Gainsayer Convinced, Tract · Part 3 (2 of 2)

Gainsayer Convinced · Tract · Part 3 (2 of 2)

p. 39All that you can ſay to this is, that theſe be old Teſtament texts, and God appointed Magiſtrates under the Law, and the Jews were kept in order by them; yet this doth not prove that Chriſtians under the Goſpel may exerciſe that power one over another, or that they need any Civill Magiſtrate.

I anſwer. I ſhall ſhew you the weakneſſe and ſimplicitie of this reply, and that in this order.—Firſt, there is the like neceſſity of the Civill Magiſtrates and Judges under the Goſpel, as well as under the Law; for the ſad experience of theſe times ſhews us, and the Scripture ſhews us, that the ſame diſorders fall out amongſt Chriſtians, as did among the Jews; not onelyonly envyings, ſtrifes, debates, going to law, &c. and the like diſorders in the State, but alſo errors, hereſies, and blaſphemies, and diviſions in the Church. See 1 Cor. 3. 3. and Chap. 6. 6. Phil. 3. 18. 2 Pet. 2. 1. &c.

Now if there be the ſame diſorders in Church and State (amongſt Chriſtians) as were among them; it muſt neceſſarily follow (and you cannot but in reaſon grant,) that here's need of the ſame power and au…horitie for the reſtraining and puniſhing of theſe.—If we have need of the ſame power and authoritie, and that hath been a power appointed of God for the ſame end, if you will deny it to us under the Goſpel, you muſt ſhew me, where ever that Command and ordinance was repealed, or that pract…ce prohibited, under the new Teſtament. I muſt confeſſe to you that I could never yet finde it repeall'd or prohibited by Chriſt or his Apoſtles; and therefore rationall men muſt grant that it ſtands ſtill in force under the Goſpel.

And to ſatisfie you further, I will ſhew you ſeverall grounds why, p. 40and places from which you muſt conclude, that their Calling is warrantable by, and agreeable to the Goſpel.

Firſt, we having need of ſuch, as well as the Jews under the Law, you muſt either grant us them, or elſe you muſt conclude, that the State of the Church of Chriſt (in reſpect of the Civill Magiſtrate) is worſe under the new Teſtament then is was under the old, which no man will be ſo mad as to ſay.

Again, if the office of the Magiſtrate, were an office and ordinance under the Law, and not under the Goſpel, then it muſt be becauſe this ordinance was ceremoniall and typicall; but this cannot be: for I ſhall plainly ſhew you that the power of the Magiſtrate is morall and perpetuall.

Firſt look upon the fift Commandment, Honour thy father and thy mother, &c. I hope you will not turn Antinomians too, and deny the moralitie of the ten Commandments: if you do, the Apoſtle Pauls words will ſhew, that if you condemne all the reſt, yet this Command is morall and perpetuall; for he renews it in the Goſpel; and it muſt ſtand as long as the Goſpel ſtands. Epheſ 6. 1, 2. Now I beleeve that your inſpired and ſpirituall Paſtor will not deny, but that in that Command (though the Apoſtle applyes it there onelyonly to parents and children) yet both this relate and correlate, viz: the Magiſtrate and Subject, the power and authoritie of the one, and the obedience and ſubmiſſion of the other, are both warranted and commanded.

Again, the power of the Magiſtrate muſt needs be morall and perpetuall in the Church; becauſe the reaſon, and ground, and end of that power is morall and perpetuall: one ground and reaſon why that power was eſtabliſht amongſt the Jews, was becauſe ſeducers and dreamers of dreams, would turn away the hearts of Gods people from the Lord; and the end of exerciſing and executing that power, was that all Iſrael might fear, and do no more ſo wickedly, Deut. 13. 5. 11. Now theſe grounds, reaſons and ends of the ordaining the power at firſt, and the executing of it are perpetuall, and are at this time amongſt us, therfore it cannot be denyed (by reaſonable men) but that the power muſt be ſtill in force: you know that the grounds, and reaſons, and ends of both the inſtitution of it, and the execution of it are now with us, viz: ſeducers do ſtill indeavour to draw away the hearts of Gods people from the Lord (if Juſtice were executed on theſe) the people would fear, and do no more ſo wickedly.

Again, you ſhall finde that the want of a Civill Magiſtrate to ſway p. 41the Sword of Juſtice, was noted by the holy Ghoſt, as a great plague, and a fearfull judgement on the Jews: See Judg. 17. 6. and Chap. 18. 1. v. and 21. 25. So likewiſe on the contrary, 'twas fore-told and promiſed as a ſingular bleſſing to the Chriſtian Church under the Goſpel: Iſa. 49. 23. And Kings under the Goſpel are required and commanded to imploy their power to the advancement of Chriſts kingdom: Pſal. 2. 10, 11, 12. The Pſalm is clearly expounded of Chriſt and his kingdom by the Apoſtle, Act. 4. 25. and Act. 13. 23. Now (ſaith the Pſalmiſt) Be wiſe, O ye kings; be inſtructed, O ye Judges: Serve the Lord with fear. Now ye muſt Dr Featly in his Dipper dipt.know, that Kings and Judges, ſerve God two manner of wayes: Firſt, as men by leading a godly life agreeable to the rules of the Goſpel. 2ly, as Kings and Judges, they ſerve God by enacting and executing Laws with convenient ſeverity; commanding juſt things, and prohibiting evill: So did Hezekiah and Joſiah: And then properly do Kings and Judges ſerve God as Kings and Judges, when they do thoſe things in and for the ſervice of God, which none can do but they.

Farther yet, ye ſhall ſee, how in the Goſpel, Chriſt himſelf and his Apoſtles, have approved of the Authoritie of the Civill Magiſtrate, and have commanded obedience to them. Matth. 22. 21. Chriſt commands all to pay unto Ceſar, the things that are Ceſars: And he himſelf payed tribute, and acknowledged even Pilates power over him to be from God: Joh. 19. 11.—Again, the Apoſtle commands all people to ſubmit, and to obey the Magiſtrate, and to obey for the Lords ſake, and for that they are the ordinance of God. And therefore ſurely the Authority of the Magiſtrate is eſtabliſht by the Goſpel. See Rom. 13. 1, 4, 5. Tit. 3. 1. 1 Pet. 2. 13, 14, 15. Again, the Apoſtle commands us to offer up prayers in ſpeciall for them as Magiſtrates: 1 Tim. 2. 1, 2, 3, 4. that we may leade a quiet and peaceable life, under them, in all godlineſſe and honeſty. Which we could not do, except the Lord bleſſe their government over us.

May not a man now ſay to you here, as Chriſt did to the Phariſees, Ye erre, not knowing the Scriptures: what a groſſe error is this in you, to ſet your hands to ſuch a falſhood as this is? That the office of a Magiſtrate under the Goſpel is Antichriſtian, and hath no foot-ſteps in the Goſpel? Ye ſee it hath thoſe foot-ſteps there which neither you, nor all the Anabaptiſts in England, nor all the Devils in Hell, ſhall be able ever to raze out. The Lord give you underſtanding, that you may ſee your error, be aſhamed of it, and repent for it, and from it.

Let's ſee what you ſay next:—Truly in 20 lines together, or more, nothing but a throwing out your very gaul, in moſt unchriſtianlike ſlanders p. 42and reproaches; in which too, the Divel hath holpen you, to belch out as helliſh lyes, as ever the father of lyes himſelf vented. Oh, what a Saint-lik ſpirit this ſavours of? to rayl, and brawl, and ſpeak evill of Magiſtrates and Miniſters, and all that come in your way. In your following page of your Paper, ye pretend much to the carriage of Chriſt and his Apoſtles; you ſay you are commanded to be gentle, and meek, and curteous; to be moderate, to walk as brethren, and to beſeech men, and that you are condemned for following theſe; I leave it (even to your ſelves) and to all the world to judge, of the meekneſſe, and lambelike ſpirit, which you have in this Paper expreſt to be in you. I leave it upon your own conſciences (if they be not ſeared) if they be, the Lord ſoften them, and give you ſpeedily a ſence of your condition, (for my part) I ſhall beſeech God to pardon you.

Paper. You call us vain, time-ſerving, ſelf-ſeeking Teachers, turning with every winde, perfidious men, who will be any thing, nay nothing for a little pelf, though under pretences of piety, penny maſters, hirelings, falſe prophets; that our means is the prop of our miniſtery. That we will not truſt God, that we are at every word of command from men; facing about, and turning as we were; that we have ſworn to maintain Epiſcopacy with & cetera.

Anſ. We ſhall not revile again, but, as I ſaid, commit our ſelves to God who judgeth righteouſly. We may ſay of you as Paul ſaid of Alexander the Copper-ſmith; you William, and Thomas, and John, and Caleb, &c. you have done us much wrong, the Lord help other men to beware of you:—onelyonly before I leave this, let me ask you one queſtion or two: Pray let me know ('tis but a reaſonable requeſt from you who have charged us with it) in what have you found us vain Teachers? hath our teaching been in vain to you? we are ſor…ie for you; and ſay as Paul 2 Cor. 4. 3. If our Goſpel be hid, 'tis hid to them that are loſt: In whom the God of this world hath blinded the minds of them which beleeve not, leſt the light of the glorious Goſpel of Chriſt, who is the image of God, ſhould ſhine unto them. For we have not preached our ſelves, but Chriſt Jeſus our Lord, and our ſelves your ſervants for Jeſus ſake.

Again, how many winds and times have you known us to turn withall? we have (the Lord knows) deſired, and we hope we have hitherto held faſt the profeſſion of our faith without wavering; and we truſt (through Chriſt that ſtrengthens us) that we ſhall yet ſtand faſt in the faith, and quit our ſelves like men, though we have ſtrong ſhakings: we bleſſe God, we have not as yet ſaid a confederacie, nor feared the fear of men.

p. 43Again, which of us, and which way can you make it appear, that we are ſelf-ſeeking men? who amongſt us have for Pelf or honour proved perfidious to our truſt, and to our charges: we truſt that the Lord hath ſeen, that we have no…, we do not ſeek our own, but every man anothers wealth, and the things which are Chriſt Jeſus. As Paul enjoyns, 1 Cor. 10. 2. And for your parts (I think) you have as little cauſe or ground to charge us with this, as any, for in our labours to you wards, even to this day, we are able to ſay as Paul, 2 Cor. 12. 14. We are ready to come again unto you, and we will not be burthenſome to you, for we ſeek not yours but you.

Again, which of us can you charge (juſtly) with prophecying or preaching falſe things to you; name the men (if you can) that are falſe prophets, and prove it againſt us: we tell you again, that we are not of thoſe that handle the Word of God deceitfully; and we deſire to renounce the hidden things of darkneſſe, and (we bleſſe God) we can ſay as Paul, 1 Cor. 11. 23. We have received of the Lord, that which we alſo have delivered unto you.

Again, when, or where, or which of us have you known to be Beagles to our Reverend Patrons (as you call them) the Biſhops? where have we faced about, and turn'd again as we were? or whom amongſt us can you prove to have taken the Biſhops Oath with & caetera: we are able to make your falſhood and ſlanders in this appear to the world; that in this County of Glouceſter it was generally oppoſed, and refuſed: how baſe then are theſe accuſations?

