A Second Reply to an Answer Made by Doctor Whitgift Part 1, Reply 24 · Section 2 (3 of 3)

A Second Reply to an Answer Made by Doctor Whitgift Part 1 · Reply 24 · Section 2 (3 of 3)

p. DCAnd where otherwhere he pretendeth alowance of this Popiſhe Diuiſ. 42. pag 390.diſtinction / by the godlie writers: the trwth is nothing ſo. For as touching Caluin / he hath openly depraued him. He onelyonly ſheweth vponupon 2. Cor. 10. verſ. 8. that there are diuers degrees off miniſters / and that one is aboue an other / as an Apoſtel aboue a paſtor / which is confeſſed: but that one paſtor is aboue an other / which is the queſtion / he hath not a worde. That owt of Heza / is onelyonly a recital what was done / not what he alowed: cōſidering that (as hath bene ſhewed) he vtterly condemneth thoſe offices off Lorde biſhop / Archbiſh / &c. beſide that in ſhewing that they came in proces off time after the Apoſtles: he hangeth the D. cawſe on the hedge which woulde hauehave this diſtinction in the time of the Apoſtles. Nether hath Hemingius this diſtinctiō / where the D. ſuppoſeth / he onelyonly ſaith that they are equall as towching pag. 420.ſpiritual regiment. What they be in external / he referreth to another place: which when the D. bringeth / he ſhall hauehave anſwer. And whenſoeuer yt cometh I thincke yt will ouerthrowe his before: that there are ſome miniſteries of the word and Sacramentes onelyonly, ſome for gouernement alſo. for althowgh he allowe a gouernement vntounto him he calleth biſhop / larger then to an other miniſter: yet (I thincke) he can not ſhew that he ſhutteth owt thother owte off the externall gouernement. Ad alſo / that I hauehave ſhewed / that euen when thes ſmokey offices came firſt in / nether the Doctor / nor paſtor were ſeuered from gouernement off their ſeuerall congregation. For that wherin the metropolitane then exceded the paſtor / was a preheminence or honour withowt autoritie: ſo that euen then / yt was an euill diſtinction / off certein miniſters off the word and ſacramentes onelyonly, and certeine which did gouerne.

His third anſwer is owt off the B. off Saliſbury: which affirmeth that there were archbiſhops in Ieromes time. But it is to obſerued / that that aſſertion off the biſhop / proceded off miſtaking Ierome / and ſome ouerſight. Which is cleare by that in 4. Artic 15. diuiſan other place / the biſhop auowcheth owt off Ierome …o Nepotian / archbiſhops: where there is no mention off Archbiſhop in any ſort. And althowghe the place which the biſhop vouchethe / be in the Epiſtle vntounto Ruſticus: yet there is no mention off an Archbiſhop / as I hauehave before declared. This aſſertion therfore p. DCIcan not helpe the D. which hathe no better grounde. His laſte proofe is Eraſmus / who ſaith that metropolitans hauehave ſome vponupon Ier. to Euag.dignitie aboue other biſhops: an other of Hardinges bucklers againſte the biſhop in the ſame place. Where yt is manifeſt / that Eraſmus kepte his oulde couſtome / off carying fire in the one hande / and water to quenche yt in the other: and tempered the truthe with ſome leuaine off the corruption off thoſe times / therby to procure ſaftie vntounto him / and to his bookes: whileſt thoſe which coulde not abide to looke vponupon the truthe barefaced / might at the leaſte beare yt being muffled Yf the Anſ. will make his owtecries / that I diſcredite the autor when I can not anſwer them: beſide that I diſcredite not moe then he / I referre me vntounto the conſcience off all men / whether yt be true which I hauehave ſaide. And yet doo I not ſaie the tenthe parte / off that which I coulde alledge written off him / by men off excellent learning / and zeale.

But let yt be conſidered / how bothe corruptly contrary to the minde off Ierome / and vnconſtantly contrarie to that him ſelfe hath written off this place / he hath blinded thes together. For if it be trw that he hath ſaid / that Ieromes meaning is / that the biſhop off Rome differeth from other biſhops onelie in riches: then it is manifeſte that in autoritie / he differeth not from the biſhop off Eugubium / a ſmall towne in the ſame prouince. And where he ſaith / that Ierome in making the biſhop off a baſe citie equall vvith the reſte, referreth that to the deacons vvhichwhich in ſome places vvere preferred before the elders: who ſeeth not but that ſpeaking againſt the truthe / he was ſo amazed / that wordes comminge from him / reaſon ſtickethe yet in his penne. For what reaſon is there / that Ierome ſhoulde therfore ſaie the biſhop off Eugubium vvas equall vntounto the Biſhop off Rome, notvvithſtanding the biſhop off Rome vvere his ſuperior, becauſe the deacon vvas preferred in Rome before the elder? What giuegive is here to ioyne thes together? or what cawſe was there that Ierome ſhoulde ſpeake baſely off the metropolitanes autoritie ouer the biſhop / becauſe the deacon was preferred before the elder? ys there anie reaſon that becauſe the deacon p. DCIIdid iniurie vntounto the elder: therfore Ierome ſhoulde ſpeake ſparingly of the metropolitane / …nd doo him iniurie alſo? moreouer if this was the occaſion why he ſpake ſo off a biſhop / becauſe certeine deacons were preferred before the elders: conſidering that that couſtome was onelyonly at Rome (as Ierome him ſelf declareth) why ſhould he make the biſhop off Tanais / a ſmall towne in Egypte / equall with the biſhop off Alexandria / the metropolitane citie there? and the biſhop Rhegium / equall with the biſhop off Conſtantinople? For ſeing that miſcheif off the preferment off Deacons before the elders / was not in other places then in Rome there was no cauſe why he ſhould ſpeake thus off thē / if that had bene the cauſe which Eraſmus alledgeth?

Where he addeth / vvhen Ierome ſaith the biſhops and elders vvere equall, that is to be vnderſtanded, that the elder vvas equall vvith the biſhop in that they vvere bothe preferred vntounto the deacon: I meruaile the Anſ. is not aſhamed to alledge that ſaying / without all colour off truthe. For I hauehave alledged diuers other places owte off Ierome where he ſpeaking abſolutely / withoute reſpecte off any deacon / affirmeth the biſhop and elder all one in the beginning. And what a ridiculous diſputacion doth he make Ierome to hould? For it is all one / as if a mā after longe diſcourſe to proue Londē and Yorke equall: in the ende ſhoulde conclude / that Yorke were equall with London / becauſe they be bothe greater then Nuington. Now let the reader iudge / what vnworthie outcries the D. vſeth / bothe before and after / pag. 390.off guilful dealing, and ſhifting the place of Ierome, therby to drowne the voice of the trwthe: and whether I hauehave interpreted it according to his naturall meaning / and as other godlie / and learned hauehave doone: and whether he contrarily / to mainteine his firſte ſaying / hath vſed ſhiftes partely popiſhe / ouerthrowinge the anſwers off thoſe which hauehave trauailed againſte popery / aſwell as mine: partely fonde / and childiſhe / which he woulde beare owt with pag. 390. Diuiſ. 39. &c. p. 387. &c In tract. 3. … 4.Eraſmus autoritie / withowt any weight off reaſon. Likewiſe how he after dallieth in his longe tranſlation / and repetition of Ierome / to no purpoſe. That a doctor differeth from a paſtor / hathe bene ſhewed, that he is inferior vntounto him appeareth / not onelyonly p. DCIIIbecauſe the Apoſtle placeth him after / where he dothe moſte exactly ſet downe the order off preaching miniſters: but alſo that Epheſ. 4. 11.Eph 4:11the giftes required for that office / are (as hathe bene ſhewed) leſſe. wherunto may be added the practiſe off the elder churches / which eſtemed the doctor alwaies vnderunder him whom they called biſhop or Paſtor. That the elder which gouerneth onelyonly is inferior to the Doctor: appeareth bothe in that his giftes be fewer / and that aaTimot▪ 5. 17.the Apoſtel giueth more honour to him / then to the elder. That Deacons are vnderunder thoſe elders: for that their charge is to bbAct. 6. 2.Acts 6:2ſerue the tables onelyonly / and therfore but a part off the churche / where the elders gouernemēt is ouer the whole. Likewiſe for that the deacons charge / being in thinges perteining to the nouriſhement off the body: muſte gyue place to that off the elders / whoſe ccHeb. 13. 17.Heb 13:17watche is ouer the ſowles. Al which (the miniſtery off the Doctor onelyonly excepted / which is ſhut vp commōly in the biſhop) is confirmed by continuall practiſe off the churche: which vppon all occaſions off ſpeaking off this miniſterie / placeth the biſhop before the elder / and the elder before the deacon. and preciſely the foreſaid ddad Philadelph.Ignarius / ſheweth that the deacon is vnderunder the elder / thelder vnderunder the biſhop: where that thelder which onelyonly gouerneth and not onelyonly he which teacheth is vnderſtanded (at which hole the D. would creepe out) ſhall be after in proper place declared. So appeareth that order in the miniſtery / and diuerſitie off degrees are defined off by the word of God: and that euen in the Eccleſiaſticall miniſtery / ther is inequalitie althowgh all paſtors be equall amongeſte them ſelues: and withall that order ſtandeth withowt the archbiſhop / or any other deuiſed miniſtery.

Chryſoſt. browght by me / is ſhamfully corrupted / and the corruption opened in the former diuiſ. his allegations (there owght to be rulers in the church, and order to puniſhe faultes) ſo erkſomly repeted / are Idle: yt being confeſſed / and withall ſhewed / that there is none off thoſe but are doone withowt his ether biſhop / or Archbiſhop. where hauing no reaſon he falleth to exhortacion / that I would not ſtand in my conceite, but thincke the gouernement off his biſhop better then that laid forth by vsus: if he can compound with the word of God / with the reformed churches Apoſtolical / and preſent / with the pureſt writers ould and newe: I with my conceites (as he ſpeeaketh) p. DCIIIIwill be ready to hould tharchbiſhops ſtirup. That he affirmeth the forme off gouernement wherin one is aboue all, neceſſary in our commen wealthe: althowgh I hauehave ſhewed that I greatly allow of it / yet that yt is neceſſary / and that the Prince / and Parlemēt can Diuiſ. 5. Pag. 181.not vponupon occaſion alter yt / eſpecially without breache off the lawe off God / which onelyonly maketh the neceſſitie vve ſpeake of / ys an vntrwth / apparant to all that hauehave euer taſted off holy / or humane letters. And althowghe yt ſemeth he hath couenanted vvith him ſelf / to ſpeake all he ſuppoſeth may pleaſe: yet his knowledge anſwering not his w…ll / he is found here to abridge the authoritie off the ciuile powre / which he thowght to hauehave ſtretched owt / and to binde it to that which the lord lefte at the libertie theroff.

