chap. off Ruffin / entred as well as George, and before him / with a troupe off men into the biſhoprik off Alexandria / owt off which Athanaſius was wrongfully put: and that is with other thinges reproched him / althowgh they were lent by the gouernours. He ſaith it appeareth by theſe examples / that biſhops had riches and autoritie: which is abſurd / ſeing him ſelf confeſſeth / and the ſtorie maketh mention / that they enioyed this by vniuſt meanes / and churche robberie. I graunt the biſhop was ſteward off great aboundance / but not to his owne vſe.

That eueryevery teacher in the churche was called Rabbi: thoſe Diuiſ. 20. pag. 448.know / which hauehave any ſkill in the toung from whence it was taken. So that what honour the D. can draw to the miniſtrie by that word / groweth no more to the biſhop then to all other teachers: and it conteined a profeſsion off obedience, in reſpect off thoſe that were tawght / not in reſpect of one teacher towardes an other. If the Euangeliſtes had turned it Lord which I corrected in the ſecond edition) yet the degre off ſuperioritie ſignified by this word Lord muſt be very ſmall. Seing yt was vſed by a women off honeſt Ioh. 20. 1…John 20:1eſtate / to one whom ſhe ſuppoſed no other but a gardener. Where therfore he would proue that the word Lord gyuen to p. DCLVIAthanaſins by the Synod ſignifieth ſome high degree and autoritie / becawſe the Emperour and his nobles were called onelyonly Lordes withowt other addition: he trifleth / ſeing it is manifeſt by that alledged / that with thē being a cōmen title almoſt to the baſeſt ſort of men / yt had no ſuch honour ſhut in yt as he pretendeth / but was great or ſmall / according to the perſons yt was applied vntounto. So that or euer that word will help him / he muſt ſhew that the biſhops then were ſet in great owtward dignitie.

Where alſo he would make the reader belieue / that the Synode called Athanaſius Lord off the prieſts of Alexandria: yt is but to abuſe him: when that word (as the greke) is gyuen to any of meane eſtate / and is as much with vsus as Syr. And not with vsus alone / but in diuerſe other countreis / which ſpeake ſo to any of meane condition: yet the D. turneth it alwaies my Lord. Wherby he lordeth thoſe / which hauehave no lordſhip to mainteine them nor mā to waite vponupon them: yea (as I hauehave ſhewed) thus we ſhall hauehave my Lord gardenkeper: then which what can be more ridiculous. And that it was not the Councels meaning / to make Athanaſius Lord off the elders in Alexandria▪ appeareth manifeſtly by that I hauehave alledged off the elders off Alexandria: which call him their fellovv miniſter withowt any other title. Wherin they ſhould be too vnmanerly and vndutifull / if he were (as it ſeemeth the D. woulde beare vsus in hand) their Lord. Which dalying may yet better appeare / in that Alexander biſhop off Alexandria writing to Athanaſius / when he was but deacon / or elder at the moſt: writeth. To Athanaſius Lord and beloued ſon̄e: So that if Dominus muſt needes be a Lord: then my Lord biſhop muſte by the ſame reaſon that he would be called Lord / call the elders or Deacons / Lordes likewiſe. So there ſhall be Lord Biſhop / Lord Elder / Lord Deacon: vvhichwhich as it is ridiculous / ſo it tuneth not with the biſhops note off honour / which the D. fighteth for. And this is alſo anſwer to my Lord Paulinus: beſide that Lord is not referred vntounto the pronoune yovvres, as if the councell had ſaid Athanaſius was the elders Lord. And if it were / yet if he vvill therupon conclude / any ſuperioritie of him aboue thelders off his church: he muſt by the ſame reaſon ſay / that one ſimple biſhop had ſuperioritie ouer p. DCLVIIan other / ſeing Euſebius biſhop / calleth Paulinus his fellow biſhop his Lord: which is abſurd and condemned off him ſelf.