Again, whom of us have you known to have layen at the Ale-houſe three dayes in a week?—bluſh for ſhame.—Did you know what you did, when you were led by the noſe, to ſet your hands to ſuch an heap of lyes together, which are all from the father of lyes; and any one of which we challenge you and all the world, to make good againſt us, if you can. Does it become the Saints to do ſuch things as theſe are? Me thinks, here be fit grounds for you, to be aſhamed and confounded in your ſelves.

Paper. In the next place you tell us, that certainly, if you ſhould ſee the downfall of our means, you ſhould ſee the downfall of our Miniſtery, that being the grand prop thereof; And therefore rather then we will truſt God for our maintenance, we will take, nay force the legall maintenance of Tithes from the people, &c.

Anſ. I anſwer. Firſt, we know that the downfall of our Miniſtery is that which you look, and long, and gape after; that ſo you may run p. 44on without controul, in your villanies. But (me thinks) (if you were not wilfully ignorant) you might know, that Tithes are not the grand prop of our Miniſtery. 'Tis a promiſe of Chriſt, that is the prop of it; And that is ſuch a prop, that the gates of hell ſhall never prevail againſt it: he hath promiſed to be with our Miniſtery (and us in our Miniſtery) to the end of the world; And therefore you are not like to ſee the downfall of it ſo ſoon as you think for: except you have a revelation (as one of your grand Prophets lately had) that the end of the world will be very ſoon; your hope in this (therefore) is but as the hope of the wicked which ſhall periſh, and be as a ſpiders webb.

If the Lord ſtrip us of that which you call legall maintenance, if he bring us to a morſell of bread, yea down to ſackcloth and aſhes, yet I doubt not, but you ſhall finde, that we ſhall truſt God ſo farre for our maintenance, that while we live we ſhall preach the Goſpel: And while we do preach the Goſpel, we doubt not but we ſhall live by the Goſpel: and if our maintenance be in that way which you call legall, we ſhall not deſire to keep it, if we be not able to juſtifie it to honeſter men, yea better wits then yours; to be lawfull, yea under the Goſpel. And that in the next place I ſhall undertake to ſhew you, by removing all thoſe ſilly and ridiculous objections which you (in your Paper) have layed in againſt it.

Paper. Firſt, you ſay, 'twas a legall maintenance. 2ly, that 'twas only given to the Prieſts under the Law for their ſervice. 3ly, that 'twas given to them as one of the ten Tribes, which they took onelyonly of their brethren, and that not by compulſion; but (you ſay) there is no equalitie that our Prieſts ſhould have it. Firſt, becauſe they are not the hundredth part of the people: 2ly, becauſe they have inheritance among their brethren. 3ly, (you ſay) the Prieſts of the Law had but the 10^th. of the increaſe; ours of mens labours. 4ly, the Prieſts of the Law were not ſo covetous as ours be. 5ly, (you ſay) Chriſt having put an end to the Prieſthood, hath alſo changed the Law which (you ſay) is Tithes: here you urge, Hebr. 7. 12. Hence you do farther inferre, that to take Tithes under the Goſpel, is abominable hereſie: and a denying of Chriſt come in the fleſh. 6ly, (you ſay) you may ſee God blaſting them in our poſterity, for they generally come to nothing, but are miſerable Laſtly, that in this we are Jewiſh, and may be call'd Jews.

Anſ. For Anſwer. Firſt, whereas you ſay 'tis legall maintenance; this is juſt as you call repentance, humilitie, obedience, and all duties legall graces and duties. We need not value ſuch a brand ſet upon the office, p. 45or Miniſtery, or maintenance of the miniſtery of the Goſpel, when the very graces of the Goſpel, ſuffer by you and your companions under the ſame reproach:—But to anſwer you.—'Tis legall maintenance, (ſay you) how legall? (I beleeve your meaning in this, is, that which you ſpeak more plainly in the 2d) as it was paid onelyonly to Prieſts under the Law, therfore legall: if this be your meaning (as it can be no other) here I ſhall preſently ſhew you your groſſe ignorance: Were Tithes paid onelyonly to Prieſts under the Law? how falſe is this? you might have ſeen in Hebr. 7. quoted by you, that Abraham paid Tithes to Melchiſede…h, and Levi himſelf in Abrahams loins. Now the Apoſtle ſhews you that the prieſthood of Melchiſedech was not that of Levi; for this is taken away (ſaith he) but the order of Melchiſedechs Prieſthood abides for ever.

Here then you ſee, that Tithes were paid to ſome other Prieſts then onelyonly to the Prieſts under the Law. Farther—when you read that Abraham and Jacob paid Tithes; I deſire to know from you, by what law they paid Tithes: whether was it by the Law of Nature, or by the Leviticall Law, or by an Evangelicall Law? one of the three muſt be, 'tis plain as the Sun, that it could not be by a Leviticall Law, and by virtue of that; for that was not then enacted, and by that Law Levi was to receive and not to pay Tithes; yet Levi himſelf in Abraham paid Tithes to Melchiſedech. Again, if they paid by the Law of Nature, that Law binds all men ſtill, as well now as then. And laſtly, if they paid by an Evangelicall Law, that binds alſo all Chriſtians to pay their Tithes towards the maintenance of Melchiſedechs prieſthood which endures for ever. Pray let me ſee your Anſwer to this.

Paper. In the next place you ſay, Tithes were given to the Prieſts under the Law, as they were one of the ten Tribes; which they took onelyonly of their brethren, and that not by compulſion; but there's no equalitie that our Prieſts ſhould have it: firſt, becauſe they are not the hundredth part of the people: 2ly, they have inheritance among the brethren. Again, they had but the tenth of the increaſe: ours of mens labours.

Anſ. In Anſwer to this, I muſt tell you here again your ignorance hath made you very bold and impudent, in ſpeaking that which I ſhall ſhew to you, and to al the world to be very falſe—And it muſt be under theſe heads. You put me here upon the conſideration of theſe two things: firſt the proportion of the perſons of the Prieſts under the Law▪ and 2ly, the proportion of their maintenance, and to compare it with ours now.

p. 46If you will look upon theſe two things in Scripture; you ſhall finde how falſly and abſurdly you do argue in your Paper. I will ſhew you, firſt for their perſons, that it will not be hard to prove, that the Tribe of Levi under the Law, were not the fourtieth part of the people. 2ly, for their maintenance, they had three times as much as any one Tribe.—

Firſt for their perſons; look upon the numbring of them, and compare, See Dr. Reynolds Exp: Pſal. 110. pag 477, 478, &c.Ps 110Numb. 1. 46. with Numb. 3. 39. and you ſhall finde, that the other Tribes were numbred from 20 yeers old and upward, to all that were able to bear Arms, which was to the age of fifty yeers (as Joſephus reports) (for at that age they were ſuppoſed to be unſerviceable for war) and yet being thus numbred, but from 20 to 50 yeers, their number amounted to ſix hundred and three thouſand, five hundred and fifty men able to go to war. On the other ſide, the Levites were numbred from one month old and upward, and yet the whole number amounted but to two and twenty thouſand. Now conjecture the number of thoſe in the other Tribes, who were under 20 yeers of age, and who were above fifty yeers to be but half as many as the reſt, (as it cannot be ſuppoſed that they were leſſe) yet the whole number of the Tribes reckoned from their infancie upward, will amount at leaſt to nine hundred two thouſand men, of which number, the number of the Levites, is juſt the one and fourtieth part. If you ſay that the Tribe of Levi increaſed to a mighty number afterwards, as may be found, 1 Chron. 23. 3. I ſay that the whole people increaſed accordingly; for the Tribe of Judah which was before but ſeventy foure thouſand, was then five hundred thouſand, and in Jehoſaphats time eleven hundred thouſand: See 2 Sam. 24. 9. and 2 Chron. 17. latter end:—here then ye ſee, how ye are miſtaken in the proportion of the perſons of the Levites. They were ſo farre from being a tenth part, that they were not ſo much as the fourtieth part of the people. And in the next place look into the proportion of their maintenance, and you ſhall ſee your ſelves more miſtaken there, one would think that the fourtieth part of the people, could require but the fourtieth part of the maintenance in proportion.

Paper. You ſay, they had no inheritance amongſt their brethren, and that they had but the tenth of the increaſe onelyonly.

Anſ. How durſt you thus belye the Scriptures? do you do it ignorantly, or wilfully? Firſt you ſhall finde that they had the tenth of all the increaſe of ſeed, and fruit, and great and ſmall cattell. See Levit. 27. 30. and 32. ver. 2ly, though they were not the fourtieth part of the people, they had 48 Cities with ſuburbs for cattell, and for gardens. p. 47See Numb. 35. the 7 firſt verſes; which Cities were next to the beſt, and in many Tribes the beſt of all: in Judah, Hebron; in Benjamin, Gibeon; both royall Cities: ſo that thoſe Cities with about a mile ſuburbe to every one of them, can come to little leſſe then the wealth of one Tribe alone in that little Countrey, which from Dan to Beerſheba, was but about 160 miles long.

3ly, They had all the firſt-fruits both of clean and unclean beaſts; ſee Numb. 18. 13. of the fruits of the earth, and of the fleece of the ſheep: Deut. 18. 4. Nehem. 10. 35. of men to be redeemed, Numb. 18. 15, 16.

4ly, The meat-offerings, the ſiu-offerings, the treſpaſſe-offerings, the heave-offerings, and the wave-offerings were all theirs. Numb. 18. 9, 10, 11.

5ly, They had all vows and voluntary oblations, and conſecrations, Numb. 18. 8, 9.

6ly, (excepting the Holocauſt) they had either the ſhoulder, or the breaſt, or the skin, or ſomething of every ſacrifice which was offered: Numb. 18. 18. Deut. 18. 3. Levit. 7. 30, 31.

7ly, The males were to appear three times a yeer before the Lord, and they were not to come empty handed: Exod. 23. 15: 17.—Laſtly, unto them did belong many recompences of injuries, which was the reſtitution of the principall, and a fift part. Num. 5. 7. 8. Now put the Tithes, the Cities, and theſe other conſtant revenues together, and you ſhall finde that the Prieſts and the Levites, who were but about a quarter as many as one Tribe, had yet about three times revenues of any one Tribe.

And thus you may ſee how falſly, how blindly, and groundleſly you argue, from comparing the revenues and the numbers of the Prieſts under the Law, with the Miniſters of the Goſpel and their Tithes. And whereas you ſay, they took it not by compulſion, how ſimple and ſilly is this? where did the people deny it? or where did they refuſe the payment of it? was it not a command of God? Doubtleſſe had there been denyall, there had been compulſion, in this as in other Laws.

Paper. Your next objection againſt us, why we ſhould not receive Tithes, is becauſe we are covetous; we bring into our ſtore-houſes, but we do not give to the poore.

