A Retentive to Stay Good Christians, Title page · Motive 32 – Motive 35
The 32. motiue is the 22. demaund.
Aunuall celebrating of Christes mysteries. The churches Bristoweseruice is to be imbraced. Christ is to be beleued for the scriptures of the olde testamēt as they be vnderstood in the church. Ember daies or Enper dayes, whichy our blinde Apostles doe boldely say to hauehave ben the Popes leman. The Martirs were of our religion. Saints dayes laide downe by protestants as our Ladyes daies, S. Laurence day, the assumption of our Lady. The Churches and serui…e of heretikes to be r…frained in paine of damnation. Against communi…ating with them. An admonition to priestes that say the now seruice. Heretikes are idolaters, and heresies are idols. The yeare of Iubely 1575. Pilgrimage. The sermons of Heretikes not to be heard, their bookes not to be read. Christ to be beleeued for the vertue of the signe of his Crosse, which workesh miracles. Visions for our religion.
The Annuall celebration of Christes misteries, by dumb ceremonies and readings not vnderstood of the Fulke.ignorant people, although there were no heresie in the popish seruice nor no sufficient motiues to imbrace the popish synagogue as the church of Christ, if the Scriptures and the figures of the lawe, better applyed, then they be in all the lumpe of the popish solemnities, they would procure small credit to our Sauiour Christ: but rather the scorning and derision of Turkes, Iewes, and Pagans. As for the blind commētaries of the Iewes, out of which he magineth we hauehave all our vnderstanding of the old testament, how litle we trust in prophecyes of Christ, may be seene in the written commentaries of Caluine, Musculus, & such other. The names of a great number of the solemne feastes, (as Bristow sayth) doth argue in deede the Papists ether to hauehave inuented thē, or to hauehave abused them, as Candelmas, Corpus Christi day &c, but that the same were inuented by that auncient Church, wc celebrated the natiuity, resurrection, ascention of Christ & cat is vtterly vntrue. For your owne Durand testifieth, that many of them were of late Popes institutiō, wc were of another factiō, but no: of the church of Christ. Howe vaine a brag it is, that the martyrs were of the Papistes religion, because they keepe holy their dayes, I leaue to be answered with childrens laughture.
But it is a great offence I weene, that Protestants hauehave put downe most of the Saincts daies, & namely S. Lawrence his day, & all our Ladies daies, assumption & all. If a man shoulde aske you wherefore you keepe not S. Abrahams day, cōsidering he was the father of the faithfull, nor S. Esayes &c: what could you answer? As for the Ladies daies wc he complaineth to be put downe by vsus, namely the feasts of her conception, natiuitye, visitation & assumption, the Church could be without some of thē more then 12 hundreth yeares. For Vrbanus the 6. instituted the feast of the visitation of some called the new found Lady daye about the yeare of Christ 1380. as the very popishe seruice of that daye confesseth in the first lessō. The feast of the natiuity, is not much elder as both the lessons & Durand do acknowledge, which affirmeth that one Fulbertus a Bishop Cardinal made part of the seruice. That the feast of the assumption can not be very auncient, it appeareth not onelyonly by the barbarous hymnes in the popishe Churche that daye, but also by the lessons taken out of Bede, by whiche it is manifest, that the Church coulde be without that goodly solemnitie, more th…n 700. yeares after Christ, as a great number of other festiuities which borrow their lessons out of Bede, doe shew sufficiently, that the popish seruice is nether so auncient nor so vniuersall, as the Papistes most impudently doe affirme. As for the feast of the conception of the Virgine Marye, is not full one hundreth yeare olde, being decreed by Sixtus the 4. in great despight of the Dominike Fryers, which did both preach and wright against it.