Now I hauehave ſhewed him how biſhopes were called moſt honorable Theod li. 5. cap. 8.Lordes, he hath gotten two or three places where are found titles to the ſame effect: which is idle / ſeing that was confeſſed. To my anſwer that Lorde vvith them vvas no other title, then might be gyuen to a man off meane degree: he ſaith / moſt honorable Lord was onelyonly gyuen to thoſe in great autoritie, which is onelyonly ſaid / and may eaſely be confuted / in that Alexander biſhop off Alexandria the Metropolitane citie / vvriting to all the church miniſters / not biſhops onelyonly / called them moſt honorable fellovv Socr. li. …. cap. 6.miniſters. That he ſaith it was not grudged at then that biſhops were called by the ſame titles, that Princes: ys very plaine language / and needeth no commentarie to ſhew the meaning / ſauing that he durſt not vtter all. For if he would hauehave applied his place: he ſhoulde hauehave ſaide / yt was not grudged at then that biſhops vvere called by more loftie titles then th Emperours: ſeing the title he preſſeth for the biſhops / is moſt precious Lordes, and the Emperour as he ſaith vvas onelyonly called Lord.

That the houſe off ſalutations / was within the boundes off the Diuiſ. 21. pag 449.churche appeareth not in Theodoret. His reaſon / becauſe the houſes perteining to the biſhoprick were nere the churche, is weake. For althowgh all howſes perteining to the biſhoprik were neere: yet there might be ſome neere / not perteining therto. H…beit if it were belonging to the church / in that vvord there / is no ſuch note off excellency / wherby yt deſerueth to be the porters lodge of our biſhops palaces. To that off the biſhops beſtovving the church goods vponupon loitering ſeruing men, vvhichwhich ſhoulde be beſtovved vponupon the vniuerſities, and poore bothe miniſters, and other: he ſaith / and onelyonly ſaith that their number off ſeruing men tendeth to the defenſe off the realme, honour off the prince, and their owne good education. off the princes honour: yt is anſwered. ſtrenght to the realme, they can not be: ſeing the men ſhould be / althowghe they were not nouriſhed by the biſhop: eſpecially ſeing the biſhops howſe / is an vnfit ſchole to traine vp to vvarfare. And if the former neceſſities were p. DCLVIIIhelped / ād yt thowght meet that the church goods ſhould ſerue the realm that vvay: all ſee that yt would riſe to more profit / if ſome were nouriſhed off them / in profeſſion off a Souldiour / then that in waiting vponupon the white Rochet they ſhould rather become vvhite liuered / then faſhioned / for that ſeruice. Beſide that the biſhops countenāce being ſo profitable as yt is made / and placed a greate parte in this ſuite off men: it is manifeſt that his pompe houlding diuers at home / which otherwiſe might be in the field weakeneth rather then ſtrenghneth the realme. For the education they get vnderunder them: the corrupte religion of ſome / the wante of Catechiſing others ignorant in the principles of religion / the leudnes of diuers / the idlenes off the moſt parte / which is in the eies of all giuegive to plentifull a confutation off that parte. wherin let the reader obſerue / how vnmeet they be to gouern dioceſes / and Prouinces / which hauehave their proper houſes ſo euil ordered: eſpecially ſeing aa1. Tim. 3 ….1 Tim 3the Apoſtel vvill not truſte him vvith one pariſhe / vvhichwhich ruleth not his owne howſe vvel. And the trwth ys / that the church myniſtery is of that trauaill and care / that yt vvill not ſuffer the biſhops gyftes (be they neuer ſo greate) to be ſpente in the houſhoulding and maſterlike charge off ſuche a nomber: vvhichwhich vvas no doubt one cauſe why bothe the ſcripture / and the olde Canons / ſhut owt the biſhops from this pompe.