Anſ. I onelyonly ask you here again how ye dare? how ye are not afraid to judge others thus: how came you to have that ſearching eye to look into mens hearts, and to ſee how covetous they are? Certainly (though ye pretend to beleeve what's written, in the Law, and the Prophets) p. 48your practiſe ſhews that you make little conſcience of making that your rule to walk by; or elſe you have learnt the trick of many now a dayes, to ſlip the collar, and to lay by ſo much of the Word, as doth in any way tend to the bridling or reſtraining of you in any of your unruly luſts.

Paper. In the next place you charge us with abuſing that place of Scripture, Mala. 3. 10. which (you ſay) was lawfull then, but not now; and you prove it thus: Chriſt having put an end to the Prieſthood, hath alſo changed the Law: Hebr. 7. 12. which Law (you ſay) was Tithes. And hence you conclude, that to take Tithes under the Goſpel (there being not the leaſt ſyllable for it) is abominable hereſie, and a denying of Chriſt come in the fleſh, &c.

Anſ. I anſwer. Firſt, for your charging us with abuſe of Scripture, I may ſay to you as Chriſt to the Phariſees judging others, Matth. 7. 3. Why beholdeſt thou the moat in thy brothers eye, and conſidereſt not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, firſt caſt out the beam out of thy own eye:—what a beam there is in the eye of your judgement, plainly appears to the world, in the very next line to this, in which you charge us with abuſing Scripture: And that is in your text cited, Hebr. 7. 12. where the Apoſtle, ſaying, that the prieſthood of Aaron and Levi being changed, there is of neceſſitie a change of the Law; you very boldly and impudently ſay, that by the word Law there, the Apoſtle means Tithes; And hence you conclude, that the right of Tithes is changed;—abominable ignorance and abuſe of Scripture: If this be not that wreſting of the Scripture which St. Peter ſpeaks of, let the underſtanding judge. Me thinks it would be incredible (if I had it not under your hands) that men who pretend ſo much to the ſpirit as you do, and are led by ſuch ſpirituall men, as you are, ſhould be thus blind.

I'le take a little pains here too, to ſhew you the Apoſtles meaning, and your own groſſe miſtakes.

The ſcope of the Apoſtle in ſeverall Chapters here, is onelyonly to draw off the Hebrews from the ſacrifices of the Law, and from ſeeking perfection in them; and to bring them to Chriſt crucified (and offered up now a ſacrifice for the ſins of thoſe that beleeve in him) and to the ſeeking of perfection, juſtification, ſanctification, and life in him: To this purpoſe, the Apoſtle ſets forth to them the excellency of Chriſts prieſthood and ſacrifice, above the prieſthood and ſacrifices of Aaron and Levi. In this Chapter he ſets forth the honour and excellency of Chriſts prieſthood, above that of Aaron and Levi under the Law, by ſhewing, the excellency p. 49of Melchiſedechs prieſthood above that of Aaron and Levi (he having avouched and declared before, that Chriſt was conſtituted and made a Prieſt for ever after the order of Melchiſedech) firſt here he ſhews that Chriſt is a Prieſt after the order of Melchiſedec (as from a teſtimony of David in Chap. 5.) from that abſolute agreement betwixt Melchiſedech and Chriſt, the parts wherof are theſe. 1. As Melchiſedech was King and Prieſt of the moſt high God, ſo Chriſt. 2ly, as Melchiſedech was King of righteouſneſſe, and Prince of peace, ſo was Chriſt. 3ly, As Melchiſedech his parents, kindred, beginning and ending of life are not recorded, ſo Chriſt as man without father, as God without mother, kindred, beginning, or ending of life, therefore Chriſt is truly a Prieſt after the order of Melchiſedech.—Secondly (having ſhew'd that Chriſt is a Prieſt after the order of Melchiſedec) he comes to ſhew that Melchiſedecs prieſthood is more excellent then that of Levi (and then 'twill follow, that he who is a Prieſt after his order (as Chriſt is) is greater then Levi.) This the Apoſtle proves, becauſe he was greater then Abraham; in whoſe Joins Levi was: he proves him to be greater then Abraham, in that Abraham payed Tithes to him, and in that Melchiſedech bleſſed Abraham, and without all contradiction the leſſe is bleſſed of the greater. (ſaith he) The Apoſtle having thus proved the perſon and prieſthood of Chriſt to be before and above that of Levi and Aaron; in the 11. verſe he ſhews, that the prieſthood of Levi was but imperfect in reſpect of Chriſts prieſthood, and therefore muſt juſtly now ceaſe, and be abrogated, when the prieſthood of Chriſt is come. According to that of the Apoſtle (in another caſe) 1 Cor. 13. 10. When that which is perfect is come, that which is imperfect is done away: Now to prove that the prieſthood of Levi is imperfect, he ſhews it, becauſe perfection, (viz: juſtification, ſanctification, and life eternall) could not be obtained by the Leviticall Prieſthood, viz: by their offering ſacrifices of buls, and goats, and rams, and lambes, &c. for under their Prieſthood the people received that Law.) And he goes on to ſhew that this perfection was not to be found in that ſervice; for if it could have been found there, there had been no farther need that another Prieſt ſhould have riſen after the order of Melchiſedech, which was a more excellent order then th…t of Levi. But ſeeing another prieſthood more excellent then that of Levi or Aaron, (viz: that of Chriſt) is riſen; in which there is perfection, viz: juſtification, ſanctification, and eternall life to be found; (in the 12. verſe) he ſhews them that the Prieſthood is changed, and therefore that Law which they were tyed to under Aaron and Levi (viz: of offering ſacrifices of buls p. 50and goats, &c.) is of neceſſity changed, and therefore muſt ceaſe to them: This Law (he ſaith) is changed, becauſe the Prieſthood is changed under which this Law was executed; and now another high Prieſt is riſen, (viz: Chriſt) who hath offered a ſacrifice once for ever.—So that by the Law here, the Apoſtle plainly means thoſe ſervices which (purſuing the ſame argument) he cals (in the next Chapter) the old Covenant, and a temporall Covenant, which was eſtabliſht and ratified upon the legall prieſtood. And in this 12. verſe of this 7th Chapter, he ſhews the mutuall relation betwixt the Leviticall prieſthood and the old Covenant, that the Prieſthood ceaſing, when the prieſthood of Chriſt did riſe, the Law alſo, that old Covenant, muſt of neceſſity ceaſe, being eſtabliſht and ratified upon the Leviticall Prieſthood.

Tis as much as if Paul had ſaid, Your Prieſthood being imperfect, and abrogated by Chriſt, your law (by which you were bound by thoſe Prieſts to offer ſacrifices for ſin) doth now ceaſe too, Chriſt having once for all offered himſelf a ſacrifice for the ſins of his people.

Now whether the words of the Apoſtle here, can by any (but ſuch as your ſelves) be wreſted to have any reference at all to Tithes, I leave all the world to judge. And I tell you, in your bold expounding the word [Law] here to be underſtood of Tithes, you have arrogated to your ſelves, more new and ſtrange light, then ever any man yet did, that undertook to expound this place of Scripture, ſince the Apoſtle did write it.—Oh glorious revelation.

Paper. In the next place, you ſay, there is not the leaſt ſyllable for it in the Goſpel, and the Apoſtles never owned it.

Anſ. Pray ſhew me where is the leaſt ſyllable againſt it in the Goſpel: or where did ever Chriſt or his Apoſtles diſown it? if your texts be no other againſt it then what you urge, Hebr. 7. 12. (though it may paſſe amongſt your ſelve…, and your ſilly women, who underſtand not Scripture) yet you will be laught and his't at, for your ſimplicitie, by thoſe who have any knowledge.—Shew me, I ſay, where the Law for paying Tithes is abrogated in the new Teſtament: whether it be not rather confirmed (at leaſt in the equity of it) for Chriſt ſpeaking of tithing mint and cummin, ſaith. Theſe things ye ought to do, and not to leave the other undone. Luk. 11 42. You'le ſay, perhaps, that the prieſthood of the Law being ended, Tithes alſo, which was their due are ended in them This I know is your argument you truſt to.—But for Anſwer, I have ſhewed you already, that the paying of Tithes did not belong onelyonly to the Leviticall Prieſthood; they were paid long before that Prieſthood was conſtituted.

p. 51Again, in that Melchiſedech received Tithes from Abraham (which the Apoſ…le in Hebr. 7. takes ſpeciall notice of foure or five times) ye may obſerve (Melchiſedech being a type of Chriſt) that Chriſt is a receiver Dr. Reyn: Exp: Pſ…l. 110.Ps 50:110of homage and tribute from his people. And farther, there was never any type of Chriſt, as a Prieſt, but he received Tithes as thoſe in the Law did: And theſe they received, not in the right of any thing in themſelves; but meerly in the virtue of their typicall office; ſo that originally they did manifeſtly pertain to that principall Prieſt whom theſe repreſented, whoſe perſonall Prieſthood is ſtanding for ever, unalterable and eternall; and therefore the rights, thereunto belonging are ſuch too.

Obj. If it be objected by you, why then did not Chriſt in his life time receive Tithes.

I anſwer. Firſt, becauſe though he were the ſubſtance, yet the ſtanding typicall Prieſthood was not aboliſhed, till after his miniſtery on earth was finiſht; for his Prieſthood was not conſummate till his ſitting at the right hand of God.

Secondly, he did not himſelf take Tithes, becauſe he took upon himſelf a voluntary poverty, for ſpeciall reaſons, belonging to the ſtate of his humiliation, and to the diſpenſation of mans redemption. See what Paul ſaith, 2 Cor. 8, 9.

Ob. You may (perchance) object farther, and ſay, now Chriſts prieſthood is conſummate, and he himſelf is in heaven, whither no Tithes can be ſent; therefore none are due, becauſe he hath no typicall Prieſts on earth to repreſent him.

Anſ. I anſwer. Though Chriſt be in heaven in his body, yet he is on earth in his miniſtery; and in the diſpenſation of the virtue of his ſacrifice, and the Miniſters of the Goſpel are in his ſtead: 2 Cor. 5. 20. and ought to be received as Chriſt himſelf: Galat. 4. 14. So that men are not by this excuſed from rendring Chriſts dues unto him; firſt, becauſe, there is in reſpect of him (whoſe ſacrifice we commemorate, and ſhew forth to the people) due, a teſtification of homage to him. 2ly, becauſe in reſpect of us there is due a reward of our labour;—for the labourer is worthy of his hire.

Now to lay all theſe together in one view.—In as much as all the types of Chriſt (as Prieſts) have received Tithes as due; and in as much as that right was not grounded upon any thing in or from themſelves, but upon their typicall office, and ſo did originally pertain to the principall Prieſt whom they typified; And in as much as his perſon and p. 52office is eternall, and therefore ſuch are all the Annexa and dues thereof; and in as much as he hath no where diſpenced with, denyed, or refuſed, or revoked this right, which from him (as the principall) all his types ever enjoyed. And laſtly, in as much as he hath left to the Miniſters of his Word the diſpenſation of his ſacrifice, and made them his Embaſſadors, and in his ſtead to the Church to ſet forth him crucified in his ordinances. For my part I deſire to be reſolved from you, (or by any other of your ſect, if there be any wiſer then other amongſt you) why unto them (in the name and right of their Maſter) thoſe rights ſhould not be due which were manifeſtly in his types, and of which he himſelf hath no where in his Word declared any revocation.