Where he ſaithe / the externall gouernement off the church vnderunder a Chriſtian magiſtrat, muſte be according to the kinde and forme of gouernement vſed in the comon wealth: it partly hath / ād further (God willing) ſhall appeare / that the gouernemēt of the church debated is certein by the vvord off God / and vnchangeable. As for his bolt ſo ſoone ſhot / and with ſo ſmal drafte of reaſon: yt is brokē with the vvinde off his owne mouth. For where he maketh the externall gouernement throwghe owte his whole booke / at the pleaſure of the Prince / which is his principall hould: here he teacheth that yt is not in the princes powre onles ſhe will ether put of / or deuide her crowne vvith others / to put downe the archbiſhop. for the externall gouernement off the church (ſaith he) muſte be according to the kinde, and forme off gouernement off the comon wealth. Wherby alſo foloweth / that where the popular eſtate / or the rule of the beſte beareth ſwaie; they can not althowghe they vvould / hauehave an archbiſhop. yea herupon foloweth / that ether the Canterbury / or Yorke archbiſhop muſte leeſe his head. For yt is concluded off his highe diuinitie / that as there is but one prince in the whole Realme: ſo there muſte be but one Archbiſhop. His reaſon (the Prince can not els be ſupreme gouernour off all eſtates, and cauſes eccleſiaſticall:) to ſay no more / is ſenſeles / and hath no knot with that wherunto yt belongeth. As if vvhen Roome had both Emperours / and conſules / the Emperour could not be cheife gouernour off the conſuls / becauſe p. DCVthe Conſuls were equall amongeſt themſelues. I confeſſed yt vnconuenient, that there ſhould be one Caeſar ouer the worlde / but that yt may be: he alledgeth Caluin that yt is moſte abſurd: to what pourpoſe? what contrarietie is here? yt is enowghe for me that there may be / and that lawfully / a Prince of larger extent of dominion / then the archbiſhop of his archbiſhopricke / althowghe the prince vvould graunte yt him: which vtterly ouerthroweth his cauſe / and this being alledged off me afterward / is clean paſſed by. For his defenſe conſiſteth in this / that the Popes Diuiſ. 14. pag. 465.widenes off iuriſdiction ouer churches / ys vnlawfull / becauſe he hath yt not of the gifte off Princes: and in this that the externall gouernement of the church / muſt be according to the forme / and kinde off gouernement in the commen wealth. Which is alſo manyfeſtly confuted there / whence he hath borowed this temony. Inſtit. 4. l. 6. cap. 9. ſect.For there he addeth that althowgh yt were graunted / that there might be one Caeſar ouer all the worlde: yet yt followeth not that there may be one biſhop ouer all the churches. which notwithſtanding muſte needes folowe / if the externall gouernement off the church / muſte be according to that forme / and kinde off gouernement vſed in the commen wealth. ^a For the diſtinction Diuiſ 42. pag 390.which ſuppoſeth certein miniſters of the word / and Sacramētes onelyonly / and certein to hauehave to gether with the adminiſtration off them / the gouernemente alſo: I refer the reader to that bbDiuiſ. 25. &c. pag. 313. &c. Diuiſ. 38. Pag. 385.before written. his vaine cauil that I deſire to be vncontrolled off any but off God, is ccDiuiſ. 11. pag. 62.anſwered.

ddDiui. 43. pag. 391.The D. accuſeth me off falſehood, for that I charge bim with citing Auguſtine, and Cryſoſtome at large. Towching Auguſtine: that he vvas ſo alledged appeareth / firſte pag. 583. and both he / and Chryſoſtom pag. 296. Where he ſaith he vſed that large quotacion, onelyonly once in Muſcul. Cyril. and M. Fox: he coulde hardly doo yt oftner in the two laſte / conſidering that as I remember / he alledgeth them once onelyonly. but towching Muſcul. beſide the place I charge him with / he lefte his aduerſary twiſe to his wide worckes. Where he remembreth not that he ſendeth to any other writers, but with places quoted pag. 580.as particularly as he could: his memory vvhichwhich is ſo miraculouſe at other times / is here but miſerable. To helpe yt / beſide this place off p. DCVIpag. 175. pag. 243.Cal. he ſendeth to his Inſtitutes / vvithowt any further reſtreinte as appeareth pag. 132. againe pag. 74. in his former booke: for he hath quoted yt in this later. Likewiſe that Damaſus calleth Stephen Archdeacon / withowt any direction pag. 344. Alſo alledgeth Gratian / Polidore / Volateran / vvithowte any reſtreinte 589. pa. I omit that he ſendeth towardes thend off his booke / to the large feilde off godly interpreters: that diuers times he gyueth the booke onelyonly / where he might gyue the chap. the chap. onelyonly where he mighte giuegive the ſection: all which are contrary to that he ſetteth downe. Wherby may appeare what a hard mouth he hath / and howe I ſpeake ſparingly off this kinde off allegation off his.

Charged heere by his fonde allegacion off Cal. Inſtitut. he anſwereth / I knew there were ſundry editions. I did ſo: but whether yt be abſurd that he ſhould leaue both the beſte / and moſte vſual to take that which is worſe / and in the handes of fewe (onles he mente to play vnderunder the boorde / that men ſhould not vnderſtand) I leaue to the readers iudgement. His reaſon (he had noted yt, laboured it, and was acqainted with yt) is very ſimple. For is yt meete that becauſe he had made his booke a litle heuier with yncke / he ſhould be wedded ſo to yt / as to neglecte the commen commoditie? how he is acquainted with yt I knowe not: but I truſt yt hath / and ſhall appeare / that there is no more frendſhip betwene him and his booke in thes matters / then betwene light and darknes. But yt is foly to reaſon with him: for he addeth Doctorlike / that he both hath, and will ſo vſe yt ſtill. Howbeit how cometh yt to pas / that euen in his former booke he hath alledged the later edition? belike ether that was ſome tributary allegacion: or els the latter pag. 606.was better to him there then his noted one. Howe vniuſtly he chargeth me with vncerteine direction / in ether all / or the moſte off thes he ſetteth downe: I leaue to be iudged off that I hauehave ſaid in that behalfe. The reſte off this diuiſ. with the nexte / is nothing but bare / and bould affirmacions / reproches / and repetitions. The nexte to it hath nothing but trifling and vnlerned queſtions / bbdiuiſ. 4. pag. 173. Diuiſ. 12. pag. 364.before anſwered. That ſet downe off the inconuenience off many ſpeaking together / according to the prouerbe (many may ſing but not ſpeake at once) is not (as he ſaith) needles, but p. DCVIImade way to the neceſſitie of hauing one which otherwiſe equal / ſhould hauehave ſome preheminence in that action. The next hath nothing but railing wordes / with repetition off repetitions / and that beſide the matter: conſidering that the cautions I put off the moderator in the aſſembly off miniſters / I put not as alwais obſerued off the D. Biſhops / and Archbiſhops / but as thoſe which owghte to be. In aſking ſcripture for proofe, he dalieth: ſeeking for that he would not find / as the ſcholer the rod he muſt be beaten with.

The cocke / a glorious and proud birde / which will not ſuffer Diuiſ. 47 pag. 393. Cicer. de diuinat. Plinie.his victorie to be hidden / but proclameth yt forthwith by crowing: yet if he be ouercome hideth him ſelfe. Wherin he ſheweth a great deale more modeſtie then the D. which althowgh he hauehave neuer a ſpur of argument ether to defend him ſelf / or to offend his aduerſary: yet croweth as high / as if the maiſtrie were in his hande. But let yt goe / let vsus ſee his fighte. To that I alledgrd of Peter / choſen by the other Apoſtels to moderate the two firſte actions / Act. 1. 15. Act. 2. 14.Acts 1:15Acts 2:14notwithſtanding yt be not ſet downe: he anſwereth / yt is wicked to grounde thalteration of the archbiſhop, and our biſhops gouernemente, continued long, and practiſed in the beſte times of the church, withowt, yea contrary to the ground off ſcripture. The long continuance / onles they hauehave ſalte off the worde off God to preſerue them / argueth they be rotten / and ſuche as caſte an euill ſauour. That they were not in the beſte times off the church / hath before appeared: whether yt hauehave ground owte off the worde / that Peter was choſen by the Apoſtels / althowgh yt be not expreſſed: yt may partly appeare by that diſputation vppon 20 Math. for if all the Apoſtels were lefte of our Sauiour Chriſte in equall autoriti… ▪ ether Peter tooke that vppon him withowt callinge / or els he receiued yt off the Apoſtels. But the firſte is confeſſed vntrw: therfore yt hath grounde off the word off God / that Saint Peter was choſen off the Apoſtels vntounto the preſidentſhip in thoſe actions. And as yt hath bene ſhewed owte off S. Mathew 20. that none off them was higher then other: ſo off S. Peter yt appeareth particularly / in that he / and S. Iohn were ſent by the colledge of the Apoſtels: Act. 8. 14Acts 8:14wheras if he had bene made cheife by our Sauiour / and that from the aſcention vntounto his dying daie: yt had not bene lawfull for the p. DCVIIIApoſtels by making him their Embaſſadour / to hauehave made him inferior to the reſ…d…w. I know what the Papiſtes anſwer in this poincte: but the D. bancke being diſcouered / I thincke he will chaunge his creditors.