Where he ſaith / the vniuerſities, miniſters, and poore may otherwiſe be prouided for: when that ys browght to pas / and in ſuche ſorte as a ſufficient nomber …f learned men may be nourced vp to fourniſh bothe the churche off ther miniſters / and cōmen wealth off her magiſtrates / the ouerplus may (as M. ccVponUpon the 8. cō maund.Hoopers counſail is) goo to maintenance off Souldiours, or other neceſſary vſes / aduiſed off by the common vvealthe. That the canons browght againſt the biſhops pomp, reache to vniuerſitie colledges, foraſmuch as there were none ſuch then, as we hauehave now, ys vntrwe: conſidering that with other vniuerſities eueryevery biſhops howſe vvas (as hathe bene ſhewed) a colledge off Students in diuinitie: and yt ys otherwiſe vnſufficient. For I reaſon not againſte their pompe / becauſe yt was not vſed in times paſte, but becauſe yt was forbidden. And if he can ſhew / the reuenews off Colledges forbidden by the Godly councels: then yt had p. DCLIXheue ſomewhat he ſaith. Ad alſo that if the pompe and ryot off Colledges / werelike the biſhops: yt were likewiſe worthie / to be ſpoken againſt. Ierome / cited againſt the pompe of biſhops receiueth anſwer / that he ſpake agaynſte the abuſe and not thuſe. Ieromes wordes be theſe: let the readeriudge off his meanig. yt is Ierom. ad Nepot.a foule ſhame, that before the gates off pore and crucified Chriſte, VVho alſo eate of other mens meate, the Conſuls Sergeantes and Gard ſhoulde vvaite: and that the ruler off the Prouince, ſhoulde dine better at thy hovvſe then in the palace. But if thovv pretend to do theſe thinges, to thende to beg for the poore: the Secular iudge vvill giuegive more to a churche man vvhichwhich kepethe meaſure and is frugall, then to one vvhichwhich is riche: and reuerence more thy holines, then thy riches, Or if the ruler be ſuche, that he vvill not hearken to the churchmen ctauing for the poores reliefe, but vvhen he is amongeſt the cupps: I vvill gladly vvant ſuche a benefit: and beg off Chriſt in ſtede off the iudge, vvho is better and ſoner able to helpe then the iudge. I omit that he inueighethe againſt a church mā / which poore before / becometh riche by the church: ād liuing very homely before / after vſethe delicate fare / with other thinges to that ende.

Whether this were one cauſe off the biſhops ſtately pompe Diuiſ. 22. pag. 450.that (certeine noble and riche men rece…ed to the myniſtery, and liuing ſomvvhat like their former eſtates) others aſſaied to be like vntounto them: whether an other cauſe were for that it being Diuiſ. 23. 24. 25. pag. 451.amongeſt the heathen prieſts before yt came into the church off the Chriſtians yt vvas (as diuers other corruptions) taken off them by imitation: whether a thirde and more higher cawſe theroff were / that the brauery of the pourpled vvhore of Rome might bothe eaſelier take her ſeate and faſter houlde yt, vvhileſt other biſhops vvere made ſomevvhat ſutable vntounto her, vvhichwhich ſhe could not hauehave done if (other biſhops left in the ſimplicitie vvherin God had apointed them) ſhe had bene as an ovvle amōgeſt the reſte of the birdes: I ſay whether theſe three / p. DCLXare amongeſt the cauſes off bringing in the biſhops pompe into the churche / I leaue to the readers iudgement. Conſidering that the D. beſide begging / and diſſembling the matter / which I goo abowte to proue: hathe nothing. That Chriſtians might aſwel be thowght to hauehave folowed Maximinus in building churches, as in ſufficiently prouiding for the miniſters: ys to ſimple / ſeing we deny hym not ſufficient prouiſion. But if he eſteme nothing ſufficient, onles he be mainteined as a lord: let him learn off S. Paul / what is ſufficient / and ſo he ſhal (I doubt not) fall from his 1000. to a 100. vntounto thes three 1. Tim. 6. 6. 8. vponupon 4. Epheſ.1 Tim 6:61 Tim 6:8cauſes off the biſhoplike ſtatelines I will heer ad the fourth: worthy to be obſerued. M. Bucer ſhewing the incommodities which came / by that the biſhops vvere receiued to bear ciuill offices. ſaith: after they began to occupie the place off princes: they chalenged alſo to them ſelues their pompe and brauery. So let the reader iudg how trw yt ys that I ſaid: that our archbiſhops, biſhops, &c. beſides the names, hauehave almoſt nothing commenvvith thoſe of elder times: and hovv if the old biſhops vvere aliue, they vvould not knovv one annother. For that they vvould thinke ours princes, and ours vvoulde eſteme them as hedge prīeſtes. What I allow, off the oulde Canons, and what I diſalow, althowgh Diuiſ. 26. pag. 452.he diſſemble: yet he knoweth better then he would / I hauing at large declared yt in this Tractate.