Paper. In the next place you ſay, That receiving of Tithes is an abominable hereſie, and a denying of Chriſt come in the fleſh.

Anſ. Oh abominable ignorance! I ſee you had need to be told what hereſie is, (and I cannot yet but commend your deſire of being informed) to this point what hath been already ſpoken may ſatisfie reaſonable men: And becauſe this is yet but (dictum) ſpoken by thoſe, who have ſpoken but little truth in this Paper, I muſt defer the giving any farther anſwer to it, till I receive ſome more of your new light, whereby you will prove, that the receiving of Tithes, denyes Chriſt to be come in the fleſh, when I ſee how you go about to prove it; I doubt not but I ſhall ſhew your folly in that as in the reſt of your ſtuffe; therefore no more at preſent.

Paper. Your next objection againſt Tithes is this: (you ſay) if we were not wilfully blinde, we might ſee God blaſting them: for 'tis remarkable, that ſcarce any of our poſterity come to any thing, but are generally miſerable.

Anſ. To this I anſwer. Firſt, if you were acquainted with the Word of God, or any of his dealings with his people (as you pretend, and indeed it appears to be but a pretence) you might know that proſperitie in this life, and increaſe in riches, is not alwayes a token of the favour of God. Read Pſal. 17. 14. and there ye ſhall ſee who they are, whoſe portions are in this life, Whoſe bellies are fill'd, and who leave the reſt of their ſubſtance to their babes. For our parts, we are not envious at the fooliſh, when we ſee the proſperity of the wicked. Pſal. 73. 3.

Again, 2ly, that our poſterity are generally miſerable, is no better then a bold lye.

3ly, If it were truth; yet the ſimplicitie of your argument appears to the world; I will make it appear to your ſelves: you argue thus, becauſe p. 53men that receive Tithes do not grow rich, nor thrive in their poſteritie, therefore 'tis not lawfull to receive Tithes: You ſhall ſee the abſurditie of your concluſion, in turning it upon your ſelves, thus. Some men have been Mercers, and have broke in their Trade; ſome have been **Note that their new Paſtor hath paſt through all theſe Trades, & Callings, and thrived in none.Stationers, Souldiers, Dairy-men, Schoolmaſters, &c. and have been blaſted in all theſe, have not thrived in all or any of theſe, but in all have proved miſerable; therefore 'tis not lawfull for any man to be a Mercer, a Stationer, a Souldier, a Dairy-man, a Schoolmaſter, &c. Do you ſee now what ſenſleſſe abſurd arguing this is?

Paper. In the next place (you ſay) we call our ſelves the Tribe of Levi, that we may have Tithes.—Anſ. This is another of your lyes.

Again, in this we are Jewiſh.—Anſ. I have already manifeſted your ſimplicitie and ignorance in this; therefore 'tis worth no more words here: I paſſe it over.

Paper. Again you ſay, you plainly ſee upon what our Miniſtery ſtands; take away our honour and our means, and our gifts are taken away.

Anſ. I have told you before whereupon our Miniſtery ſtands; and though you ſpeak ſo plainly, yet you have not (as yet) made it appear that our Miniſtery ſtands upon our honour and our means; but I doubt not but I ſhall make it appear to you, that both honour and means belong to our Miniſtery. In the mean time, let me know of you, when, or where did you ever know any mans gifts taken away with his means? either make it appear, or elſe ſit down, and acknowledge your ſelves to be men whoſe tongues are full of lying, ſlanders and reproaches. Doth this ſavour of the Spirit, ye pretend to be in you?

Paper. Next you tell us, that we cannot live by Tent-making and preaching the Goſpel, by fiſhing and catching of men; how then ſhould we have time to tumble over the Fathers? But Paul wanted for back and belly, yet was not wanting in preaching the Goſpel.

Anſ. I anſwer: (though we cannot) yet ſome in theſe late dayes have learn'd ſo to fiſh, and to catch men, that they can live by it, when (the world knows) they could never live, by continuing in that honeſt calling, unto which God had called them; they learn to forget that of Paul, 1 Cor. 7. 20. where he commands, Let every man abide in the ſame calling wherein he was called.

Again, for our tumbling over the Fathers; you that ſpeak ſo ſcornfully of thoſe worthy men, (whoſe pions labours and memories are precious with all godly and underſtanding men) you, I ſay, might p. 54very well imploy your time in going to ſchoo! to them a while (if you were able to underſtand them) by whom you might be convinced of the wickedneſſe of thoſe wayes you are now ſeduced to walk in; and that ye might be taught how to underſtand the Word, which now you ſo ſhamefully abuſe: and that you might be directed by them to walk in that truth which you are now ſo ignorant of.

Paper. The next nayl you drive at in a great deal of your ſtuffe together, is to tell us how we ought to preach the Goſpel, and to labour with our own hands, as Peter by fiſhing, and Paul by Tent-making.

Anſ. I anſwer. I doubt not, but that Paul whom you have inſtanced in for preaching the Goſpel, and working with his own hands, will diſcover to you, your malice and your folly, and your ſyllineſſe in objecting this to us: Paul himſelf will teach you (if you do not look upon this part of his doctrine as Apocrypha) firſt, that liberall maintenance is due to us from the people for our preaching the Goſpel: and 2ly, that this is due not out of mercy (as if our maintenance ought to depend on the voluntary contributions of our Pariſhioners) but out of juſtice for our works ſake, as we labour in the Word and doctrine.—And farther, that they who do labour in the Word and doctrine, have power to abſtain from labouring with their own hands, it is not required of them that they ſhould live by fiſhing or Tent-making, but 'tis allowed them that they ſhould live by the Goſpel.—For the proof of theſe things, ſee firſt, Gal. 6. 6. Let him that is taught in the Word, communicate to him that teacheth, in all his goods. (ſo the word is in the originall) 1 Tim. 5. 17, 18. The Elders that labour in the Word and doctrine are worthy of double honour. For the Scripture ſaith, Thouſhalt not muzzle the mouth of the ex that treadeth out the corn, for the labourer is worthy of his reward. But if you will look into 1 Cor. 9. 3. and ſo forward in the Chapter, ye ſhall there ſee Paul ſtating and debating the queſtion at large, Who goes to warfare at any time at his own charges? who plants a vineyard, and eats not of the fruit thereof? or who feeds a flock, and eats not of the milk of the flock? Say I theſe things as a man? that is, Am I partiall? do I ſpeak meerly out of affection, and humane favour to my own cauſe or calling? or ſaith not the Law the ſame alſo? For it is written in the Law of Moſes, Thou ſhalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn: doth God take care for oxen? Or ſaith he it altogether for our ſakes? that is, Doth God provide Laws for the rewarding and incouraging the labour of bruit beaſts; and doth he leave the maintenance and honour of his own immediate officers to the arbitrary and pinching allowances of covetous and cruell men? For our ſakes (no doubt) i… p. 55this written: that he that plougheth, ſhould plough in hope: and he that threſheth in hope, ſhould be partaker of his hope. That is, that the incouragement of the Miniſters in their ſervice might depend upon ſuch a hope as is grounded upon Gods Law and proviſion; And that they might not be left to the will and allowances of thoſe men againſt whoſe ſins they were ſent. And this the Apoſtle proves farther, by an argument drawn from a moſt unanſwerable, equitie.—If we have ſown unto you ſpirituall things, is it a great thing, if we ſhall reap your carnall things? Again, Do ye not know, that they which miniſter about holy things, live of the things of the Temple? and they which wait at the Altar, are partakers of the Altar? (to ſhew that they receive their maintenance from the hand of God himſelf, whoſe onelyonly the things of the Altar are) Even ſo hath the Lord ordained, that they which preach the Goſpel, ſhould live of the Goſpel. He ſaith not, that God permitteth or alloweth, but God ordaineth and commandeth it. And pray tell me, what is it to live? firſt, they muſt live as men; t…ey muſt have enough for neceſſitie. 2ly, they muſt live as beleevers; He that provideth not for his own, is worſe then an Infidel: 1 Tim. 5. 8. They muſt therefore have of the Goſpel, ſufficient to lay up for thoſe whom the l…w of common humanity (much more of faith) commands them to provide for. 3ly, they muſt live as Miniſters, they muſt have wherewith to maintain the duties of their calling, a good example of pietie, charitie, and hoſpitalitie. 1 Tim 3. 2. & 4 Ch: 12. v. From this you may obſerve, that thoſe who labour in the Word and Doctrine, and are Embaſſadors for Chriſt, and ſtand in his ſtead, to reveal his myſteries, and diſpence the treaſures of his blood in the Church, ought to have, (by way of homage to Chriſt, and by way of recompence and retribution to themſelves) a liberall maintenance, and fitting the honour and dignity of that perſon whom they repreſent, and of that ſervice wherein they miniſter. The Apoſtle ſaith, they are worthy of double honour; honour of reverence, and honour of maintenance.

Again, farther yet: to ſhew you that this maintenance ought not to depend upon the voluntary contribution of the people, as an act of MercieMercy, and not of Juſtice. The ſame Paul tels the ſame Corinthians in the ſame Chapter, that he and Barnabas did not work with their hands, becauſe they had not power to demand and receive maintenance from them for their preaching the Goſpel to them: Am I not an Apoſtle? (ſaith he) what then? Have we not power to eat and to drink? Have we not power to leade about a wiſe, a ſiſter, as well as the other Apoſtles, and as the brethren of the Lord, and Cephas? Or I onelyonly and Barnabas? Have not we power to forbear working? p. 56The Apoſtle plainly intimates in theſe 4, 5, and 6 verſes, that all the other Apoſtles did receive maintenance from the people for themſelves and their wives, and that they had power ſo to do, as they were Apoſtles. And pray tell me, whom do you finde of the Apoſtles (beſides Paul and Barnabas) who (after they did preach the Goſpel) did ever work with their hands (for their living) in their former Trades and Callings? but had maintenance by the preaching of the Goſpel, and had power to receive it. And Paul himſelf tels them there (as you have ſeen) that he and Barnabas, did not work for this, that they had no power to receive maintenance by the Goſpel as well as the other Apoſtles, and power to leave working with their hands, but they did it for other ends.

Hence now (as you ſay, if you be not quite blinde) ye may ſee, that liberall maintenance is due to the Miniſters of the Goſpel, as Miniſters for their works ſake; That they have power to take this from the people, and power to leave working with their own hands for their maintenance.—Let me hear what you have to ſay to theſe things.

Again, ſee 1 Tim. 4. 15. Meditate on theſe things, give thy ſelf wholly to them; that thy profiting may be known to all. Anſwer me; what doth Paul mean, by bidding Timothy to give himſelf wholly to theſe things? had it not ſounded like a contradiction if it had run thus; Labour with thy own hands at ſome trade for thy living, and give thy ſelf wholly to reading, exhortation, doctrine, meditation? do you ſee your ſimplicity and ignorance now in this malicious objection againſt us?