Where he ſaith / yt is contrary to ſcripture becauſe S. Peter 2. Act. ſo ſoudenly defended the Apoſtels againſte the accuſation off dronkennes, as he coulde not tary for their voices: it is ridiculous. For I would know firſt / what teſtimonie of ſcripture he hath / to proue yt doon ſo ſoudenly. Then / who is ſo ſenſles as not to vnderſtand / that the eleuen ſtanding with him / could not in a trice ether by voice / or finger lifted vp / caſte that charge off ſpeaking then / vponupon Peter? ſo that onles he did as it were take the Iewes wordes owte off their mouth: no time could wante for that matter. He ſaith further / Act. the 1, and 15. conſidered, yt ſhal appeare allwaies Peters office to ſpeake firſte, and rule the action: and that he was at no time choſen therto by voices, much les at eueryevery particular meeting: which firſt is a groſſe petition off that in queſtion. Then if wee were not hable to ſhewe by the worde / that our S. Chriſte did not apoincte Peter cheife off the reſte: yet by what ether ſentence / or worde owte off the ſcripture is he hable to ſhewe / that he was appoincted gouernour by him ouer all the reſte / during his liffe? Thirdly / to leaue Actes 15. diſorderly alledged / which is to be handled in the very nexte diuiſion: let him ſhew vsus how he can proue / that S. Peter was cheif in that actiō of praier / where yt ys ſaid that all the Apoſtles lifted vp their voice. likewiſe in the election of the deacons: where the calling together Act. 4. 24Acts 4:24off the diſciples / the exhortacion vntounto them / the praier for the Deacons choſen / the laying on off handes is as indifferently Act. 6. 2. 3 4. 6.Acts 6:2Acts 6:3giuen to all the reaſte / as to Peter. All know that one conceiued the praier in the name off the reſte / that one was preſident in the election. But that that was Peter more then ether Iohn / or Iames / or any the reſte: can not be ſhewed by one title off ſcripture: yet our D. doth aſſure vsus / and (as he ſaith) owt off the ſcripture / that Peter was the lodeſman.

Where I ſhew / that to ſuppoſe Peter not choſen by the Apoſtels / to take vpō him the gouernmēt / is to doo him iniury: he anſwereth / he was appointed vntounto yt off God, and lawfully. As if to be appointed p. DCIXoff God / and lawfully / could not ſtand with the Apoſtels chuſing of him: or their electiō were not the electiō of God. For if he meane he was choſen to yt by Chriſte im̄ediatly: it is that in queſtion / wherof he bringeth not a lettre of proofe. But / this iudgemēt offmine hath no ground off ſcripture, or ether learned, or auncient autoritie. What ground off ſcripture I hauehave / let the reader iudge off that already / and to be alledged in the next diuiſ. For autoritie: I hauehave ſhewed that Muſculus (whom he hath made his pillor in Pag. 65,this behalfe) affirming that Peter vvas in many places the cheife, is againſte him which ſaith / he was alwaies cheife: and for me / as giuing therby to vnderſtand / that this cheiftie varied / and was ſometimes put vponupon other. Which is alſo confirmed by Caluin: Inſti. lib. 4 ca. 6. 5. ſect.who in ſaying / the Apoſtels gaue this vntounto Peter for the moſte parte, that he ſhould ſpeake firſte: confirmeth both that he had his preheminence off the Apoſtels / and that he had yt not alwaies. Secondly / I hauehave here alledged the Scoliaſte / that all vvas doone by commen conſente. Wherto he anſwereth / he ſaith not Peter was at eueryevery aſſembly choſen cheife: which is vaine. For if all were doone with conſente: then Peters foreſpeaking / a parte of that which was done / was likewiſe. What wil he ſay to Gratian / his good expounder? which in this cauſe is more fauorable then the Papiſtes he hath folowed / which fetch Peters cheifdome from our Sau. Chriſte: for he confeſſeth / that Peter vvas choſen by the Apoſtles. Wher owte off the ſcoliaſte I ſhewed / that this Diſtin. 21.preſidentſhip off Peter vvas not doone imperiouſly, vvith dominion, or povvre: he anſwereth no lawfull iuriſdiction, not of the king him ſelfe, is ſo. Which ſmelleth off Anabaptiſtrie / and is before confuted. For if the vvorde (imperiouſly) vvhichwhich I vſed / be taken often in euill parte: yet may not I beſeche yow a Prince / doe princelike? vvhichwhich is the vvorde the Scoliaſt vſeth. may not the higher power doo thinges vvith powre? both vvhichwhich the Scoliaſte denieth to hauehave bene done of Peter. But there is in ſuperioritie humilitie. If you meane that Princes muſte be humbly minded / I graunte: but yf you meane that humilitie in Princes / will not ſuffer to commaund Princelike / in thinges lawfull: I denie yt.

p. DCXHe addeth / that in rule and autoritie (meaning ciuill) there is ſeruitude. If he meane to the lorde / I graunte: and then yt is nothing to the pourpoſe. If that Kinges are ſeruantes vntounto their peoples / 1. cha. off this Tra.which onelyonly can hauehave place here: I denie yt / for the cauſe before aſſigned. Where wee ſee againe how the D. as if he led Princes in a ſtringe / maketh them to beare vp my Lorde Archbiſhops traine. For ſeing he ſeeth yt denied him to rule princelike / or with powre: for ſhifte off anſwer he wreſteth the ſcepter owte of their hand / ſaying the king him ſelfe may not doe ſo. yf the Scoliaſt had ſaid that Peter did nothing tyrannically / nothing with oppreſſion / which two are aſwel denied vntounto Princes / as to biſhops: then the D. anſwer would hauehave ſerued. But when he ſaith / he did nothing foreign.princelike, nothing by povvr: yt is manifeſt he tawght / that the rule lawfull in Princes ouer their ſubiectes / was not meete for Peter ouer the other Apoſtels. Where he addeth / the Scoliaſte ſaith Peter roſe, &c. as one that had receiued the Preſidentſhip of the Apoſtels: to let pas his tranſlation / which in ſteed off diſciples vnderſtanded foreign.of all the church / hath put Apoſtles which was peculier then to the 11. he doth but daly. For I deny not that Peter had receiued yt: but that he had yt giuen off our Sau. Chriſte immediatly / or during his liffe (both which are in controueſie:) there is not a worde. Where in the entrance off this diuiſ. he ſaith / Peter was in all ſuch aſſemblies the cheife, and in an other place / he was the cheife in eueryevery matter: and for proufe ſaith / the moſte off the old eccleſaſticall writers / in that reſpecte counte him cheife of the Apoſtels: yt had pag. 68.bene good he had ſhewed at the leaſte one. I cōfeſſe that there are ould writers which call him ſo: but that they doo yt in that reſpecte, I denie. for the cheifty they giuegive him ouer the reſte / was for his ſingular zeale / and other giftes: not as he ſaith for that he had autoritie ouer them.

For proofe wherof I will propound him / firſte that aaIerom. aduerſ. Pelag.Peter was Prince of the Apoſtels / as Plato was of the Philoſophers: likewiſe that he bbBulling. Dec. 5. ſe.was Prince off the Apoſtels / as Moſes / Helias / Dauid / Iſay off the Prophetes. Now if Plato were ruler / or had the commaundement off other Philoſophers / or if Moſes of p. DCXIthe Prophetes that cam after his death: then Peter alſo might hauehave the ſame ouer the Apoſtels, but if they be therfore ſo called / becauſe they excelled the reſte in giftes: then yt is cleare / that thes fathers eſtemed not Peter chiefe / for any powre or autorny ouer the reſte. An other ſaith / aaCypr. de ſymplici. praelat.Peter vvas that the reſte off the Apoſtels vvere, off like not office onelyonly / but honour and povvre: directly contrary to D. bbpag. 320.vvhere he preferreth Peter in honour: and contrary to that he both here / and pag. 68. althowghe not in the ſame in wordes / yet indeed doth affirme. Thirdly / it is to be noted / that heere the D. hande is againe with Harding againſte c Artic. 4. diuiſ. 31.the biſhop: to whom alledging that Peter had powre ouer the reſte off the Apoſtels / the biſhop anſwereth: Peter vvas chiefe off the APoſtels as Ariſtippus is called chiefe off Philoſophers: that is, the firſte, or beſte man off the company: where he denieth that S. Peter was ether lord, or Prince, or had povvre, or vvas gouernour ouer the reſte off thapoſtels. He addeth / from this opinion that Peter in all ſuch aſſemblies and in all matters moderated the reſte, was chiefe, and ſpake firſt, the late writers diſſent not. If he meane the Inſtit. 4. l. 6. ca. ſe 5. Bullin. 5. dec. 3. ſer. Bez. vpō 1. Act. Gualt. vpō. 1 Act.Papiſtes / I graunt: if the Catholike / he bringeth not / nor (as I thincke) can bring ſo much as one / which ſaith ſo. Here he hath the biſhop againſte him / to whom may be added Caluin / Bullinger / Beza / Gualter / with others.

Wher I ſhew that Iames ruled the action Act. 15. and not Peter, conſidering that he pronounced the ſentence vvherunto the reſt agreed: he ſaith / firſt that Peter ſpake before the reſte, which is vntrew, for there was great diſputacion off both ſides before d Diu. 48. pag 395. verſ 7.Peter ſpake▪ therfore yt muſte needes be / that the cawſe was propounded by ſome before. And ſo yt is friuolous he alledgeth owt off Caluin / to proue Peter proloquutor, for that he ſtoode vponupon this eſpecially that he mighte declare theſtate of the queſtion. as yf the Apoſtels Synode were ſo confuſed / that a great parte of it was ſpente / or euer the company were informed of the ſtate off the queſtion. Wheras Caluin meaneth / that S. Peter confirmed pithely / the trwth in that queſtion: and not that he trauailed to ſhew wherin the queſtion conſiſted / as appeareth by Peters p. DCXIIwhole oration. So that Saint Peters oration is firſte ſet downe / not for that he ſpake firſte: but for that he was the firſt amongeſte the Apoſtels / and Elders / which S. Luke thowght good to commit to writing. It is alſo childiſh that Peter was moderator, becauſe he ſpake after there was great diſputacion: as if eueryevery one which cometh betwene two parties ſtriuing to draw thē to concord / hath autoritie ouer them: conſidering that ther is not a worde in Peters oration / which giueth the leaſt ynckling off ſuche autoritie. beſide that to helpe him ſelfe / he ſhamfully ſlaundreth foreign.the Apoſtels Synode / attributing vntounto yt a tumult, and bitter contention: where S. Luke ſaith onelyonly greate diſputacion, which may well be withowt both. Whether yt be cuſtome off Synodes for the moderator to ſpeake laſte / and ſo to ponounce the ſentence gathered vponupon the former voices: I leaue yt to the iudgement off the reader / referring him alſo to that the biſhop writeth in this behalfe: who proueth (againſt Harding / which will hauehave Peter Defence of the Apol. 6. part cap. 4. diuiſ. 2. Hierar. 3. li. ca. 10. In 3. Tra.cheife) that Iames vvas chief, becauſe he gaue the definitiue ſentence. Wherby alſo appeareth that this came ether from Pigghius / or Harding / or from ſome ſuche popiſhe fen.