The firſt diuiſ. I o…it. In the next / to that the Apoſtle called CAP. VI. Pag. 454. 1. Cor. 4. 1.1 Cor 4:1the Corint. to a mo…rate eſtimacion of the miniſters (meane betvveen contempt and to much exalting them) vponupon occaſion that the falſe Apoſtels were to much lifted vp: he ſaith / yt was a partial affection to wardes their teachers not in reſpect off any title, which is friuolous, for if it be denied generally / that they ſhoulde not be ſo mounted: then the way is ſtopped againſt titles and offices, and other meanes whatſoeuer / wherby that may grow. Beſide that the D. is afraied as appeareth by his anſwer to be browght vntounto a moderation and meane betvvene contempt and exceſſiue eſtimacion. Where I ſhew / that as the falſe Apoſtels pompe in preaching, lifting them vp aboue the faithfull miniſters, cauſed the faithful miniſters to be contemned: ſo the pompe of our p. DCLXIbiſhops, lifted vp aboue the reſt off the paſtors, to be a ready vvay to bringe their myniſterie ovvt off credit: and that as that gaue occaſion to the Corinthes to ſaie, I houlde off ſuche a teacher, &c. ſo this giueth occaſion to ſay, I vvil beleue my Lord Biſhop or my lord Archbiſhop, vvhatſoeuer our parſon ſay: for they be vviſe men and learned: I ſay to all this beſide wandring and vnlikely ſlaunders there is not a word: ſeing I truſt / it appearethe to all / that we giuegive no occaſion by any pompe that the people in magnifying off vsus ſhould condemne others.

The next diuiſion I leaue to the reader. Where againſt the Diuiſ. 4. pag. 455.D. ſlaunder off the Admonitions intent to take away princes, I ſhewed that his practiſe againſt vsus, is the ſame vvith the Phariſies againſt our Sauiour Chriſt, vvhichwhich being rubbed for their ambition accuſed him as no friend off Ceſar. He anſwerethe that we are not Chriſt, which is ridiculous / that the caſe is not like, whereof let the reader iudge: ſeing he is (as they were) honour pricked. Whether our Archbiſhop dvvell as far aſonder almoſt, from the ciuil magiſtrate, as Rome and Ieruſalem: let the reader iudge off that alledged. likewiſe what a cōning ſtargaſer the D. is / which ſaw in the ſtar off my forehead that the admonition intended the ouerthrow off the ciuill magiſtrate. The nexte off the canon off Antioche Councel, is anſwered, but where I ſhew that that Canon is not like to be iuſtifiable conſidering that it ſovvght falſely, …edite off the name off the apoſtels: he anſwereth not. Onles this be his anſwer: that yt is the naturall Canon off the apoſtels. And in deede his wordes ſo ſound / for thus he ſaithe. That canon off the Apoſtels is repeated in this councel: as diuers off the Nice be repeated off other councels. Which how ſhamfully yt is ſpoken: may appeare off that we hauehave before diſputed off the antiquitie off the metropolitane. How dangerouſly to the ouerthrow off our faithe / whileſt we are borne in hand / that there be canons of the Apoſtels not cōteined in the canonicall ſcripture: al that hauehave iudgement / may vnderſtand / and yt is in parte **Tract. 1.before declared. I omit that yt is cleane contrary to his doctrine off the archbiſhop: wherby he maketh him an officer / changeable at the wil of the Prince. For if that be thApoſtles p. DCLXIICanon: there is no miniſtery in the holde ſcripture / which hathe better euidence for an vnchangeable perpetuitie / then yt.