Farther yet. I hope by this reaſonable men may be convinc'd, that it is a divine right that Miniſters ſhould have a maintenance, and that for their preaching the Goſpel: And for the proportion, diſtribution, the manner of the peoples paying, and their receiving that maintenance, their uſe and enjoyment of it, if you look upon it, and we acknowledge it to be of a civill right; Then if by the Laws of the Kingdom, the proportion of Tithes be allowed us, and we by the ſame Laws hold and poſſeſſe them (there being nothing in the whole written Word to forbid ſuch a way, and ſuch a proportion) it appears to rationall men, that we have as lawfull a Freehold in our Tithes, as any man, hath to his Lands, and can enjoy and poſſeſſe them, without being guilty of abominable hereſie; and without a denying of Chriſt to be come in the fleſh.

Again, as for our receiving, ſo for your paying Tithes; know this, that it being the Apoſtles doctrine, that Miniſters of the Goſpel ſhould p. 57live by the Goſpel; And the Miniſters of this Kingdom being allowed and authorized, by the juſt Laws and lawfull Magiſtrates of this Kingdom to receive Tithes of their people; and every man being compell'd under the penalty of the Law of this Kingdom, to the payment of them (there being nothing, no not a word) in the Word of God to forbid ſuch a law, I ſay, Tithes becoming this way due to us by the Law of the Land, and the Apoſtle commanding all Chriſtians (Rom. 13. 7.) to render to all their dues; whoſoever ſhall go about to defraud, or to deny their Miniſter this his due, he is in this moſt impious, and ſacrilegious.

Will you be aſhamed now of your ignorance? and be a little more wary for the time to come, how you give liberty to your unbridled tongues, and diſtempered paſſions to cenſure, miſreport, or ſlander, or ſcandalize the perſons, parts, callings, maintenance of ſuch men againſt whom Timothy was not to receive an accuſution without two or three witneſſes: 1 Tim. 5. 19.—and to take notice of the ill conſequences of the ſame; you do not onelyonly contract the guilt of ſin to your ſelves; but you expoſe your ſelves in your madneſſe, ignorance, malice and folly, to be the object of ſorrow and grief to thoſe that know you, and pitie your poore ſouls; and the object of laughter to all others, that have any knowledge of the truth.

In your next paſſage you expreſſe more of that bitterneſſe that is in your ſpirits: (poore men) There be ſome Symons crept in amongſt you, which (as he did in Act. 8.) do bewitch you, who ſeems to you to be ſome great one; and (as the people beleeved of him) ſo do many now give heed to many that be abroad, as if they were the great power of God; whereas (indeed) in the end they will prove to be but ſorcerers. And as for all your wicked and falſe accuſations, I ſhall onelyonly ſay to you (as Peter did to Simon) Repent of this your wickedneſſe, and pray God, if perhaps the thoughts of your hearts may be forgiven you. For 'tis eaſie for a Chriſtian to perceive, that theſe are the expreſſions of thoſe who are in the very gaul of bitterneſſe, and bond of iniquity. Look upon ſome of them, and you your ſelves ſhall be Judges.

Paper. You ſay peremptorily that we ſtrike at the very foundation of Truth, as he that is ſpirituall may eaſily diſcern, &c.

Anſ. I anſwer. Firſt, I will not undertake to judge your ſpirits; but this I muſt tell you, that (how ſpirituall ſoever you pretend to be) that ſpirit that charges us with ſtriking at the very foundation of Truth, is a ſpirit of envie, hatred, malice, reviling, evill ſpeaking, lying and ſlandering; and what ſpirit this is, I leave it to your ſelves to judge.

p. 582ly, Me thinks you ſhould not ſo cruelly have condemned us for this, but you ſhould have told us what truth we did ever ſtrike at; you have quickly forgotten your own rule, but now given to us, concerning hereſie and hereticks: you told us that the Goſpel way, was firſt to prove men ſuch, and then to reprove; but it ſeems you walk not in the ſame Goſpel way. Remember here that of Paul, Rom. 2. 1, 3. Thou art inexcuſable, O man, whoſoever thou art that judgeſt: for wherein thou judgeſt another, thou condemneſt thy ſelf, for thou that judgeſt doeſt the ſame things. And thinkeſt thou this, that judgeſt another, and doeſt the ſame things, that thou ſhalt eſcape the judgement of God? you ſhould firſt prove us ſuch, and then condemne us. 'Tis your own counſell, and therefore (I hope) will not be rejected by you. I deſire that this may be proved againſt us, elſe ſurely 'twill condemne you.

3ly. I doubt not, but in the end, and upon the tryall it ſhall be made appeare that in thoſe very things (wherein you raſhly condemne us, for ſtriking at the foundation of truth) the Lord himſelfe (whoſe eyes are upon the truth) and all that are acquainted with any of the truths of God, will acquit and juſtifie us, as contending only for the truth that was once delivered to the Saints, and ſtriving for the faith of the Goſpel, which is now invaded and miſerably wounded by thoſe ſpirits that are already, whom (as the Apoſtle fore-told) the way of truth is evill ſpoken of.

Paper. In the next place, you charge us with deceiving the hearts of the ſimple, and endeavouring to deceive the very elect, that we make truth looke every way (like Janus faces) that you have need of the wiſdome of God to diſcover us, and the depths of Satans deceipts and wiles, that the Lord, who hath begun to uncover, unvayl, unmask, uncloath, &c. will do it fully, and will tread Satan under foot.

Anſ. I anſwer, in that wee are charged as deceivers. I tell you here againe we can (we bleſſe God) ſpeake it before God, that we are not as many, that deale deceitfull with the word of God, but as of ſincerity, as of God, in the ſight of God ſpeake we in Chriſt, and as Paul ſaid, 2 Cor. 6. We ſhall endeavour (under all your reproaches) to approve our ſelves as the Miniſters of God in much patience, by honour and diſhonour, by evill report and good report, as deceivers and yet true.

2ly. We cannot but ſmile at your compariſon: Can you Tho. Clutterbuck, or you Tho. Sheppard, or the Ironmonger, or Shoomaker, or Boddice-maker, or any of you tell what Janus faces meane?—Poore men (though you ſeeme to ſcorne the pretious fountaines as you call them) p. 59yet it ſeems you do ſometimes ſo farre forget your ſelves, as to make uſe of heathen hiſtories.

3ly, The Lord give you his wiſdome, (if it be his will) that you may be once able to diſcerne the depths of Satans deceipts and wiles: And let the Lord go on (in much mercy to your ſoules) to pluck off Satans maske and vizard, to uncloath, unvaile and uncover to you, the hidden things of darkneſſe, which are at preſent ſo imbraced by you as new light: 'Tis the deſire of our ſoules (the Lord knowes) to have Satan diſcovered and trodden under foot.

Paper. In the next place you ſay, though you have been as Balaams Aſſe to carry the falſe Prophets and to call them Divines, yet God having now opened your eyes, you dare not goe forward in that practiſe.

Anſ. I anſwer, if ever in your lives, you carried the burthen of Balaams Aſſe, you doe now: we have given you ſome deſcriptions already out of theſe two Apoſtles Peter and Jude, wherein as in a glaſſe (I told you) you might ſee the faces of thoſe whom yee follow. And both thoſe Apoſtles doe likewiſe add this of them: they have forſaken the right way, and are gone aſtray following the way of Balaam the ſonne of Boſor who loved the wayes of unrighteouſneſſe, 2 Pet. 2. 15. Againe, Woe unto them, for they have gone in the way of Caine, and runne greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, Epiſtle of Jude ver. 11. And if your eyes were were but ſo farre open'd, (if you were not more blind then Balaams Aſſe was) yee might ſee the Angel with his drawne Sword in his hand ready to deſtroy you for your running on thus to curſe the people of God.

Paper. Next, you ſay, that we run you through with the Sword of reproach, and had wee the Sword of the Magiſtrate in our hands we would have ſlaine you, becauſe you would not obey us rather then God.

Anſ. All that I ſay to this, is, as formerly I have ſpoken to ſome of the like ſtuffe, the Lord rebuke thee, thou falſe tongue, the righteous God judge betwixt you and us in theſe things, which of us, or in what have any of us, at any time deſired you to obey any of us rather then God? Set us know, or elſe recant and repent: however this is our comfort, that the Lord will cleare this one day.

Paper. In your next part you cry out of the monſtrous deſperate hereticks of theſe times, that condemne your gentle, meeke, curteous carriage, your civility, and your moderate brotherly walking for ſymptomes of hereſie.

p. 60Anſ. I beleeve this comes, from a marke of a falſe Prophet, which was lately given you amongſt other notes, by which you were directed to know them, this was given to you as one, viz a counterfeit humility, and this is no other marke then what Saint Paul himſelfe gives of falſe Prophets, Coloſ. 2. 18, 23. therefore ſure this is no ſuch abominable monſtrous and deſperate hereſie, as you call it. And for your parts whether your meekneſſe, gentleneſſe, courteouſneſſe, civility, moderation, walking as brethren (which you pretend ſo much to) be in you in truth, or whether it be counterfeit, I leave it to God (who ſees the inſide) to judge, and to the world, to whoſe eyes this Paper of yours may come; ye have here indeed given us a Taſt of your meekneſſe, of your civility, gentleneſſe, moderation, and of the Saint-like, Lamb-like ſpirit that is in you.

Paper. In your next place, you tell us, that we owne in words Chriſt to be our Lord and Maſter, and call our ſelves his Miniſters, if you are ſo, then (ſay you) we hope you are able to produce his commiſſion for what you doe. And if Chriſt be your only Lord and Law-giver how comes it to paſſe, that you winde and turne at every command of men?

Anſ. I anſwer, wee doe owne Chriſt to be our Lord and Maſter, and Chriſt hath, and we doubt not but he ever will owne us to be his Miniſters; ſo long as wee are able to produce his commiſſion for what we do. That we have his commiſſion for our office and miniſtery, that I have ſhewed you before.

Paper. But (ſay you) if Chriſt be your onelyonly Lord and Law-giver, how comes it to paſſe that you turne and wind at every command of men?

Anſ. I anſwer, we acknowledge Chriſt to be our only Lord and Law-giver. But we deſire (for the information of your ignorance) to let you know, that Chriſt gives Laws either immediately, or mediatly. The immediate laws of Chriſt are thoſe which are ſet downe in his written Word. But 2ly, he gives laws mediately, by thoſe lawfull Magiſtrates, who are Gods ordinance amongſt men. Now when the commands of lawfull Magiſtrates (whom you call men, and God cals Gods) are ſuch as are no way contrary to, or diſagreeing from, but agreeable to the written word of Chriſt, (in a word) when their commands are onelyonly in things lavvfull, honeſt, juſt, and good; our obeying them (vvhichwhich you call vvinding and turning) is no leſſe then an obeying of Chriſt our Lord and Lavv-giver, vvho by his Apoſtles hath commanded us, to be p. 61ſubject to the higher povvers, for the povvers that be, are ordained of God, and hath told us likevviſe that vvhoſoever reſiſteth, reſiſts the ordinance of God, and they ſhall receive to themſelves damnation, for he is the Miniſter of God to thee for thy good. Wherefore vve muſt needs be ſubject not only for vvrath but for conſcience ſake, Rom. 13. 1, 2, 3, 4. &c.—And againe, ſubmit your ſelves to every ordinance of man for the Lords ſake, whether it be unto the King as ſupreame, or unto Governours, as unto thoſe that are ſent by him, 1 Pet. 2. 13, 14.—Novv on the other ſide, I deſire you to make it good to me (if you can) vvhere any of us have turned and winded at any other commands of men, then ſuch as have been the lawfull commands of lawfull Magiſtrates, whom (I ſay) we are commanded to obey, for the Lords ſake, and for conſcience ſake.