After admiting Iames Moderator / he faithe being then biſhop by the Scoliaſtes iudgement, yt was not vnmeete he ſhould be moderator within his charge. I hauehave ſhewed that an Apoſtle can not be changed into a biſhop: and if he coulde / yet yt was vnmeete that S Peter ſhould leefe his right / wherto (he ſaith) he was ordeined off God, to vſe from thaſcention vntounto his dying day Therfore it is againſt him directlie: but how againſt me, he nether doth / nor cā ſhew. Beſide / it is abſurde that an Apoſtle ſhoulde giuegive place vntounto a biſhop / becauſe the biſhop is in his charge: conſidering that an Apoſtle is in his charge / in what churche ſoeuer he come / and that as an Apoſtle: to whom the biſhop (vnleſſe he were by conſent choſen to gouerne the ſynode) owght to giuegive place. And if yt be trew that it is meete the biſhop of the place where the ſynode is houlden, ſhould gouerne the ſynode: why hath he made this before a neceſſarie cauſe off In 12. diu. pag. 364.hauing an archbiſhop / to gouerne Synodes? The other place off the Actes / makethe for this matter. For if Iames aſſembled the lders / and ruled that meeting wherin it was determined what S. Paule p. DCXIIIſhould doo / him ſelfe being preſent / which was (as ſhall appere) in nothing inferior vntounto Peter): he might by the ſame right moderate the aſſemblie in Peters preſence. Where I ſhew that Diuiſ. 49. Pag. 396.this is the ſuperioritie which is amōgeſt biſhops / and miniſters: he anſwereth / yt is ſo, but not all. But owt of the ſcripture (wheroff the queſtion is here) he neither doth / nor can ſhew other ſuperioritie: ſo that here his cauſe faleth flat.

Wher I alledged Maiſter Caluin / that one off the Apoſtles Diuiſ. 50. pag. 396.indefinitelie, not any one ſingular perſon, had the moderation off the reſt: he anſwereth owt off him / that it vvould not be abſurde if vve confeſſe, that the Apoſtels gaue preheminence vntounto Peter. Which is but daliaunce. For he affirmeth ſimply / that aaCalu. Epiſt. ad Reg. Polo. pa. 140our Sauiour Chriſt meant nothing leſſe, then to make Peter cheife off the reſte off the Apoſtels. bbInſtit. li. 4 6. cap. ſect. 7.Here Hauing proued that Peter vvas nothing els, but one of the tvvelue, that he vvas equall vntounto them, their fellowe not their lord, that they had as muche povver ouer him, as he ouer them: he diſputeth that if it were graunted which the Papiſtes require / off Peters being Prince off the Apoſtles (which he vtterlie deniethe): yet yt followethe not which they would conclude / off a Pope. Likewiſe he daliethe / in ſhewing what autoritie the Conſull off Rome, and maſters of Colledges hauehave: adding that tharchbiſhop is content with leſſe. Where Caluin compareth the moderator in the miniſters meeting / with the conſulſhip not in all pointes / but onelyonly in this / that he ſhould propound the matters / &c. as before. Which appeareth in an other in diui. 38 pag. 385. 4 li. 4. ca. 2. ſect.place / and euen in this verie place when he ſaith / yt is meete that althovvghe they be all off equall povver, yet there ſhould be one as yt vvere moderator. And therfore if yow woulde hauehave made yowr archbiſhops according to Caluins meaſure. he owght to hauehave no more preheminence before the ſimpleſt paſtor / then the Conſull which ſpake / had before his fellow Conſull which helde his peace. Wher he ſaith / the prolocutor choſen for the inferior ſort of clergie, yet the Archbiſhop reteineth ſtill his office: yt ſhewethe that he is now but an idoll / hauing put ouer the duty to other / for which he is ſuppoſed to hauehave bene ſo neceſſarie. But yt is manifeſt that the p. DCXIIIIProlocutor in the ſynode hathe all that preheminence / which Peter had aboue the other Apoſtels: and therfore which one paſtor owght to hauehave aboue an other / which is that I browght yt for. The next I anſwere not.

Where I ſhew his vaine argument / that one biſhop ſhoulde be aboue an other, becauſe Paule an APoſtle was aboue Timothe an Euangeliſt: Diuiſ. 52. pag 373.he ſaith that yt houldethe, becauſe they differ not in the adminiſtring off the the worde, and ſacramentes, but in gouernement. Which is vntrew: for they differed in both alike. For as they differed from the Apoſtles / in that they gouerned thoſe onelyonly churches ouer which they were ſet / where the Apoſtles gouernement ſtretched vntounto all churches: ſo they could not adminiſter the worde and ſacramentes / but where they were appointed / where the Apoſtles might do yt in all places. But for further confutation off this diſtinction / I In Diui. 27. p 314.referre me to that before. Where I ſhew his argument all one with this: my Lord maior is aboue the Sherifes, therfore one ſherife is aboue an other: he ſaith I ſhould hauehave concluded that becauſe my Lord Maior hath rule ouer the cytiſens, therfore the Apoſtels ſuperioritie ouer an inferior degree off miniſterie, proueth that one in the ſame degre of miniſterie may rule ouer an other: Which is to ridiculous. For if it were (as it is not) a good argument from ciuill gouernement vntounto eccleſiaſticall: yet to ſaie that therfore one eccleſiaſticall officer may beare rule ouer an other / yea that one may beare rule ouer his fellowes off the ſame order / becawſe the magiſtrate beareth rule ouer priuate men / cleaneth togither as goates dounge. So that if there were any argument here / yt ys / that as my Lord maior ruleth ouer the cytiſens: ſo yt behouethe the paſtor to rule ouer his flocke. The next diuiſiō is ccIn 2. ca. off this Tract.anſwered. ddDiui. 54. pag. 399.Wher he calledged Calu. that vppon that Paul willed Titus to appoint Elders / ſaithe Titus was in autoritie and counſell aboue other Paſtors: and I oppoſed Calu. which ſheweth that he did nothing in that behalfe vvithovvt the aduiſe off other paſtors, and conſent off the churches: he aſkethe whotly ſtill for anſwere. As if it were not anſwered eſpecially when I ſhewed before / that the ſuperioritie that miniſters can hauehave in ſuche meetinges / is onelyonly to propounde &c. as is before declared. Which Calu. do the expreſly ſet forthe p. DCXVin the ſame place / when he ſaith: S. Paule commaunded him onelyonly vponupon Tit. 1. Diuiſ. 55. pag. 399.Titus 1to be preſident or moderator in the election.

The two firſt ſections how ſhamefullie they be ſaid / I leaue to the readers iudgement: in the laſt / againſt that I alledged owt off the Scoliaſte / that Paule would not hauehave one rule the whole Ile / and therfore not Titus: is browght firſt an expoſition gone abowte to be confirmed off him / and Chryſoſtome / which ſay that Paule committed vntounto Titus Crete, and to Timothie almoſte all Aſia. As yf that might not well ſtand with that / that Titus gouerned one citie alone. for in that they had autoritie giuen them / to appoint miniſters in forme aforeſaid / in all that circuite / vntill the churche there were fully eſtabliſhed / and a lawfull miniſterie throwghly planted▪ there charge in that reſpecte / extended yt ſelfe to that whole circuite. But when the countrey was deuided into ſeuerall churches / and eueryevery churche had a lawfull / and complete miniſtery: he charge before generall / is now reſtrained vntounto that one churche where Titus made his abode. Euen as euerie off the 12. Princes / and Aaron which deuided the land off Canaan / had before partition a certein power off all: which after lottes caſt had onelyonly to do with that / which apperteined to them in ſeuerall. A thowgh yf yt be graunted that Titus and Timothe continued that large gouernement / during their abode there / wherin I will not ſtriue): yet conſidering as hathe bene ſhewed they were Euangeliſtes / and no Biſhops / nor Archbiſhops: there can nothing grow to them hereby. For as no man can hauehave gouernement ouer all the churches which the Apoſtels had / but they that hauehave that ſpeciall office: ſo none can ſuccede into the iuriſdiction off Euangeliſtes / but they onelyonly which hauehave that extraordinarie miniſterie. And therfore Caluin in the place before cited off the D. ſaith / there vvas not then ſuche equalitie, &c. but that one did rule ouer an other: noting by the word then (which the D. hathe vnfaithfully left owt) that the gouernemēt which Titus had in Creta / was for thoſe times when ther were ſuche extraordinarie callinges.

Wher he ſaith / in ſtreightening Titus to one church, I make him paſtor, Diuiſ. 56. pag. 400.which I donie: let him learne that to hauehave charge in one church alone / p. DCXVInot a paſtor / vnles he be ſo tied that he can not departe / withowt the churche loſe his bonde. Which neither Titus was / nor is by any word affirmed off me. Whether the reſt be ſhamels accuſations / let the reader iudge. The next / althowghe vnworthy of anſwer / being but bare affirmacions againſt my reaſons / is anſwered eein 2. Tra. Diuiſ. 1. Pag 197.before As for that thoſe wordes receiue no accuſations, &c. muſt needes be vnderſtanded of one which hathe other elders vnderneathe him, and therfore not off euerie paſtor: yt argueth that the D. is ſpent. For he knowethe that we hould that eueryevery paſtor had his elders aſſiſtan: which hath / and ſhall (God willing) appeare. Beſides that it argueth his ignorance off the ſtate of the elder churches: wher (as hathe bene ſhewed) biſhops ſat in iudgement off other biſhops / ād elders not vnderneath them. That ther be not a hundreth 1. Tim. 3. 2. & 4. 12. & 5. 10. Tit. 2. 2 Diuiſ. 59. pag. 402.1 Tim 3:21 Tim 4:121 Tim 5:10Titus 2:2ſeuerall preceptes, in the three epiſtles to Timothe, and Titus (wheras in diuers verſes there be ſixe / or ſeuen) doth well become his bouldnes. Againſt reaſon alledged owt off Auguſtine / that the place owt off Epiphanius was of ſome falſe Epiphanius: here is nothing but autoritie. Howbeit not to ſtriue for this: before I come to anſwere yt is to be noted / that this is Pigghius reaſon againſt the churche off God / euen in the verie ſelfe ſame cauſe which we hauehave now in hād / towching this ſort of biſhops. For againſt the Waldenſes firſte / and after againſt Wickleue / which put no difference betwene a biſhop / and a prieſt: ccPigghius. Hierar. 2 lib. 10. ca.Pigghius hath a treatiſe in his Hierarche / wherin he preſſethe them with this teſtimonie of Epiphanius. And further ſaith of Wickleue / that therfore he tooke away the difference betwene biſhop / and elder / becauſe he could not obteine the biſhoprick of Worceſter. and in ddlib controuerſ. 16. contr.an other booke inueigheth ſharplie againſt them / for that they would hauehave neither Pope / nor primate / nor Archbiſhop / nor Biſhop.