That M. Bucer is wholy for vsus in this point: I refer the reader Diui. 6. pag. 457.to that aaDiui. 15. pag. 367.before written. The place alledged here would hauehave made litle for him: if he had not kepte his cuſtome. For where Bucer ſpeaketh off obedience to be gyuen by the biſhops to the metropolitan: he hath left owt theſe wordes after their maner. By vvhichwhich conning / he may proue the Acthiopian afaire: man becauſe he hath white teeth. For all ſee: that M. Bucer by theſe wordes / delaied the autoritie off the metropolitanſhip. And if they were not plaine enowgh: yet others in the ſame place are. that the patriarches vvere ſet ouer the metropolitanes, as they vponupon the Epheſ.ouer the biſho▪ but that nether, could doe any thing ſaue onelyonly admoniſh thoſe ouer vvhō they vvere ſet: ād if they obeied not, to complaine of them to the ſynod. After he condemneth / that the Patriarches toke vntounto them the ordination off the biſhops nigh them: and by meanes therof, by litle and litle gat ſome iuriſdiction ouer thoſe biſhopes, and their churches. So appeareth / that if there be any difference here (touching theſe offices) betwene vsus / and M. Bucer: yt is onelyonly / that where we affirme yt good / that the preſidentſhip ſhould be choſen at eueryevery meeting / as that which cometh neerer the apoſtels example / and more ſafe againſt Tyranny: M▪ Bucer may ſeem to make yt a ſtanding and continuall office / ſet … in one man. For as towching his autority / wherin the chief poinct off the controuerſie lieth: yt findeth as ſmal grace with M: Bucer / as with vsus.

Whatſoeuer is here / is eeDiu. 42. pag. 390.anſwered: ſauing the contrarietie aſſigned Diuiſ. 7. pag. 458.betwen this / an Apoſtle vvas aboue an Euangeliſt, and that there was chiefrie euen amongeſt the apoſtels / in that one labored more / and had more excellent giftes then another: which how manifeſt an argument yt is that the archbiſhop hathe robbed him off all ſenſe let the reader iudge. Sauing alſo that he ſignifieth that the difference betweene the Apoſtels muſt be in autoritie not in excellency off giftes or laboures. Conſidering that there was amongeſt them in thoſe poinctes a moſt perfect equalitie. Which how abſurd yt is p. DCLXIIImay be conſidered in that ſome had the gifte off continencie / which other ſome had not / ſome trauailed with their handes for their liuing / which other did not: ād in that S. Paul / is ſaid expreſly to hauehave laboured more then they all. To the nexte beſide bare affirmations 1. Cor. 15. 9.1 Cor 15:9and ſlaunders ofte repeted: he anſwereth nothing. To the ninth: I anſwer not.