Wherefore there is no such intollerable fault assuredly committed, in omitting such festiuities, as Bristow cryeth out, nether we lacke proper dayes of our Ladye, as he sayth, whereby he bewrayeth the grosse Idolatrie of Papistes, which are not content to honor our Sauiour Christ in his Sainctes, but the Sainctes must hauehave proper dayes dedicated to their honor alone, and vtterly seperated from the honor of Christ. For it satisfieth not Bristow, that we keepe holy the annunciation & purification of Mary, because the one of them sayth he, is the conception, the other the presentation of Christ. But Papistes keepe her natiuitie, visitation, conception, and assumption, which are the proper dayes of our Lady. I passe ouer that he affirmeth the assumption of her body as a certaine truth, which the very popish lessons songe on that festiuitie, leaue in doubt, and incline rather to the contrary opinion, that the was assumpted onelyonly in soule. Likewise that he calleth her the Lady of Saincts and Angels, which title the holy Scriptures doe not only not giuegive vntounto her, but plainly denye. For there is but one Lord Eph. 4. both of men and of Angels, which doth not onelyonly exclude all other Lordes of the masculine gender, but much more all Ladyes, and generally surmounteth all principalitie, power, Lordship, and eueryevery name that is named, both in this world and in the world to come. Eph, 1. 2. The Virgine Mary is therefore no Lady of Sainctes and Angells, but a fellow seruaunt of God with them. Luke 1 48. Apoc. 22. 9. What excellency soeuer she hath of Gods gift, more then any of them. That we keepe no solemnitie of S. Lawrens, it is not for any contempt of his holines, nor for any worship of Iohn Baptist and the Apostles, that we solemnize their memories. But therein the Churche vseth her libertie as in things indifferent. Whereas Bristow doubteth not that if any of vsus would once be present at the reuerent solemne doing of the popish Catholike seruice, especially at Christmas, Easter or such like time, but it would melt our st…ny harts with ioye, &c. He bewrayeth many poyntes of follye at once. For first many thousands of vsus, hauehave bene present, and with greefe of hart hauehave seene and beheld the doing of those Idolatrous solemnities. Secondly he declareth, how he him selfe is caried away with piping, singing, sensing, and swinging in copes &c, so that he can not discerne the true worship of God, which is in spirite and veritie, from the carnall and counterfeit solemnities of Idolatry and superstition. Last of all, how childishly doth he referre all Catholike solemnitie to the vaine pompe vsed onelyonly in great and Cathedrall Churches, when a thowsand pa…shes beside in the poore contrey townes, hauehave all their trashe so beggerly and rudely set forth, that the Papistes them selues laughe them to scorne. The rest of this motiue is spent in disswading Papists from learning our seruice, or sermons, or reading of our bookes, by which it is plain, that he so much mistrusteth his cause, that he dare not once permit his disciples to inquire of it, or to heare any thing that may be sayd to the contrary. As for popishe priestes that say the newe (as he termeth it) seruice, I woulde they woulde followe his councell to saye it no more. That it is not lawfull for Christians to communicate with heretiks, or Idolaters, it is a playne case: But it shall neuer be proued that they be heretikes, which teach nothing but the doctrine of holy Scripture, or that they are Idolaters, which are ready to giuegive their liues rather then to worship Idolls. But the yeare of Iubely is a greate motiue for greate fooles to embrace popery, which Iubely Pope Boniface the 8. did first institute in the veare of our Lord 1300 by apish or rather deuelish imitation of the fathers of the old testament for filthy lukers sake, beside the horrible blashemye of full remission of sinnes graunted by the Pope in that yeare, which is denied to be giuen by the death of Christ. As for the Iubely, which Bristow speaketh of anno 1575. is of a later institution ordeyned to be kept eueryevery 25. yeare, because it was to long for the Pope to tary vntill the hundreth and 50. yeare, as Boniface appoynted. This is the antiquitie of that Iubely pardon, and pilgrimage.
The miracle which S. Augustine reporteth of Innocentia that was warned in her dreame, to desire the first woman which she did meete, returning from baptisme at Easter, to signe her breast with the signe of the crosse, on which was a canker, for cure of which she had longe prayed vntounto God: declareth in deede the vertue of Christ, which can vse all meanes to worke health where it pleaseth him, but nothing at all maketh for popery. For if it hath pleased God at any …yme to worke wonders by the signe of the crosse, it followeth not thereof ether that the signe of the crosse hath any vertue in it, more then that hemme of Christes garment had, by which a woman also was healed, or els that an ordinary ceremonye is to be made of signing with the crosse, more then of touchinge the hemme of anye garment.
In the 22. demaunde he asketh whether in the most auncient seruice of the primitiue Church, there was not alwayes prayer for the deade and to Saynctes, the ceremonies vsed by Papistes in baptisme &c. I answere, no. Cyprian whome he quoteth Ep. 66. speaketh not of prayer for the deade in any place, but of oblation for the falling a sleepe that is thankes giuing for the departure of the deade, and naming them in the prayers of the Church which dyed in the faith of Christ, and in obedience of the Church.