And that yt may yet appeare euen to the ſimple reader / that they had the ſame cauſe againſt Pigghius / and the Papiſtes which we againſt the D. I offer to his conſideration / beſides the two flat teſtimonies of M Barnes ād Hooper eein the preface to the 3. cap.before cyted / M. Wickleues tenthe article in thes wordes ffM. FoxTher be 12 diſciples of Antichriſt: Popes, Cardinalles, Patriarckes, Archbiſhopes, Biſhops, p. DCXVIIArchedeacons, Officials, Deanes, Monkes, Chanons, Fryers and Pardoners. If the D. ſay that Wickleue ſpake that not off the offices / but off their abuſe in popery: that ſhift will not ſerue / cōſidering that he leaueth owt prieſtes / and Deacons. Wherof the prieſt eſpecially / doing more miſcheife then diuerſe which are reckened: yet becauſe he occupied the place off the paſtor in eueryevery congregacion / which was the ordinance off God / and was onelyonly a deprauacion / and deformitie off the trew miniſterie: he ſpareth him. the other becauſe they were deuiſed / partlie herbingers to prepare his way / partly puruc…ers to interteine his eſtate: he marked with the black cole off Antichriſtianitie. Yf yt be further ſaid / that Wickleue ſhould by this meanes condemne the eſtate off a biſhop / vvhichwhich S. Paule alloweth off: yt is manifeſt that he bet againſt the lord biſhop / which ruleth ouer other miniſters in adioceſe: cōſidering that he leaueth the prieſt / the deformitie of the teaching miniſter / which miniſter is all one (as hath bene ſhewed) with S. Paules Biſhop. Beſide this reaſon / they may as well ſaye he ſpake not againſt the office off Pope / Chanons / Monkes / Friars / Pardoners / but onelyonly againſt the abuſe: which is abſurde. This to the learned may better appeare by Pigghius diſcourſe: which confeſſeth that the Waldenſes / and Wickleue left the orde… off prieſthode (as they call yt) and that the whole queſtion betwene them was not whether lord biſhops / and Archbiſhops did their dutie / but whether they were lawfull eſtates. Wherby appearethe that whoſoeuer was the D. marchant / theſe wares come from one off the filthieſt puddels off popery: and withall that as ſone almoſt / as there was any ſet and apparant eſtate of the churche / which proclaimed open warre againſt Antichriſt / the letters off defiaunce were as well ſent againſt the In lib aduerſ. papat. a Satana fundat. vel Parochis. 1. Cor. 12. Rom. 12.1 Cor 12Rom 12Archbiſhop / and longehanded biſhop / as againſt the Pope.

Luther alſo after them / writethe thus: Biſhops vvherſoeuer they be in all the vvorlde, are equall to our biſhops, or pariſhe miniſters, and preachers: of none cā yt be ſaid one is lord, an other a ſeruant: they are off the ſame iudgement, and vvhatſoeuer belongethe to the churche, equally belongeth to all except that (vvhichwhich Paule teacheth) ſome preacher or Chriſtian p. DCXVIIImay be off a ſounder faith then other, hauehave greater giftes then another, interprete the ſcripture better then an other, rule better then an other, preache better, and hauehave the diſcretion off ſpirites more then an other &c. hovvbeit ſuche giftes cauſe no inequalitie, or lordſhip in the church Here I will alſo ſet downe the iudgement off the reformed churches in Heluetia / Zurich / Berne / Geneua / Polonia / Hungery / Scotland / &c. who hauing reckened the miniſtries ſpecified in ſcriptures / add: in the times in their confeſsion.follovving ther vvere many other titles off miniſters brovvght into the churche For ſome vvere ordeined Patriarckes, ſome Archbiſhops, other Suffraganes, alſo metropolitanes, Archelders, &c. but for all thoſe vve paſſe not ether vvhat they vvere in times paſt, or are novv: the Apoſtels doctrine of the miniſters is ſufficient for vsus. Yf all theſe churches make no accounte off theſe offices / not onelyonly as they are now / but when they were at the beſt if they eſteme them withowt the doctrine of the Apoſtles: I leaue to the readers iudgement what eſtimacion they had off them / and how the D. woulde abuſe vsus / that drawethe the ſentences of the cheif in this cōfeſſion / to proue their conueniēce. Neither do I dowbt but that our Archebiſhops / and Biſhops refuſing to ioyne with the reſt off the churches in this confeſſion / did it becauſe they could not digeſt this morſell eſpeciall.

Now to come to the D. that ſaith / Epiphanius calleth vsus heretickes: which pinchethe vsus. maſter Wickleue / and the pore Waldenſes bare yt at Pigghius hand / we muſt do yt at the D. in dede ſo muche more pinching / as yt commethe from him / from whom yt leaſt owght. But what remedy: the Lord will looke to it in time. Howbeit becauſe this arrow is (as yt is ſaid) of Epiphanius a man ſubiecte to error / ſhot owt off Pigghius bow / one giuen vpp to error / hauing no heade off the worde of God to make yt enter: yt may peraduenture raiſe the ſkin / but wounde yt can not make. But Auguſtine reckenethe yt ſo: but Auguſtine reporteth what he found written. for towching his owne iudgement he is flat againſt Epiphanius: which maketh a biſhop ād an elder differ by the Apoſtels inſtitution / wheras Auguſtin (as I hauehave ſhewed) p. DCXIXin 16. diu. pag. 169.teacheth euen as Ierome / that this difference was not by the word of God / but by cuſtome. now I would know of the D. how Auguſtin can houlde that for an hereſie / which (to leaue the reſt) can not be conuinced by the word off God / but onelyonly by a cuſtome off the churche. And here firſt he muſt either let goe his hould of Ierome / or this of Epiphanius. For if yt be trw that Epiphanius houldeth / that a biſhop and an elder differ by the Apoſtels inſtitution: then it is falſe which Ierome and others hould / that they were all one at the firſt / and that the difference came by cuſtome. Contrariwiſe if Ierome in that point ſay true (as in dede he dothe): then Epiphanius authoritie falleth. Secondly / yf the D. will preiudice this cauſe / for that Epiphanius a Catholike thowght them to differ by the word off God / where Aerius an heretike thowght them all one / or els in that Auguſtin reckeneth that amongeſt his hereſies: by the ſame reaſon he muſt preiudice this trwthe / that we owght not to praie / or make any oblation for the dead. For both aalib. 3: Tom. 1. 75. haereſ.Epiphan. eſtemed him an heretike for his iudgement in that behalfe: and bbad quod vult Deū haereſ. 53.Auguſtin reporteth this as one off his hereſies / which is catholike doctrine. So that Pigghius might vſe this autoritie better / which condemnethe as well the one / as the other: then the D. which houldethe (as I thincke) for Catholike / that which Aerius the hereticke affirmed / and for hereticall / which Epiphanius the Catholike condemned.

The flower off Epiphanius reaſons / browght before / is anſwered: now the D. diſtreſſed / bringeth forth tag ād rag. for towching Epiphanius ſaying (the biſhop by impoſition off handes begetteth fathers 1. teachers to the churche, vvhere the prieſtes begate onelyonly ſonnes: yt is but aſking off that in queſtion / when Aerius holding them both one by Gods inſtitution: the impoſition off handes belonging vntounto the biſhop / muſte nedes be affirmed to apperteine vntounto the elder. neither doth Epiphanius anſwer the reaſon owt off S Paule / that Timothe was ordeined cc1. Tim. 4. 141 Tim 4:14by impoſition off handes off the companie off elders. Likewiſe that browght off a biſhop aboue an elder, becauſe dd1. Tim. 5 11 Tim 5:1S. Paule vvilleth Timothe not to rebuke an elder: to let goo other faultes as many as are wordes in the ſentence / yt is abſurde that p. DCXXhe referreth that vntounto an elder by office / which is ſpoken of an elder by yeares / and referreth that to the publicke miniſter which is vnderſtanded onelyonly off a priuate membre off the churche: as appeareth manifeſtly by the oppoſition off a yong man / and after off the elder woman. So I leaue to be eſtemed / what good cauſe the D. hath to couer his face / in that wheroff he ſo greatly vaunteth. The next diuiſion is aaTract. 3. cap. 3 de Euangeliſt, &c.anſwered. In the next / I leaue it to the reader whether the D. order hath the heeles vpward: which after endeuoure to ſhew the neceſſitie / the cauſes / yea the examples off a thinge / ſetteth him ſelfe to proue that it was. Althowgh if this be his trim order / he hath kept it euill. for Chryſoſtome browght for confirmacion off the firſt / comethe after Ierome / which is browght to beare vp his ſeconde. bb61. diui. pag 409.That Ignatius biſhop was but off one particular congregation onelyonly / I ccin the praef. to the 3. ca. off this Tractat.hauehave ſhewed: and therfore the wordes (ouer all) preſſed off the D. as they are off dd4. lib, 1. ca Hiera.Pigghius from whence this was taken / are vnderſtanded of thoſe within his particular churche. Beſides / the kinde of ſpeach may be eaſelier drawen vntounto the whole worlde / then off a dioceſe / or prouince: for the reaſon aſſigned in my eediuiſ. 7. pag. 357.former booke: That the biſhop owght to be aboue the elders which onelie gouerned / and deacons: is confeſſed. yf he were aboue the teaching elders / that was by cuſtome: whether good or bad / let it be iudged off that ſaid. Howbeit that that be graunted: yt maketh nothing to proue a biſhop ouer a dioceſe / muche leſſe an Archbiſhop.