That the greke worde 2. Gal. 2. ſignifieth for the moſt parte Diuiſ. 10. pag. 461. foreign.to ſeeme: can not be denied. Whether there be any neceſſitie to chaunge this vſual ād ordinary ſignification in that place: I leaue to the reader. Seing firſt the ſame word in that chapter / is twiſe ſo turned: where the ſame bothe matter / and perſons are ſpoken off. ſeing alſo yt is confeſſed / by M. Beza which corrected yt: that the apoſtle ſpeaketh not according to his owne but according to the ſenſe off his aduerſaries. Thirdly / ſeing the cauſe which moued Eraſmus and M. Beza to departe from that tranſlation for that ther is nothing ioined to declare, vvherin that ſeeming and apparance ſhoulde be) is not ſo vrging. For S. Paul vſeth ofte ſuche ſhorte / and cut ſpeaches: which are to be ſupplied by other places off his: as M. Beza him ſelf ſheweth in the ſame chap. verſ. 6. I omit the nomber off interpreters / which hauehave folowed the oulde in this behalfe. Howbeit I confeſſe / that if I had knowne that I had in this pointe to doe with the Geneua / M. Bezas / and Eraſmus tranſlation / and Budies autoritie: I would (for reuerence off their learning) hauehave vſe▪ an eaſier worde in diſſenting. nether wil I ſtriue about yt / wit… …he D. yt making litle ether off or on / to the matter in hand: ſeing the reaſon (alledged by the adm. and mainteined by me) ſtandeth ſtill againſt the archbiſhop. For if Saint Paul / were in nothing inferiour vntounto Saint Peter / one of thoſe cheif there mētioned: and yf the making of S. Peter / to hauehave autoritie ouer Saint Paul / be the ouerthrow of S. Pauls argument: then yt foloweth / that thadm. aptly alledged that place againſte the archbiſhop. Nether can it be alledged / to proue any degree of honour the in miniſtery, not onelyonly becauſe the price which the Galatheans had off thoſe by ſuggeſtion off the falſe Apoſtels / was exceſſiue in that they preferred thoſe three before S. Paul: but alſo for that off men in the ſame degree and p. DCLXIIIIautoritie one may iuſtly be honoured more then an other / in reſpecte off giftes more excellente in him then in the reſte.

Where I ſhewed / that our Sa. Chriſts calling is auowed Diui. 11. pag. 462. Heb. 5. 5. 6Heb 5:5Heb 5:6iuſt becauſe yt was cōteined in ſcripture: he ſaith the apoſtel onelyonly ſhewed by ſcripture that he intruded not him ſelf but was called off God. Where the teſtimonies put as cauſes off this that he did not glorifie him ſelfe: muſte be alſo cawſes off his vocation / and that in ſuche ſorte that if thoſe and ſuche like teſtimonies had not bene / his vocation coulde not hauehave bene iuſtified. where he ſaith none can iuſtifie his calling if it were not lawfull withowt ſuche a perſonall teſtimonie as our Sau. Chriſt had: we preſſe not all the circumſtances. Ther being no more in that kinde off office / but he alone: the teſtimonie off it / muſt needes be perſonall. Yt ſhall be ſufficient for him: to ſhew that the Archbiſhops hauehave the ſame teſtimonie off the worde / which the biſhops or paſtours. To the next I anſwer not: In the next / there is nothing but bare affirmacions / anſwered aaDiu. 31. pag. 380. Diuiſ. 33. Pag. 381.before.