In the tyme of Eusebius that errour of praying for the deade was in deede receyued in many places of the Churche, which beganne first amonge the Montanists. The ceremonies of exuf…lation and exorcisme were not idlely vsed in the primitiue Church, as they are of the Papistes, but when the persons to be baptised were sensibly possessed with deuills as appeareth in Cyprian lib. 3. Ep. 7. ad Magnum.
Likewise where he demaund th whether we reade at any tyme when Masse did first come into the Churches. I aunswere if by Masse he meaneth that popish forme of sacrificing, which they vse and call Masse, we reade of eueryevery parte of it when and by what Pope it came in. By Masse he meaneth the doctrine of the carnall presence, transubstantiation, adoration of the sacrament and making it a sacrifice propitiatory for the quicke and the deade, I aunswer that we reade all these heresies to hauehave crept into the Church of Rome, since the first six hundreth yeares. And as for the substance of the canon, being contrary to the doctrine of the Apostles, is easie to be proued that it came not from the Apostles, beside that some of them ascribe it to Gregory, and Gregory him selfe to Scholasticus, so that being of some antiquitie it conteyneth in it, matter repugnant euen vntounto the popish heresies. For first it calleth the cō secrated breade and wine the sacrifices, and offereth them for the whole Church. Secondly after consecration it calleth the Sacrament Panem sanctum vit…e aeternae, & calicem salutis aeternae, holye breade of eternall life, and cuppe of eternall health, of the giftes of God, and prayeth God to accept it as the sacrifice of Abell.
Thirdly the priest prayeth that God will commaund … same to be caried by an Angellinto his high alter &c.
Fourthly he prayeth for all them that hauehave receyued the same sacrament with him which can not stand with a priuate Masse.
Finally, that it came not euidently of the Apostles, as Bristow impudently affirmeth, it may be euidētly seene by this, that diuerse Sainctes are named in it, which liued more then two hundreth yeares after the Apostles as Cosmus Damiaius &c. And that we are able to finde more fault with it then with Gloria Patri, Te Deum &c. it is plentifully declared by many volumes, and namely by Bishop of Sarum in his sermon and defence of the same against Harding.
The 33. motiue is the 21. demaund.
Ecclesiasticall monuments and liuings. Churches the worke of the Catholikes. Vniuersities of heretikes and Catholikes. Protestants be vsurpers of other mens liuings.
Although a great number of churches, that are now Bristow.standing were builded by Papistes, and for Popery, yet not all. For the chiefest and most auncient Cathedrall churches, were neither builded by Papistes, nor for Popery, but by Christian Princes and for the vse of Christian Fulke.religion. Of such churches writeth Euseb. in vita Const. lib. 30. & Hist. Eccl. lib. 10. cap. 4. where was but one table or altare, which was remoueable & made of bords placed in the midest of the Church. contrary to the popish fashion which hath many Altars, and all againste walles or pillers, and the chiefest against the farthest wall, most commonly. It is a fonde reason of Bristowe that they were built for Popery, because they are builte in length to the East, or in forme of a Crosse. For many are built rounde, and those with crosse Iles, are moste vnmeete for masse at the high Altar, which they that sit in the crosse Yles cannot see. Likewise Bede, whome Bristowe in the demaunde without shame doth quote for the contrary, testifieth that the churches of the Romaines. lib. 3. Cap. 4. speaking of Niua, one that was brought vp at Rome, which at a place called Candida casa now Whiterne: Made a Church of stone of an other facion, then the Britans were wont to build. These are ye words of Bede of Stapletons translation. And concerning the founding of Ecclesiasticall liuings and Vniuersities, we know that the first dotation of Churches, was by Christian Princes, what if superstition hath added any thing to them? Nether the building of Churches, not the founding of liuings and Vniuersities, doth proue the builders or founders to be of good religion, not yet cō demne the vsers of such Churches, liuings and Vniuersities, of vsurping or sacriledge. The idolatrous Church of Pantheon at Rome, was turned into Maria rotunda. Gregory councelled Augustine to conuert the Idolatrous Churches of the Saxons, to the vse of Christian religion. Beda lib. 1. cap. 30. The Vniuersitie of Athens, founded by hea…hen Philosophers, was after frequented by Christian schollers as testifieth Gregory Nazianzene in Monod. And if we beleue our English stories, ye liuings of the Idolatrous Flamines & Arch Flamines was conuerted to the mayntenancs of the Bishops and ArchBishops.
The 34. motiue is the 23. demaund.
Heretikes are apes of the Catholikes. The Churches learning Bristow.and wisedom. The Communion booke an apish imitation of our Masse booke.