When the biſhop in euerie church / or (to ſpeake as the D.) in euerie dioceſe, was the Cheife / aboue whom there coulde not by Diuiſ. 62. pag. 409.this Ignatius be any higher biſhop in earthe: I leaue yt to the readers iudgement how abſurde the D. is / who ſaith that Ignatius dothe not ouerthrow his Archiſhop. for therby he affirmeth / that albeit the biſhop off the Dioceſe were the higheſt biſhop that coulde be vponupon earthe: yet there might be an other higher then he. Alſo how fonde he is in his reaſon / that for as muche as an archbiſhop is a biſhop: therfore Ignatius allowing one, allowethe the other. When yt is manifeſt by his owne confeſſion / that Ignatius ſpeaketh off one onelyonly ſort off biſhops / either of one particular church / as the trwthe p. DCXXIis: or off one dioceſe / as he imagineth. So that his argument is / Ignatius allowethe one ſort off biſhops: therfore the Archbiſhop. all one as if a man ſhould ſay / he hath a kinde off fiſhe in his moate / therfore a whale fiſhe.

The D. detected / in that Iuſtins preſident was neither biſhop Diuiſ. 63. Pag. 410.off dioceſe / nor Archbiſhop off Prouince / but of one congregation: for excuſe ſaith / he browght the place to proue there might be ſuperioritie ouer the miniſters. Where firſt his trim order, that all my logicke, and Rhetoricke is not able to moue, is too pitifull. for how childiſhe is yt / after ſo long trauaile to proue a biſhop ouer the miniſters off a dioceſe / and tharchbiſhop of a Prouince / in the ende to endeuour to proue / that ther may be ſuperioritie? as if any man would denie this that graunted the other: and yt is to ſet the fondacion vponupon the louer. yet I would know off him what meanethe the word (this) wherby appeareth not onelie that he browght yt to proue ſuperioritie: but the ſuperioritie either off a biſhop ouer a whole dioceſe / or an Archbiſhop ouer a Prouince: conſidering that this is the ſuperiority which he ſpeake of before / and im̄ediatelie after. Secondly where I bothe by the vſe of the ſcriptures / and auncient writers ſhewed the word Brethren, not taken for the gouernours but the people: obſerue how vainly he anſwerth / that Iuſtine meant the miniſters, and deacons by brethren, becauſe he calleth the people after by the name off people. As if the reſt off the church were not called both in ſcripture / ād other writers / by diuerſe names. Thirdly how if it be graunted / that Iuſtins preſidēt had ſuperioritie ouer the miniſter: yet how fondly yt is concluded / that yt is lawfull / becauſe yt was. Then how his weapons fetched from Maiſter Beza / hauehave alwaies their edge towarde him / and his cauſe. For he alledgeth him to proue that Iuſtins preſident did gouerne the reſte / and had the name off biſhop: which in the ſame place flatly condemneth that pollicie / as is declared. Laſtly / in 33. diu. Pag. 347.how by this anſwer / he maketh euerie paſtor off a congregacion to handle the gouernemen: which before he tooke from him / when he ſhutteth him vp in the adminiſtracion of the word / and ſamentes only.

Iuſtines writinges compared as I compared them / with p. DCXXIIthe holie ſcripture / are as I ſaid a ditche: I added the reaſon / that ther was in them not a litle mudd off errors / which the D. could not anſwer: otherwiſe I acknowledge him both godlie / and learned. Maiſter Beza ſought not the word preſident in Iuſtine, but ſheweth how Timothe did the office at Epheſus / which Iuſtines preſident did: which was meete / conſidering he had a higher miniſterie then any there. So that althowgh Timothe aboue the degree off a biſhop / kept that preſidentſhip continually during his abode: yet there was no reaſon that one Paſtor off the ſame degree with other / ſhould take that vponupon him. Yf he were the true Ignatius / he ſhould in dede be before Iuſtin: but to let paſſe other exceptions / withe M. Caluins ſharpe cenſure off him: yt is abſurde to aſcribe to Ignatius S Iohns ſcholer / that vaine boaſte / off being able to aaIgnat. ad …ral.expound the orders off Angells / their varieties / the diſtinctions and differēces betwene vertues / powers / Thrones / &c. bbDiui 64 pag. 411.That prieſt is no fit name for a miniſter off the goſpell, is towched after: that the names proper to our S. Chriſt / can be cōmunicated with man / is abſurd / and before confuted: where alſo the name off Prince / a peace off Prince off Prieſtes, is ſhewed vnfit foreignfer the miniſtery. That there may be one Archbiſhop ouer biſhops / as there is one biſhop ouer paſtors / hathe no parte trw / as hathe bene ſhewed: onelyonly let yt be noted / that the reaſon here for the Archbiſhop / is ccDefence Apol. part. 5. c. 6. Diui. 1.Hardinges for the Pope.

ddDiui. 65. 66. pag. 41….This argument browght eediuiſ. 18. Pag. 332.before and ffpag 471after / to proue our Archbiſhops iuriſdiction (that one had care of the whole Prouince) here is purſued. wherunto I anſwer here / that care dothe not neceſſarily draw iuriſdiction / or rule ouer that cared for: ſeing that there is no miniſter (I might hauehave ſaid alſo no magiſtrate) yea no priuate membre / which owght not to hauehave / and ſhew forthe a care / off all the churches which are in Chriſtendome / eueryevery one according to the meanes which the lord hath giuen. The Prince with his power / the miniſter with his conforte / and inſtruction / the priuate man with the wealthe God hath bleſſed him withe / at the leaſt with his praier: the communion off ſainctes / and fellowfeeling in the members off one bodie / requiring this. Hereoff we hauehave example in gg1. Tom. Concil. carth. 3.Aurelius / which ſaith he had p. DCXXVcare off all churches. Bouins a Popiſhe friar / or Monke I well remembre not whether / tawght in this point in the ſame ſchole with the D. in eſteming that care off churches implied rule: leaſt the biſhop off Rome ſhould be hurte by that ſpeache / expoundeth all churches, all in Affricke. Our D. ^h alledging this place / becauſe in taking care in his ſence / for rule with authoritie / he ſhould pag. 471.in trauailing with the Archbiſhop hauehave browght vsus forth a Pope: in ſteede off all churches, putteth many churches. ſo that he wil neuer want: for if his places be to ſtreite for his Archbiſhops meaſure / he ſettethe them vponupon the teinter hookes: if to wide / he laiethe them in water and ſhrinkethe them. But what ſhoulde I ſtand in confuting this? ſeing yt is ſo farr off that care prouethe rule / and dominion: that it is ſene not onelyonly in one equall ouer an other / but euen in ſeruantes ouer their maſters. As for that that is ſaid / Chryſoſtomes care reſtreined here to certeine places, can not be vnderſtanded off ſuche a generall care as comprehendeth all churches: I anſwer that the care off his owne churche being properly commended vntounto him / it is mete that as the churches next doo moſt affecte his / bettering it commonly yf they be good / making yt worſe if they be nawght: ſo in that generall care ouer the reſt / ther ſhould be ſuche diſpenſation / as to hauehave a greater care ouer thoſe / then ouer the reſt: as we ſee in wiſe Princes / more carefull off the borderers / then off thoſe further remoued from them. In which degre yt is not vnproperlie ſpoken / that he had the care off ſuche churches rather then off all.

His foure notes owt off Theodoret / depend vponupon theſe wodes (the ſame care): ſo that yf yt fall owt that Chryſoſtome had not the ſame rule ouer Thracia / Aſia / &c. which he had ouer Conſtantinople: then thoſe wordes ſpoken off the gouernement he had in that citie / are idle to proue the ſame in Thracia / &c. But firſt the D. crieth owt of corruption, crafte, and either ignorance, or malice. good wordes Maiſter D. I pray yow. For ignorance yt is no greate matter / I am content yow ſay that I borowed two greeke wordes off my neighbours. But why corruption, &c? did I not ſet downe wordes ſufficient to confute your vntrew dealing / which in ſtede of care / put downe rule? was p. DCXXIIIII bownd to ſet downe more in greke / then yow ſurmiſed in Engliſhe? yea could I hauehave ſet downe the worde yow require / with any ſence vntounto the reader: vnles I had ſet downe (as yow now) the whole ſtory / and ſo hauehave giuen your cauſe greater coulour then your ſelfe knew of then? I helpe yow diuerſe times with argumentes which yow make much of: but will yow binde me to do ſo alwaies? I hauehave more coulour to crie out of yow / which to proue In the next din.Chryſoſtome gouernour of theſe places / voluntarily cite Socrates trippinglie / vvinding vp in thes wordes (et caetera) vvhichwhich is your ruine / and which manifeſtly confuteth the largenes yow ſuppoſe off the biſhop off Conſiantinoples metropolitaneſhip. Therfore ſeing this bitternes muſt be vented / yow at leaſt ſhould hauehave waited ſome better opportunitie. now let vsus ſee vvhether theſe wordes (he had the ſame care ouer Thracia, &c that he had ouer the churche off Conſtantinople) vvill intitle Chriſoſtome lawfully to as great authoritie ouer one / as ouer the other. For the diſcuſſing vvheroff I muſt by thy good leaue gentle reader / fetche this matter ſomewhat higher.