bbDiu. 14. pag. 465.To that alledged that if all the church vvere in one Prouince, and one ouer them all in trauailing vvith an archbiſhop he ſhould bringe forthe a pope: he anſwereth / that can not be, the churche being ſcattered throwghout the worlde. Which I graunte / hauing reſpecte vntounto Gods election / and calling hidden from vsus: but that the churche eſtabliſhed in a viſible and apparant from / may not (which God fo…id) be browght into one land / I hetherto heare no reaſon, he ſa…th further / that the church after the aſcenſion being in Ieruſalem onelyonly, yf yt had had one biſhop, ſhould by my reaſon likewiſe hauehave had a pope: which is vntrew. For we ioine with the paſtor / (and that in equal autoritie of gouernement) thelders off the church: condemning al monarchicall gouernement in the paſtor. The reſt is ccDiu 32 pag. 381. Diuiſ. 41. pag. 389.āſwered. The next / is ddDiui. 33. pa. 381.anſwered before. eedi. 1617. pag. 467.Accuſed for charging the adm. to hauehave vſed the papiſtes reaſons, he ſaith he may vvel doo yt: but reaſon he can ſhew none. He denieth that he woulde proue one archbiſhop ouer a prouince by one kinge ouer a realme: yet beſide he flatly ffDiu. 41. pag. 389.affirmeth that the forme off gouernment in the church muſt be according to that of the cōmon wealthe, driuen to the wal / p. DCLXVyt is his cōmon refuge / that by the ſame reaſon we eaſte away Archbiſhops, we may likewiſe depoſe kinges. His whole anſwer almoſt heer / is cloured off diuers diuiſions before: where he hath aaDiu 43. pag. 390. Diuiſ. 50. pag. 396. Diuiſ. 70. pag 417.reply. And yet ſuche is his forehead / that althowgh he hauehave heer ſet before me a charger off Colewories: yet for anſwering them with repetition off one line / in as few wordes as if I had onelyonly referred him to the former treatiſe / he ſhameth not to ſay / that I vſe nothing almoſt but repetitions. bbDiu. 18. pag. 469.To that alledged out of Caluin / that the churche dothe cleane one part vntounto an other vnderunder our Sau. Chriſtes dominion, according to the order and forme off policīe, vvhichwhich he hathe preſcribed, and therfore not by a biſhop of a dioceſe or archbiſhop, as thoſe vvhichwhich he praeſcribed not: he anſwereth / that he ſpeaketh off the ſpirituall gouernement, and not off the externall. wherby he maketh Caluin a trifling diſputer. For the Papiſtes which will hauehave the pope a miniſteriall head vnderunder Chriſte / Confeſſe that he alone gouerneth inwardly and ſecretly by his ſpirit: but that their pope is a meanes / wherby he doth yt. Therfore Cal. in ſaying that / that is doen by the order and forme off policie preſcribed off God: ſtopped vp that corner againſt them. And beſide that yt will be hard for him to ſhew / that the inwarde working off God by his ſpirit is called an order and forme off policie: let him anſwer where that order and forme off policie off the lordes ſecret working with his ſpirit / is preſcribed: ſeing the worke thereof / ys as the voice of the wind which we hearing can Iohn. 3. 8.John 3:8not tel from whēce yt cometh nor whet… yt will: and ſeing the lord commaunding his miniſters to doe their dwtie / reſerueth to him ſelfe the manner and order / how and when he will worke in wardly. Secondly he anſwereth that this policie off our Biſhop and Archbiſhop is praeſcribed, althowghe not particularly expreſſed in his word: as if the force off this worde preſcribed were not more then / contemed / and aſmuche as his particularly expreſſed. But I hauehave aad 70. 71 pag. 4. 7.ſhewed / that he requireth alſo / that al church officers be expreſſed in the worde: and what expreſſed meaneth is before bb…. Tract.obſerued. The reader to make vp his mouth with / ād as yt were for a ban quetting diſh. hathe the next whole chapter off repetitions. which ys ccin the 2. and 3. ca. off this Tract.anſwered / and ſo is the dddi. 16. 17 pag. 446nexte vntounto yt.

p. DLXVIThus we are (by the grace off god) come / to an ende off this treatiſe / wherin let the reader iudge / whether yt hathe bene proued that the offices off archbiſhops and archdeacons be vnlawfull / that they came not into the church 300. yeares after the aſcenſion off our Sa. Chriſte: that there names are likewiſe vnlawfull by the worde / forbiddē by auncient councels / not to be founde in any auncient writing before 400. yeares approched. Further whether that eueryevery congregation / owght to hauehave a biſhop: that one onelyonly may hauehave two or moe: that they owght all to hauehave like titles and autoritie. Sauing that in their meetings for orders ſake one by conſent of the reſt gouerneth that action / in ſuche ſorte as is declared. That all theſe pointes off the biſhop hauehave grounde off the word off God / and moſte off thē ſhewed to hauehave remained ſome time after thapoſtels / and the traces lōge after. Finally / whether that euen the elder Biſhops when they were declined from the ſynceritie off gods ordinance / and the archbiſhops and archdeacons which he neuer ordeined: were much more tollerable then ours: as thoſe whoſe autority was without compariſon les / and pompe. none at all.