Paper. In the next place. If Chriſt be your Lord (ſay you) where is his command that you ſhould go ſeven yeers or more to the Univerſity to fit your ſelves; and then, and not before to preach: and that unleſſe you do, you muſt not preach.

Anſ. Oh ridiculous ſimplicitie and ſyllineſſe! may I not as well ask you Thomas the Clothier, Giles the Mercer, Roger the Shoomaker, Samuel the Boddice-maker, and William the Ironmonger, you profeſſe that Chriſt is your Lord and Maſter; where's his command that you ſhould ſerve ſeven yeers under a Maſter at your Trade, and that then you ſhould ſet up your trade for your ſelves, and not before? I will anſwer your quaere in ſuch a compariſon. Thus,—you know that it is God's will that every man have ſome or other lawfull Calling to abide in, and to labour. See 1 Cor. 7. 20. 22. 24. Now the Common-wealth in which you live, hath in Chriſtian policy, thought it good to Enact ſuch a Law, that none ſhall have leave, to ſet up any Trade in the Commonwealth, till they have ſerved ſuch a time in the Trade; And this is grounded upon ſeverall reaſons. As firſt to avoid confuſion in the Common-wealth: 2ly, that men might be thereby enabled and fitted for their callings; leſt entring upon them without knowledge, they (firſt) abuſe and undo their ſelves for want of skill: and 2ly, that the Common-wealth be not abuſed, by their venting and ſelling Wares not vendible, and uſefull, and the like. To clear this to you in an inſtance, if every man, that had a will to it, ſhould freely ſet up the Trade of a Mercer, Shoo-maker, Boddice-maker, Ironmonger, Clothier, &c. who had not ſerved at the Trade, and had no knowledge in the Trade, you would preſently judge, that here were like to be a fair Trade, the Common-wealth was like to be well ſerved, and we ſhould have ſtrange p. 62commodities from them, poore Cloth, Shooes, Boddice, &c.—This by way of compariſon.

And from this to ſhew you in like manner, that the office of preaching the Goſpel of Chriſt, and adminiſtring of Sacraments, is a diſtinct office in the Church: It is the will and command of Chriſt that ſuch as undertake, and enter into this office, ſhould be qualified with abilities, parts, and gifts, fitting for ſo great a work, he muſt not be a novice, 1 Tim. 3. 6. he muſt be able to teach others: 2 Tim. 2. 2. he muſt be a workman, ſo able to divide the Word of God aright, as that he need not to be aſhamed: 2 Tim. 2. 15. Where this ability is wanting, the Church of Chriſt is like to be as ill ſerved, as the Common-wealth by ſimple and unskilfull Tradeſmen.—Now the Apoſtle tels us, that the Scriptures are ſufficient to make the man of God perfect, and to furniſh him throughly to all good works: (that is) to all the ſervices of his profeſſion, to thoſe works of his calling he mentioned before, viz: doctrine, reproof, correction, and inſtruction: for theſe things the Scriptures are ſufficient to furniſh a man: But now for the ſufficient underſtanding, and not perverting, and wreſting of the Scriptures, learning is requiſite and neceſſary. 2 Pet. 3. latter end.

To clear this farther to you, you muſt know, that there be two great works which belong to this high calling: firſt Inſtruction of the ſcholar: 2ly, conviction of the adverſaries. Now every underſtanding man can judge how many different parts of learning are requiſite to the perfection See Dr. Reynolds Exp: Pſal. 110. pa. 268.Ps 110of theſe two ſervices. Firſt, there muſt be knowledge in the tongues, for the better underſtanding of the holy Scriptures, by their originall Idiom and emphaſis; for in Tranſlations there may be, and are ſome errors; for though the Scriptures be the infallible Word of God, yet the Tranſlators are men, which are ſubject to errour, and may miſtake. 2ly, There is required the knowledge of the Arts to obſerve the cōnnexion, the argumentation, and method of them. 3ly, there is required knowledge of ancient cuſtomes, Hiſtory, and Antiquitie, of the Babylonians, Perſians, Greeks, and Romanes: without in-ſight whereinto, the full meaning of many paſſages of holy Scripture cannot be clearly underſtood and apprehended. 4ly, there is required School-learning, for the diſcovering and repelling of the ſubtilty of the adverſaries (and becauſe Julian the Apoſtate ſaw that the Chriſtians in his time made excellent uſe of this, in repelling and beating down his errors, he therefore interdicted them, the uſe of Schools of Learning; whoſe examples many Apoſtates from our Church follow in theſe dayes, who cry out againſt all humane Learning as the weapons of Gentiles, and not fit for Chriſtians to uſe.)

p. 63Laſtly, there is required a knowledge of the Hiſtories and Antiquities of the Church, that we may obſerve the ſucceſſion of the Profeſſors and doctrines thereof, the originals ſprouting of Hereſie therein, and the better to anſwer the reproaches of our inſolent adverſaries, who lay innovation to our charge.

In a word, men cannot underſtand the Scripture in their originall languages without the tongues, they cannot expound without Grammar, nor perſwade without Rhetoricke, nor divide without Logick, nor ſound the depth of any controverſie, without Philoſophy and ſchool divinity. Now ſeeing all this learning is requiſite, for the underſtanding, expounding, dividing the word aright, and for inſtructiing, exhorting and perſwading thereby, and for the convincing the gainſayers thereof. You muſt know, that there are but two waies (that ever we heard of) for the gaining of theſe requiſites. The firſt is extraordinary, the immediate inſpiration of the Holy Ghoſt, and the miraculous gifts of Tongues and Prophecy. And 2ly, The ordinary acquiring of theſe by the means which God hath vouchſafed viz. Schools of learning, and our applying our ſelves to, and our endeavours in them.—The firſt of theſe waies, viz. the gaining of theſe abilities, by immediate inſpiration and revolation, hath ceaſed in the Church of Chriſt theſe many hundred yeares, even ever ſince the time of the Apoſtles of Chriſt, who (being in themſelves ſome of them (before their calling to their Apoſtleſhip) unlearned men) did receive their gifts and abilities this way: Acts 2. And many other Primitive Chriſtians with them in thoſe daies: but thoſe Irradiations, Revelations and Inſpirations of the Spirit together with the fiery Tongues have ceaſed for many hundred yeares, and have not been ſeen in any Chriſtian Church of late. Therefore there remains onelyonly that other ordinary way of gaining theſe abilities which I have mentioned, viz. in the lawfull and diligent uſe of the means; by going to the Univerſity (as you call it) or to ſome Schooles where learning is to be had, to fit our ſelves.—

Now then—ſeeing the office of the Miniſtery is a diſtinct office, ſeeing thoſe that enter into it muſt be furniſht with abilities, gifts, and partes enabling them to teach, and by the word to inſtruct, to correct, to exhort and to convince, ſeeing theſe parts and abilities, are not inſpired miraculoully, but acquired in and by the uſe of means, ſeeing theſe means are the Schools of Learning; ſeeing through the uſe of theſe means (by Gods bleſſing on our endeavours) we attain to theſe abilities and parts; And ſeeing the Spirit of God directs and enables us p. 64by theſe abilities and parts, to divide the word aright, to inſtruct, exhort, correct, and convince &c. I hope that the ſimplicity of your Quaere, and the the ſufficiency of our commiſſion in this, doth viſibly appear to rationall men.

And before I leave this point, let me tell you, that we can never ſufficiently admire nor deteſt, the ſaucineſſe of thoſe bold Intruders in theſe dayes, who venture to become teachers of the ignorant before themſelves have been Diſciples of the Learned; who being rude and unlearned (I had almoſt ſaid illiterate) mechanicks without calling, and without knowledge, do ſo boldly and preſumptuouſly leap from their manuall Trades into this ſacred and dreadfull office, of which Paul himſelf could cry out, who is ſufficient? And though ſome of them pretend to a calling to it, and to gifts and abilities; for their calling I would feigne know who is the author of it: if they avouch God; I would require that they ſhould prove th… their calling from God by ſome evident ſigne: for whenſoever it pleaſeth God to change the ordinary courſe, and to cal any man to any office extraordinary, he declares that his good will and pleaſure by ſome evident ſigne. Now if the calling of our Anabaptiſticall new teachers, be ordinary, let them demonſtrate it by the Scripture, if extraordinary, let them prove it by ſigne and by miracl…. And as for their gifts and abilities (in which they ſay they are ſpirituall men, and have all the gifts from the ſpirit: I ſhall tell you that (whatſoever their pretences be to the Spirit and Revelations and Infuſions) yet ſeeing they cannot do as thoſe Primitive Chriſtians did; ſeeing they come as far ſhort of thoſe Chriſtians in extraordinary gifts, as they do behind them in time; ſeeing they are ſo far from ſpeaking with ſtrange Tongues, that they cannot ſpeake correctly See Dr. Featly Dipper dipt.and coherently in their own mother-Tongue; ſeeing they are many times ſo wide from the ſence of ſome Scriptures they venture to expound and apply, that their Expoſitions and Applications are oft without ſence; ſeeing they utter old broken Notes taken from other mens Sermons, for new Revelations; ſeeing they furbiſh up ancient hereſies that have layen long in the dark, for Chriſtian Armour of light; ſeeing in their Interpretations they not onelyonly contradict Scripture, but themſelves; ſeeing their prophecyings are but vain janglings; (though ſome of them have got a glib tongue, and thereby ſlide into the approbation of the vulgar ſort) ſeeing in their contemplations they oft ſoar ſo high, as that they looſe themſelves; and vent blaſphemies and groſſe errors, for viſions and revelations of the Spirit. Seeing (I ſay) that (notwithſtanding p. 65all their ſpecious pretences) theſe be their fruits, as the very ſad experience of theſe times, do too well manifeſt to the world; They ſhall give us leave to eſteeme them no Prophets, but Enthuſiaſts; no inſpired men, but diſtracted; no Seers, but dreamers; no Expoſitors, but Impoſtors; no workmen, but botchers; no fixed ſtars, but wanderers; no lights, but exhalations incenſed in the night, which leade fools out of their way, ſometimes into thickets, ſometimes into ditches and quagmyres, and many into Rivers over head and ears.

Paper. Your next Quaere is, where is our command that we ſhould admit any to either ſeals, before they can make it viſibly to appeare that they are in Chriſt?