The aaSocr. li. 5. ca. 8.Councell off Nice / bounding and butting the metropolitaneſhips decreed / that the biſhop of Conſtantinople (vvhichwhich it calleth the greate citie) ſhould be metropolitane ouer Thracia / certeine other ouer Pontus / others ouer Aſia: to the nombre off ten metropolitaneſhips. This order was confirmed by other councels off Conſtantinople / and Epheſus / as they are bbVieler. de ſtatu Primit.obſerued: and continued vntill the councell off Calcedon vvhichwhich moſte confuſedly / and diſorderedly throwghe extreme Ambition off the biſhop off Conſtantinople / drowned almoſte all theſe ten / in his one onlie ſea. Where alſo yt was ordeined by the ſame Councell of Nice / that the Metropolitanes ſhoulde be off equall power / and not one vnderunder an other: this Councel made one Metropolitane ouer a nombre. Where further it was ordeined by diuerſe Councells / as hath partely before / and partely may appeare by ^c Theodoret / lib. 5. 23 cap.that the Metropolitane off euerye Prouince / ſhoulde be choſen by the biſhops theroff: this Councell maketh the biſhop of Conſtantinople / to hauehave the appointement off all metropolitaneſhips / within the compas alledged by the D. Moreouer where the ſame Nicene Councell / with ſundrie others ordeined / that p. DCXXVthe biſhops of the Prouince at the leaſt three / ſhould be at the ordinacion off euerie biſhop: this Councell giuegive the yt in the biſhops off the Barbarians (meaning as I ſuppoſe Scithians) vntounto him off Conſtantinople. Now if the D. will make Chryſoſtome acceſſary vntounto this famous robberie / if giltie off all this confuſion / and diſorder off the breache off ſo many Canons off the Nicene / and other Councels / and finally if he will make him a Pope: he dothe him that iniurie which I would be lothe. For where vntounto me / alledging that if he vvere Archbiſhop off all thes churches, he vvas off moe then euer the Pope, in his greateſt pride: he anſwereth that I am greatly deceiued, for that Phocas the Emperour made all theſe churches, and all other ſubiecte to the Pope, and appointed him head off all: I anſwere that he is greatly deceiued. Conſidering that the Empire being deuided into the eaſt / and weaſt Empire / more then 250. yeares before Phocas made Boniface the third Pope: Phocas coulde not hauing his Empire for the moſt part in the eaſte / where the churches were moſt ruined / make all or halfe the churches ſubiecte vntounto Boniface. So that yt ys manifeſt that Chryſoſtome (by his ſaying) metropolitane off all Aſia, and a good parte off Europe: muſt needes hauehave moe vnderunder him / then Pope Boniface. What the Pope claimed, is nothing to that I ſet downe: which ſpake preciſely off that he was / and not off that he claimed to be. Therfore if he build vponupon Chryſoſtomes ſuppoſed metropolitaneſhip: he doth manifeſtly allow a larger circuite vntounto a biſhop / then euer any Pope had.

Yf I would hauehave ſought to hauehave diſcredited Chryſoſtome: I might hauehave anſwered that yt was no meruaile / thowghe he exerciſed ſuche dominion / conſidering that bothe Socrates / and Camerarius after him / which commende diuerſe vertues off his lib. 6. c. 4affirme him to hauehave bene a proud man. But conſidering that him ſelfe oppoſeth the Emperours large dominion / to a biſhops charge in one cytie: I choſe that ſence which I ſetdowne. Neither are there any wordes either in Theodoret / or the Centuries / ſo ſtrong to carrie the metropolitaneſhip ouer all theſe places / to Chryſoſtome: as Nazianzenes wordes before handled / are to carrie in diu. 26 pag. 340.the metropolitaneſhip off almoſt all the churches in the worlde p. DCXXVI/ vntounto Cyprian. For theſe wordes he had the ſame care, can not be vnderſtoode as the D. would / that he did the ſame thinges in all places which he did at Conſtantinople. For how could he teache / and rebuke ſin in all that circuite / as there? depriue and excommunicate in proper perſon / as there? ſo that will he nil he / the wordes muſt hauehave a reſtreint in reſpecte off thoſe before. as for the greke word he tranſlateth he gouerned, which ſignifieth he adorned: vnles he hauehave ſome ſingular licence / i… is for a tranſlation foreigneſpecially / too riotous. althowghe if that were there: yt drawethe no metropolitane autoritie / as hathe bene ſhewed in Cyprians example. I graunt Sozomenes are more preſſing / which ſpeakethe off his depoſing off the biſhops in Aſia: and if to mainteine my former anſwere I would ſay / he depoſed them not by his autoritie / but by his counſaile / as Diophantus ſaid off the Plutarch. de inſtit. pueror.cytie of Athenes ruled by him, becauſe Themiſtocles his father vvhichwhich ruled yt, vvas guided by his mother, and his mother by him: and therto alledge that he is called the Doctor off the vvoride by the ſame bb5. lib. ca. 32.Theodoret / when notwithſtanding he coulde not be an authoriſed doctor off ſuche a compas: yt would peraduenture be more then he can wel anſwer. But if he will as he dothe / make that his paterne to frame his Archbiſhop by: he maketh vsus a faicrer but to ſhoote at / then before: the archbiſ. being made therby in authoritie off breaking canons off the beſt Councells / by putting in and putting owte off his abſolute power / not infeferior vntounto the pope of Rome / and in compaſſe off dominion aboue him / and a fatter Pope then he. And beſide that it is but trifling / to fetche examples off Archbiſhop like gouernement / fower hundrethe yeares and a halfe after Chriſte / or there abowt / where the queſtion is off three hundrethe: I hauehave ſhewed how daungerous yt is / to builde vponupon the examples off thoſe times: eſpecially when euen in this pointe off broad dominion / before Chryſoſtomes time there was an intollerable exceſſe in the biſhop off Antioche: which beſide Chryſoſtomes compas / had alſo all Theodor. li 5. ca. 23.Illyricum.

Towching Ireneus ambaſſage into Phrigia: the D. eye is not ſimple. For after Euſeb. had ſhewed that there were Ambaſſadours p. DCXXVII5. li. ca. 3. & 4.ſent by the frenche churches / to thoſe off Phrigia: he addeth as an augmentation / that they vvere alſo ſent to the biſhop off Rome. After to the ende the ambaſſage might hauehave more autoritie / he ſheweth how Ireneus was ſent being commended vntounto the biſhop off Rome: to the end (as may eaſely appeare) that his letter alſo obteined with theirs / the churches might be the rather moued. Whether I hauehave followed the Scoliaſtes meaning / towching euerie hiſhop hauing a ſeuerall congregation: I referre me to that I hauehave before alledged. The D. anſwer to Homil. 3. in Act.Chryſoſtome which placeth the biſhops charge in one citie (that he dothe but ſhew how the Biſhop ys ſubiecte to as many afflictions, as the Emperour, and that he puttethe no difference betwene the Biſhop and the Emperour) is but a cauill. For his pourpoſe is to ſhew / what are the manifold troubles that accompanie the myniſtery / therby to pinche thoſe which ſeeke after yt: and that he dothe with an argument off compariſon / in that being but biſhop off one citie: yet he is ſubiecte not onelyonly to ſo many, but to moe troubles then the Emperour / which hath ſo large gouernement. Now if biſhops autority ſhould be extended / as the D. eſtemeth Chryſoſtomes: who ſeeth not that his cōpariſon halteth downe right? conſidering that there were few Emperours / or rather none ſithens Conſtantine / that euer had ſo large dominion / as this aſcribed vntounto Chryſoſtome. For againſt this argument yt might hauehave bene eaſely replied / off thoſe which laie in waite for the miniſterie / that ſeing one was able to gouerne ſo many whole countreis / and nations: yt could not be ſo hard a matter / to gouerne one onelyonly citie.

I could not here be put to ſhifte, ſeing where our queſtion is off 300. yow fetche your proufes off 400. whether I hauehave ſaid Diuiſ. 67. pag 415.trew: let the reader iudge. Where I alledge the firſt acte off the Calcedon Councell / that the biſhops cried that Theodoret vvas no biſhop: be alledgeth the 8. acte, that he was. If yt be aapag. 65.a ſimple anſwere to ſet one author againſt an other: yt is muche more ſimple to ſet one autoritie at variaunce with yt ſelfe / withowt ſhewing any way of reconciliatiō. That the Councell did well in condēning that Theodoret / appeareth for that he had bbEuag. 4. lib. ca. 38.writtē againſt Cyril / p. DCXXVIIIeuen in that Cyrill wrote againſt Neſtorius errors: in which reſpecte his ccConcil. Epheſ.bookes were commaunded to be burnte with thoſe errors. And this was not onelyonly done by the Councel off Calcedon / but by that alſo off Epheſus / and Conſtantinople: ſo that here are three condemnations paſſed againſt him / for one abſolution. And that what maner off one? verelie which appeareth to hauehave bene throwghe the fauour off the Emperour Martian. For what if he reuoked his hereſie there / as he had (I thinck) done before in the Councel off Conſtantinople: yet as I hauehave ſhewed / there was no cauſe why he ſhould be truſted with ſuche a greate charge / no not in the D. iudgemēt (I ſuppoſe) ſo ſoudenlie / and withowt further triall. Which I ſay not to diſcredite his trew repentance / and learned writinges: but onelyonly to ſhew / how totteringlie the D. Archbiſhop is ſet.

Where I alledged that the Emperour Theodoſius, and Valētinian cōmaunded him to kepe him to his ovvne church onelyonly: his anſwere is fond / that the Emperours meaning was, that he ſhould not come to the Synode. For are theſe two all one: to kepe him ſelf to his ovvne churche onelyonly, and not to come to the Synode?? When he might come to the ſynode / althowghe he kept not him ſelfe to his owne churche onelyonly: which he could not hauehave done / yf they had bene all one. Where he ſaithe / yt appeareth that the Emperour gaue that charge, that he ſhould not come vntounto the Synode but called: yt maketh nothing to the pourpoſe. For that may well ſtand with that I alledged / off his keping to one churche onelyonly. And in dede there had bene ſmall wiſdome / to hauehave forbidden him the Councell in reſpecte off the hereſie he laboured off: and yet to hauehave ſuffred him to gouerne ſuch a mightie people. When I expounded tares, hipocrites: I had not the booke before me / but truſting therin to Theodoretes knowledge in the ſcripture / eſtemed that he meant them / off whom the parable is vnderſtanded: that is thoſe / off whoſe ether corruption in life / or doctrine / the churche can hauehave no certeine knowledge to procede againſte / or to giuegive (as he did) ſentence vponupon. Neither is he yet purged off the ſuſpicion: conſidering that yt can hardly be belieued / that ther was not in 800. churches one onelyonly heretike. And if ther were not: yet yt was hard for p. DCXXIXhim to hauehave ſuche knowledge off ſo many churches / wherby he might giuegive ſo preciſe a ſentence: eſpecially if they be compared with ours / which often hauehave heretikes euen vnderunder there noſe / and either ſee them not / or looke throwghe their fingers.