The maner of Apes is to counterfeit and follow visible Fulke.actions, without any meaning or profit. Such imitation hauehave we none, but the apish Church of Rome, is ful of such following of the gestures of Christ, in their masse and other ceremonies. Yea they counterfeit the voice of Pilate & Iudas in reading the gospel on Palme Sonday. They play the apes of the Primitiue Church, in coniuring the deuil in baptisme. Yea they be the apes of Aaron & the leuitical Priestes, in their robes, sensing, & sacrificing. The very Pagans they follow in ceremonies & festiuities, as their owne Durand confesseth. In whose Rationale diuinorum, you may see the learning & wisdom of the popish Church, for all their mischieuous mysteries.
As for vsus, we imitate nothing that they doe, to get commendation by similitude of their doings, but rather we abhorre whatsoeuer hath but a shew of popery, if we vse any thing rightly, which is abused of them, we are not therefore apes of them, but they apes of the auncient fathers, whose doctrine we doe truely follow, as they vainely imitate and in imitation falsely peruert their examples. That the communion booke is an apish imitation of the masse booke, is a most shamelesse lye. For what similitude hath our ministration of the communion, with their masse, any more, then our doctrine with theirs? If any thinge in ceremonies or discipline hauehave bene tollerated not altogether purged from all similitude of popish actions, by yelding vntounto the infirmitie of the weaker sort: yet is the Church of God perfect in her selfe, and needeth not to borrow of any secte any thing, for her perfect furniture in doctrine, ceremonies, or discipline, but hath absolute rules to direct her in any of these expressed in the holy Scriptures.
For the diuision of parishes, the holding of Councells, excommunication, suspension, publike solemnising of mariage with the lawes of the same, punishing of heretikes by, death, &c. are all manifestly proued out of the Scriptures. Probat of testaments and such like matters pertayne to the ciuill lawe. And whereas Bristow sayth, we could not tell that we shoulde vse baptisinge of men, more then washinge of feete, or this lesse then that, or one to be a sacrament and not the other, except we had bene taught by the popishe Churche, it is a greate falshoode. For althoughe we might alleage the iudgement of the moste auncient Churche of Christ, which did not accept that action of Christ as a sacraments yet the wordes of our Sauiour Christ are manifest, which doth not institute a sacramēt or visible signe of the inuisible grace of God giuen vntounto vsus, but onelyonly giueth vsus an example thereby of seruice able humilitie one to an other. Ioan. 13. 12. Wherefore no more in this then in any other matter doe we take any light, out of the bookes and doings of those owles, that flye in the darkenes of mens traditions, but onelyonly out of the lawe of God which is a light vntounto our steps, and a lanterne vntounto our feete, that we neede not like apes counterfeit externall toyes as they doe, but being followers of God as wellbeloued children, we may walke in louelove as Christ hath loued vsus, and so fa…re to followe the steppes of other men, as we see plainly that they hauehave followed Christ.
The 35. motiue is the 25. demaund.
States of perfection. Monkes & Monasteries. Parliament Bristow.religion.
We confesse that we hauehave no states of perfection in Fulke.this life amonge vsus, which to affirme in any mortall man is blasphemye against the bloode of Christ. As for Monkes and Fryers names, Eremites, &c: none were farther from a Christian or honest life then they, as the worlde knoweth sufficientlye. And therefore by lawe they and their Monasteries were iustly subuerted. As for the solitarye men of the auncient tymes, dwelling by them selues, or in the desert places called M…nach…, Anchoritae or Eremit…e, these popishe orders, of whose subuersion Bristow complayneth, were no more like vntounto them, then Apes and Monkeyes are to men and women.
The communitye of goodes that was in the Church of the Apostles. Act. 4. was none other, then suche as is and ought to be amonge all true Christians. which was not as Bristowe ignorauntlye and impudently affirmeth, to liue without propriety of goodes, hauing all thinges in an Anabaptisticall communitie, but that they accompted nothing of that they possessed to be their owne, when the necessitie of their brethren required the vse therof. Act. 4. 32. & 34. And Act. 5. 4. Peter affirmeth that both the lande and the price thereof was in the proprietye of Ananias, so that he might hauehave retayned ether his land or the whole price thereof, but that he was an hypocrite and would beare the Churche in hande, that he had brought the whole price, when he withdrewe a parte thereof. As for Virgines although there be fewer amongest vsus, that boast of that profession, yet are there more both men and women which freely keepe their purpose of virginitie, then were amonge those popishe vowed cloystralls.