Anſ. Here you begin to ſpeak a little plainly, and to tell us now what Religion you are of, viz. pure Anabaptiſts. I know your meaning is, where is our commiſſion to baptize Infants? for theſe cannot make it viſibly appeare that they are in Chriſt: I anſwer, where is your command from Chriſt, to require all thoſe that would be admitted to the ſeals, firſt to make it viſibly appear, that they have intereſt in Chriſt? I here undertake to make it good to you from the Word of God; firſt that it is an unwarrantable practice, in you or any other, and an unjuſt ſcrupuloſity to require ſatisfaction of the true grace, and reall holines of every one that is admitted a member of the viſible Church: what do you think of the Apoſtles baptizing Simon Magus, Act. 8. 13. 'tis true, the text ſaith, that he beleeved alſo, and was baptized: but all the world knows, and acknowledges that that beleeving, was but an externall profeſſion of faith (being convinced by miracles of Gods power) did he, or could he make it (viſibly) appear, that he had intereſt in Chriſt? The Apoſtles tell him afterward in that Chapter, that he was in the gall of bitterneſſe, and the bond of iniquitie; yet having before made but an outward profeſſion of faith in Chriſt, he was admitted to baptiſme. And where there is ſuch an outward profeſſion made, you cannot anſwer the denying the ſeal of Baptiſme to ſuch a one; And we have no warrant to require a farther ſatisfaction of their reall intereſt in Chriſt.

And therefore 2ly, I likewiſe undertake to make it good to, & againſt you, and your Goliah (who ever he be) that children of beleeving, and Chriſtian parents ought to be admitted to the firſt ſeal of the Covenant, viz: Baptiſme: and if you require a ſyllabicall command for this practiſe; I deſire to know of you on the contrary, where Chriſt or his Apoſtles have in plain tearms forbidden, or denyed them this ordinance, or where we are commanded not to admit them? becauſe the p. 66Church wherein we live, hath been for many hundred yeers, and is ſtill to this day, in poſſeſſion and practice of this ordinance; I (being alreadie ſatisfied in my own conſcience) muſt hear from you, what you have to ſay againſt this practice, before I ſpend more labour in the defence of it: if you have any thing, to ſay againſt it, let me hear what it is; and I doubt not, but I ſhall eaſily make it appear to you, that your denying the Sacrament of Baptiſme to Infants of Parents profeſſing faith, is an hereticall opinion and practice; and ſo convince you of your errour herein; And I ſhall likewiſe in that ſhew you our commiſſion from Chriſt for this practice.

Paper. In the next place, you ask us, where is our command to admit prophane drunkards, ſwearers, lyars, or raylers, to the Lords table?

Anſ. Firſt, whoſoever charges us with admitting prophane drunkards, ſwearers, lyars, or raylers (as ſuch) to the Lords Supper, they are lyars, and raylers. 2ly, I demand of you whether if a man hath once been a drunkard, lyar, ſwearer, &c. he may never be admitted, becauſe he hath been formerly ſuch a one? or whether thoſe that have been ſuch, may not be admitted when they give viſible teſtimonies and profeſſions of their repentance, of their deſires to wait upon God in that ordinance, for their receiving a ſeal of the pardon of their former ſins upon their repentance and faith in Chriſt; and for increaſing, confirming and ſtrengthening that grace they have already received in their converſion? If becauſe ſome men have been ſuch, they therefore may never be admitted, upon any tearms, if that be your opinion, the Lord deliver me from it: if you would deal truly with your own ſouls, and look in upon your ſelves, may it not be ſaid to you, as Paul ſaid to his Corinthians: 1 Cor. 6. 11. Such were ſome of you: And I heartily wiſh that you did not give ſuch occaſion (as many of you do) to the world ſtill to ſay, ſuch are ſome of you: I do not know what your Communion is, or what your ordinances be which you follow, and communicate in ſince you renounced our Church; but (for all your out-cryes againſt our prophane mixtures and communions; I beleeve if God would give you hearts to ſearch, and ſee among your ſelves, you would quickly finde, that you are not all of you ſuch Saints, as you would fain paſſe for. The ſhamefull corruptions which might be found amongſt your ſelves, would ſtop your mouthes from crying out againſt confuſed and mixt communion with the prophane.

Paper. Your next Quaere is, where hath Chriſt commanded, that Goſpel Miniſters ſhould take Tythes?

p. 67Anſ. I ask you, pray tell me, where hath Chriſt forbidden either them to take, or the people to pay Tithes?

Again (me thinks) (men that can take that liberty that you can) ſhould not be ſo hard driven for accuſations againſt us, as to be fain to repeat the ſame thing twice or thrice over; which you had ſo largely urged before: I have ſaid enough already to ſatisfie this ſilly queſtion; and therefore ſhall meddle no more with theſe Coleworts twice or thrice ſod.

Paper. Laſtly, you ask me, where's our command that after perſons are admitted Church-members, (by which they have a right to all the priviledges thereof) that we muſt examine them, whether they be fit or no; or to deny any, if they refuſe to be examined by us?

Anſ. How do you contradict your ſelves in theſe your Quaeries, which are within half a ſcore lines: before you askt us, what command we had, to admit prophane ones, who were unfit? here you ask us what authority we have to examine them, concerning their fitneſſe, or unfitneſſe before we admit them? you tell us 'tis unwarrantable practice to keep any away who are members; and the ground upon which you conclude this to be unwarrantable practice, is, becauſe they are members, and ſo have right to all the priviledges of the Church. Here let me ask you, whether or no thoſe who are admitted members of the viſible Church, if after their admiſſion they fall into prophaneneſſe, into groſs and ſcandalous ſins (as their being Church-members doth not put them into an impoſſibilitie of committing ſome ſuch ſins) if (I ſay) after they are members, they fall into ſuch practiſes; muſt they be admitted to all priviledges, and communion in all ordinances meerly upon this ground becauſe they are already members? and muſt no lawfull means be uſed to bring them to a ſight thereof, and to repentance, and to fit them farther for ordinances, becauſe they are already members? what ſimple wilde fellow is't that leads you into theſe ſtrange conceits? what think you of the inceſtuous perſon, in the Church of Corinth, 1 Cor. 5. was he not a member? did he not commit a grievous ſin? might not he (upon your argument have pleaded a right to all priviledges, as he was a member? yet for all this the Corinthians had a command to caſt him out. Now for our caſting out (you ſay) if any of our members be unfit (as queſtionleſſe there may be an unfitneſſe in ſome members, in any Church) why is he not caſt out? (ſay you) what will no leſſe puniſhment ſerve turn? nothing but caſt him out preſently? we would fain know of you, where is your, or any Churches authority, to caſt out a member, p. 68for every ſin that may make him unfit at preſent for communicating, in the Lords Supper? or is the caſting him out of the Church the onelyonly way to make him fit? whether or no is it not (even in your weak judgement) a more likely way, in a milde and brotherly manner, firſt in private to admoniſh, to reprove, to convince, to exhort, to inſtruct, to the end ſuch a one may be fit, and if no other means will ſerve, then to caſt out.

But for our caſting out, I have told you already, that the power of our Church in the execution of ſuch things, is taken away by thoſe, who will have Liberty to be, and to doe any thing, and yet not be caſt out. Surely therefore your charging us with theſe things and cenſuring us for confuſion, is an uncharitable and an unwarrantable practice.

Paper. In your next particular you tell us, that whereas we ſay that hereticks ſpread errors and hereſies without oppoſition; furely we muſt meane our ſelves.

Anſ. Truly, 'tis very wittily concluded; we deſire you to proove this, that we are hereticks, that we acknowledge our ſelves to be ſuch; that our doctrine is pernicious and falſe (for this you charge us with) prove this (I ſay) againſt us, or elſe you will be poſted for the muſt impudent malicious lyars, revilers and ſlanderers, that this generation hath brought forth.—For any thing elſe that is in this particular of your Paper, 'tis anſwered before, and therefore not worthy of any more time here.

Paper. In the next particular there are two things to be ſpoken to. Firſt you tell me that whereas I ſay I love true grace, piety and holyneſſe, and ſhall be willing to embrace it though it come from the breaſt of the greateſt enemy (here's a myſtery wants unfolding, and (in the cloſe of this particular) you tell me wherein the myſtery lyes) you ſay, my expreſſion hints to you, that true grace, piety, and holineſſe, and I are enemies: for can it be, that if you have true grace (ſay you) that another that hath true grace, and you ſhould be enemies, yea the greaeſt enemies, when true grace makes of the greateſt enemies, the neereſt and ſtrongeſt friends: ſure (ſay you) you did not conſider what you writ, or if you did, you ſhould have done well to have explained your meaning.

Anſ. I anſwer. Firſt, I did very well conſider what I writ, when I ſaid that I loved true grace, piety and holyneſſe, and ſhould be willing to embrace it, though it come from the boſome of the greateſt enemy: p. 69And he that is but one ace, or one inch above a novice, is able to tell you that this is no myſtery, and needs no unfolding; but it being my misfortune to deale with thoſe whoſe foggy ignorance makes them thinke, every plaine truth to be a myſtery, I muſt and will explaine my meaning to you in a few words: You ſay that my expreſſion hints that true grace, piety, and holineſſe, and I are enemies. I anſwer, 'tis not my expreſſion but the Devils, the Father of lyes that hinted (that) to you from that expreſſion.

I love true grace, piety and holineſſe, though it come from the greateſt enemy: How doth this expreſſion hint to you that true grace, piety and holyneſſe and I are enemies? how ridiculous is your malice and ignorance? can it be (ſay you) that if you have true grace, another that hath true grace and you ſhould be enemies, whereas true grace makes of the greateſt enemies ſtrongeſt friends? can it be? Poore men! what an amazing myſtery and wonder is here? can it not be? that two men, both having true grace, may yet be divided and at enmity? what do you think of Paul, and Barnabas? do not you beleeve they had both true grace? doe you not read of the ſharpe contention between them, and that but upon a light occaſion. See Acts 15. 35. But how can it be? (ſay you.) I anſwer, do you not yet know, that every man that hath true grace in him, hath yet withall ſome corruption in every facultie as well as grace? do you beleeve this from Paul? or are you turn'd Chathariſts? if you do beleeve it, as you muſt, (or elſe deny the Scripture) then 'tis eaſie to unfold this myſtery you ſpeak of, thus: Though true grace cannot be an enemy to grace, yet two men that have both true grace may for ſome time be at variance, and enemies to each other, through the corruption that is in them.—how do you think now? may not a man that hath true grace, be ſaid to embrace true grace, pietie, and holineſſe, though it come from the boſome of an enemie, and yet not be an enemie to grace? do you think that if men of underſtanding ſhould come to ſee your ſimplicitie, they would not hiſſe at it. For my part, I heartily pitie you.