Where to declare the vnlikelihoode off our biſhops with Diuiſ. 68. Pag. 416.thē in times paſt / Theodoret biſhop 26. yeares is ſhewed to hauehave had neuer a halfepennie, &c: his anſwere is / he profeſſed voluntarilie pouertie. Wherto I hauehave litle to replie / but that the D. for aduantage ſpareth not the honour of his authors: it being a great reproche in ſo great wealthe as the D. ſuppoſeth he might lawfully hauehave had / to be ſo beggarly. The next I leaue to the readers iudgement. That the office off Archbiſhop / and Patriarck / by Caluin was nothing but to aſſemble the Synod / propound diu. 70. 71 pag. 418. in diu. 38. pag. 385.the matter / gather the voices / &c. I hauehave ſhewed. condemning thoſe names in the generall / he muſt nedes condemne them in the particular: for in bothe thoſe names / the word off dominion ys put / which he condemneth. That he condemneth the office with vsus / is clearer then the ſunne: and that in diuers ſortes / firſt generall in that vppon the Apoſtles wordes (no man may take honour but he that is called as Aaron) he denieth aaVpō the Heb.yt lawfull to ſet vp any gouernement in the churche at the pleaſure off men, vvithovvt vvaiting for the commaundement of God and that the church office deuiſed vvithovvt his commaundement, and expreſſe ordinance, is vnlavvfull. Wherby appeareth that the admonitions allegacion / which the D. bbDiuiſ. 11. pag. 462.other where calleth groſſe, is in effect as fyne as Caluins. Secondly in that he dothe in flat wordes declare / ccInſt. 4. li. ca. 4. ſ. 4:that the holie goſte tooke great heede / that one ſhould not ſo much as dreame off principalitie / and dominion in the gouernement of the churche. Thirdly in that he ddVpō the Philip. 1.Phil 1dothe preciſely miſlike / that any ſhould hauehave poſtorall charge ouer a Prouince: which he declareth yet more manifeſtlie / when he eeInſt li. 4. ca. 6. ſe. 2.ſaithe the gouernement of the highe prieſt vvhichwhich vvas ouer one nation▪ being a figure off our Sau. Chriſt, ovvght not to be follovved Wherby appeareth how vntrwly he chargeth me ffDiui. 16. Pag. 467.otherwhere / with falſifiyng Caluin, for ſaying that his iudgement is, that no one p. DCXXXſhould be miniſter off a whole nation. That ggVponUpon Philip: 1.onelyonly which he liketh off / and confeſſeth to hauehave bene done according to the word off God / is that when there were controuerſies to be voided / one had the preheminence to aſſemble the companie / &c. which preheminence we hauehave before confirmed / ſo far is yt from vsus / that we can not abide yt.

That it can not be drawen further / appeareth by that in the beginning off this treatiſe: where it is manifeſt he ſtreineth him ſelfe / to ſpeake honorably off the maner off diſcipline in the elder churches: yet he ſaith / hh4. li. ca. 4. ſec. 1.there vvas almoſt nothing againſte the vvord off God. And further / that althovvgh there may be ſome lack in their orders: yet becauſe they did it oft good mynd and erred not muche, it is good to gather yt. Moreouer towching that inſtitution which off all other is moſt plauſible / and leaſt princelike / that one in a churche ſhould hauehave the name off biſhop / which notwihſtanding (as hathe bene ſhewed) had no dominion / nor autoritie to commaunde the reſte / he ſaithe: iiVponUpon 1. Philip.that autoritie had no inſtitution, nor ground ovvt off the vvord of God. Wherupon yt is manifeſt / thoſe wordes off Calu. (the ould biſhops did frame no kind off gouernement but preſcribed in the lordes vvord) can not be drawen further then I hauehave ſaid. Where he expoundeth Caluins wordes / eueryevery ſingular bodie off church, a dioces or prouince: yt is (as all the reſt off theſe diuiſions) a ſhamefull bouldnes / conſidering that Calu. doth in expreſſe wordes / ſhut forthe a prouince: and in calling it a ſingular bodie, vſed moſte propre wordes to ſet forthe a congregation which aſſembled into one place / may at once be fed at one mouthe.

Where alſo otherwhere he ſuppoſeth Calu. meant by Prouinces, ſuche as are vnderunder diuerſe gouernours, becauſe one Prouince in one particular pag. 468.church, in one kingdome, vnderunder one Prince, is but one bodie, &c. to omit his abſurd ſpeache / that a prouince is in a particular churche, in ſtede that he ſhould hauehave ſaid / a particular churche is in the prouince: let it be obſerued that in making the whole churche in a kingdome / but that ſingular bodie Calu. ſpeaketh off: he maketh notwithſtanding the churche in one prouince / which is the halfe off that / yea p. DCXXXIeueryevery dioceſe to be that ſingular bodie. So that one ſingular / and vndiuiſible bodie off a churche / muſt be twentie / and one off them alſo cōteining an other: which is abſurde. yea by this meanes the church in a 100. Prouinces being vnderunder one Prince / ſhall be but one ſingular bodie. His reaſon that he can not meane a particular pariſh, becauſe eueryevery one hath not many miniſters: is a cauill. For it is enowghe that ther were diuerſe in ſome churches (as in the churche off Philippes wheroff he ſpake) to draw him to that conſideration. Beſides that there was (as ſhall appeare) in the particular churches / appointed by the word off God an elderſhip: amongeſt whom it was meete the ſame order ſhoulde be kepte. Where he ſuppoſethe Caluin to hauehave thowght the churche off Geneua with all thoſe belonging vntounto yt, to hauehave made but one bodie off a churche: all ſee the D. pouertie / driuen to leaue his wide workes / to ſeeke ſome comforte in his thowghtes / onelyonly knowen to the lord. If I ſhoulde vſe the aduantage off that he ſpake / and I hearde off vndowbted witneſſes / that althowghe he had no preheminence before the loweſt Myniſter / but onelyonly to propounde the cauſes / gather the voices / &c. and was choſen therunto euerie two yeare: yet he miſliked that that ſmall preheminence ſhoulde ſo long remaine with one / as which in time might breed in conuenience: likewiſe that I hearde my ſelfe off Maiſter Beza which miſliked off yt for the ſame cauſe / affirming it cōuenient that it ſhoulde be done by euerie Paſtor off the ſame reſort in his weeke / wheroff there be alſo other witneſſes: I ſay yf I ſhould vſe this aduantage / a great deale more honeſt then his: all ſee how that chaunge of preſidētes which he derideth / and will hauehave my onelyonly phantaſie, ſhould beſide the ſcripture alledged / and vſe off the churches in Fraunce / hauehave the approbation off theſe godly learned men. But when in deede he deride the their iudgement written: I hauehave ſmale hope that he will beare any reuerence to it onelyonly ſpoken. Neither require I that he eſteme any thing theirs / which can not be conuinced owt off their writinges: let him wreſte and wring / wind and turne his worſt.

But that we be not ſtreight with him / admit Caluin ſo thowght: dothe yt follow that becawſe he eſtemed a ſingular p. DCXXXIIbodie off a churche / ſcarce 20. ſmall pariſhes lying round abowt / wheroff eueryevery off the miniſters at the leaſt meete once a weeke / bothe for exerciſe off propheſie / or interpretacion off the word / and to hould cōmon conſultation: that therfore he eſtemed the whole dioces off London / or Prouince off Canterbury where there are many thowſand pariſhes / might conueniently grow into one particular bodie / to be gouerned off one Paſtor. Truly this is but kolde reaſoning. Where I charged him with vnfaithefull dealing, for leauing ovvt that vvvich Caluin noteth (that the office off Archbiſ. and Patriarck vvas rarely vſed) to couer his vnfaithfullnes: he alledgeth the later edition, which hathe not that ſentence. Which is partly anſwered aain Diui. 43. pag. 391.before: but ad this alſo that euen the noted booke which he followed / had thus muche off that ſentence / Althovvghe it may not be paſſed by in this diſputation. There wanted onelyonly this (it vvas very rarely vſed) and that throwghe the printers fault: conſidering that withowt yt there is no ſence / nor knot with that before or after. Therfore if there had bene any louelove of the trwthe in hym: meeting with ſuche a gap / he would hauehave ſowght to hauehave made yt vpp in the later edition. His ſhift (Calu referrethe that to the patriarcke, and not to the Archbiſhop / becauſe ther was ſmale cauſe off exerciſing his authoritie: is onelyonly ſaid / and in deede cōtrary to thanthors wordes ād meaning. Wordes / for that giuing that note off his diſputation there, which is bothe off the Archbiſhop / and Patriarke: yt muſte follow by all likelihoode / that the note alſo is of them bothe. Againſt his meaning manifeſtly: for he placing both their offices / in propounding matters vntounto the Synodes / which for their hardnes could not be ended of few: and gyuing them nothing to doo more then their fellowes / but that: it muſte follow that the ofteneſt Synodes wherin the archbiſhop was preſident / being rare / and but twiſe a yeare: his office alſo was off very rare vſe. Wherby appeareth that Caluins minde was to ſhew / that the archbiſhops and Patriarches office / endured onelyonly but the time off the Synode: which ended / he had no autoritie but in commen with other biſhops / vntill the next ſynode. So that althowgh they were not choſen at eueryevery action: yet Caluins iudgement ſtandeth / that p. DCXXXIIIboth thoſe offices were but off rare vſe.

The D. onelyonly trifleth in Hemingius. For we affirme degrees Diuiſ 72. pag. 419.off miniſtrie off the word / graunt alſo that there were Patriarches / but denie them to hauehave bene immediatly after the Apoſtles: which Hemingius doth not (as he vntruly ſaith) affirme. That that church aboliſhing the Patriarch and Archbiſhop kept the diſtinction betwene the biſhop / an other miniſters off the word / which the church browght in / is confeſſed: but that it owght not ſo to be is before declared: althowgh the biſhops there in reſpect off the height off ours / are but dwarfes. His anſwer to that Hemingius ſaith / that S. Luke 22. putteth a difference betvvene the office off a Magiſtrat, and miniſters, and that dominion is altogether takē avvay from theſe: is very fonde. His reaſon owt off the Hebr. is before anſwered: ſo that his vnfaithfull dealing in Hemingius remaineth. Yf there be no circunſtance in M Fox alledged Diuiſ. 73. pag. 422.by the D. which gyue further anſwer: I ſtand to that before made / and refer it to the readers iudgement: eſpecially ſeing to that alledged / where M. Fox flatly condemneth the degrees off primates, metropolitanes, and archbiſhops as ambicious, the D. can not anſwer. In ſaying he vvent about to corrupt him Maiſter Fox. p. 96vvith his praiſe, I doo M. Fox no iniurie: yt being no fault to be aſſaulted / but to be ouercome, Whether I doo the D. any let the reader iudge.