Paper. In the next place you ask me what I mean by true grace; And how ſhall you know it but by the ſignes thereof, in obedience to the revealed will of God in his Word? And if ſo, you beſeech me to convince you, wherein thoſe amongſt you I point at do walk contrary in word or action, and you are perſwaded of them, that they will be thankfull to me, and bleſſe God: if not, I muſt needs be convinc'd that I walk contrary to my profeſſion, and ſo you cannot but expect acknowledgement p. 70and ſatisfaction from me, If there be any truth or ingenuity in me

Anſ. I anſwer: 'tis truth. True grace in the ſoul, is beſt ſeen and known by the effects thereof, ſeen in a mans obedience to the revealed will of God in his Word. The tree is known by its fruits, and a fountain by the water it ſends forth: ſo grace is beſt ſeen, to be in the heart (by us who can judge onelyonly according to the outward appearance) by the fruits of it in a gracious life. Now would you be convinc'd wherein any amongſt you do walk contrary to the revealed wil of God in his Word? 'tis the eaſieſt thing of a thouſand to do that; and you cannot but be convinc'd of it, (if you be not like Solomons fool, which though he be brayd in a morter, yet he will retain his folly) I will inſtance in a few particulars. 'Tis the revealed will of God, that there be no diviſions among you: 1 Cor. 1. 10. that you ſhould mark thoſe that cauſe diviſions, and avoid them; as men that feed their own bellies, and ſerve not the Lord Jeſus Chriſt: Rom. 16. 18. You walk contrary to this; for you do not avoid, but receive, uphold, follow, and countenance ſuch fellows, of whom 'twill be made good, that in what place ſoever they have come, they have made, and cauſed, ſuch unhappy breaches, and diviſions, as have been made, and are now amongſt you. Let the hand be layed upon the heart, and ſee if conſcience doth not bear witneſſe to you of this thing: have there not been formerly an happy union, a ſweet concord, a ſweet conſpiring together in the love of the ſame truth, in the communion of the ordinances of Chriſt, and in private duties? which truth and ordinances (though now condemned by you as abominable) yet I here again proffer to make good to you, to be no other then the truths and ordinances of Jeſus Chriſt, (and your own conſciences will make good to you, that your own ſouls have received comfort by them) and you know that God hath enabled ſome of you …o ſuffer for them. Now as Paul ſaid, Gal. 3. 2, 3, 4. Who hath bewitcht you? have ye ſuffered ſo many things in vain? (if it be yet in vain.) Are there not now envyings, ſtrife, diviſions, and contentions amongſt you: 1 Cor. 3. beg: Do you not now ſpeak evill of that way of truth you have formerly walked in, and found comfort in? is it not ſo? Now who hath cauſed this ſeparation, envying, ſtrife, diviſion, contention, &c. is he marked by you, and do you endeavour to avoid him? If you do not, you muſt needs be convinc'd in this, that you walk contrary to the revealed will of God. Again, I need go no farther then your Paper to convince you of your walking contrary to the revealed will of God in his Word: you have ſent it to me under your hands, and therefore I muſt look upon it as p. 71your words, your act and deed. Let me inſtance in a particular or two.

Is it not the revealed will of God that you ſhould know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and to admoniſh you, and to eſteeme them very highly in love for their works ſake, and to be at peace among your ſelves: 1 Theſſ. 5. 12, 13. Is it not Gods will that they that labour among you ſhould be counted by you worthy of double honour, 1 Tim. 5. 17. Heb. 13. 7, 8. Now let me aske you? hath not God in mercy, ſet thoſe over your ſelves that labour in word and doctrine? hath not God given a ſeale and a teſtimony to their miniſtry by begetting ſome of you againe by the word preached by them? and nouriſhing others amongſt you by the word of their miniſtry? and have they not been highly eſteemed amongſt you for their works ſake? have they not been ſought to by you to come among you again? have you not received them as a bleſſing? now let Conſcience anſwer. Doe you not now walke contrary to theſe commands of God in his Word? and contrary to your former practice? Are they not looked upon as enemies becauſe they tell you the truth? inſtead of eſteeming them very highly in love, are not both their perſons and doctrine, nay their very calling and miniſtery (which I ſay againe, I challenge you to prove, if you can to be any other then the Miniſtry of Jeſus Chriſt) are not theſe I ſay deſpiſed, ſcorned, reproacht by you? and branded even with the higheſt brand of being Antichiſtian. Let me aske you (my brethren) are not theſe things ſo? The Lord knowes (that's our comfort) and you ſhall know too one day, if you doe not now.—Now is not this a walking contrary to the revealed will of God? are theſe the fruits of grace thinke you?—Againe 'tis the revealed will of God in his word, that putting away lying, every man ſhould ſpeak truth with his neighbour, Epheſ. 4. 25. Now I thinke I have made it appeare, (and ſhall make it appeare farther) that this Paper which you have ſet your hands to, hath not one page of it, but what is ſtuft with lyes and falſehood: I leave to the Lord, and to the world to judge (betwixt us) of them. And therefore here again you have walked contrary to the revealed will of God.

Againe. 'Tis the revealed will of God that you ſhould not backbite with your tongue, nor doe evill to your neighbour, nor take up a reproach, againſt your neighbour, Pſal. 15. 3. Againe that all bitterneſſe, anger, wrath, clamour and evill ſpeaking be put away, with all malice, Epheſ. 4. 31. Now looke upon your Paper. There you call us Praters, Time-ſervers, Weathercocks, blinde Phariſees, Miniſters of Antichriſt, p. 62Popiſh perſecutors of the Saints, haters of godlineſſe, lovers of prophaneſſe, falſe Apoſtles, ſelfe ſeekers, penny Maſters, Drunkards, Swearers, Lyars, men that endeavour to keep others in ignorance, Seducers, men of no religion, proud, covetous, blood thirſty men, for-ſwearers, vain teachers, men of perfidious opinions, that we preach deſtructive and damnable doctrines, deſtroyers of truth, and true religion, perfidious men, that will deſtroy ſoules for gain, Ale-houſe hunters, Hereticks, Jews, Monſters, men that condemne the practice and precepts of Chriſt for hereſie, enemies to true grace, Miniſters of Antichriſt, nay Divels. This is the language you afford us in your Paper; and you have ſet your hands to it that we are ſuch as theſe. Now whether this be a walking according to the Word, or contrary to the revealed will of God in his word, let your own conſciences be Judges; or elſe let the Lord (the righteous Judge) judge betwixt you and us.

I thinke I need goe no farther in this particular, I hope this may be ſufficient to convince you (if the Lord will ſet it on upon your conſciences) and if ſo, then be thankfull and bleſſe God for it, if there be any truth or ingenuity in you.

Paper. In the next particular you tell me, you are grieved in ſpirit, to ſee and heare my light and frothy carriage, in the mentioning of Scripture, as to ſay that's a nimble Place. You ſay a carnall and w…cked heart will abuſe the beſt thing, even grace, mercy, and love: you ſay a Stage Player could doe no more, nor the Divell himſelfe to abuſe and mock at Scripture, and you cloſe thus;—for ſhame come not in publick to act ſuch Diabolicall parts.

Anſ. I anſwer.—This whole accuſation is from the Divell the Father of lyes too: you are grieved (you ſay) to ſee and heare, pray how many of you ten, dare ſay you ſaw and heard me in that carriage or that expreſſion which you have here ſet your hands to? if I am not much miſtaken, not neare the one halfe of you, and yet you have ſet your hands to it, I hope you will not turn Knights of the poſt,—theſe be ſome ſteps towards it. Me thinks you ſhould not call men Divels, meerly upon heare ſay; if you had any Charitie in you, you could not; he or they, that informed the reſt of you of this, may be aſhamed to looke an honeſt man in the face; (as we ſay) to come to Publicke ordinances, under a pretence of worſhipping, and to bely the truth of God in this manner; the Lord will finde out ſuch one day.—But (as you ſay) a carnall and wicked heart will abuſe the beſt things: I am able to bring you twenty for one of your informers of this, who will p. 73paſſe (I beleeve) both in the preſence of God and account of men, for as honeſt conſcientious Chriſtians as your informer, whoſoever he be of you, that will be witneſſes, that there was no ſuch word ſpoken, and I call God (that heard and recorded every word) to witneſſe of it.—You tell me that a Stage Player a Devill could have done no more.—

I anſwer.—For what I did, and ſpeak then, and there in publicke, the Lord knows, that (as David ſaid to Michal) it was before the Lord, and for the Lord; and if this be, to be vile, and a carnall wicked man, a Stage Player, a Divell, I ſhall deſire that I may be more vile yet.

Paper, You bid me not come in publick for ſhame to act ſuch Diabolicall parts.

Anſ. When the Lord ſhall again call me, I ſhall not be aſhamed to come again in publick, and to act that part, which the Lord hath put me upon:—as for your expreſſion Diabolicall,—the Lord forgive you; I do; and I value it not. The Lord Jeſus hath taught me, that the diſciple is not above his Maſter, nor the ſervant above his Lord. If they have called the maſter of the houſe Beelzebub, how much more ſhall they call them of his houſhold? Fear them not therefore: for there is nothing covered, that ſhall not be revealed, and hid, that ſhall not be known. Matth. 10. 24, 25, 26.

In the next place you come to make your requeſts to me—

Paper. Firſt, that I would define what hereſie is.

Anſ. I define hereſie thus:—Hereſie is a voluntary chuſing of an opinion, againſt ſome Article of Faith without ground of Scripture, and an obſtinate maintaining of it againſt all lawfull determinations of the true Church, for ſome ſiniſter and particular reſpects.—Or if you will have it more briefly, thus:—Hereſie is an error in the foundation of Chriſtian Religion taught and defended with obſtinacy: Thus Paul ſaith, Tit. 3. 11. that an Heretick is perverted, that is, put beſides the foundation, and condemned of himſelf in his ſin, that is, he erres obſtinately.

This hereſie is differenced from a ſimple error, by its obſtinate maintaining; from a ſchiſme, for that ſchiſme is in diſcipline, hereſie in doctrine, from Heatheniſh ſuperſtition, Jewiſh perverſneſſe, ſtup…d Mahometiſme, and the like, becauſe hereſie is a revolt from the faith, contrary to the Word of God; which ſuch never had, no profeſt.—The father of it is the devill; the mother, pride; the nurſe, ſingularitie; the attendant, hypocriſie; the promoters of it, inticing perſwaſions, and peremptory will-worſhip; Apoſtacie is an eminency in it, it being a falling away from the truth profeſt, ſelf-condemning the top of it. The outrages p. 74of it, will be blaſphemy againſt God, virulent perſecution of his Church and children: The end finall impenitencie and deſpair; the diſmall fore-runners of eternall damnation.

Having thus ſhewed you what Hereſie is; you may eaſily reſolve your ſelves the 2d. Quaere what an Heretick is. And can likewiſe beſt ſatisfie your ſelves in the 3d. viz: whether there be any ſuch among you. The Lord help you to ſearch narrowly, and to deal truly with your ſelves, that if there be any amongſt you, you may ſee them, and beware of them.

For your 4th deſire, to ſatisfie you in that, I give you all this under my hand. And for the 5th. I leave it to the world to judge, whether I have anſwered it or no.

And whereas in your cloſe, you again deſire a meeting in a ſober and in a Chriſtian way, I have told you my mind before, and here tell you again that the moſt ſafe and ſure way, to cleare up the truth, to ſatisfie doubts, to diſcover errors, to eſtabliſh Saints that are wavering, wil be to deal by ſetting down under yours and my hand, what we would ſpeak face to face at ſuch a meeting; one thing we ſhall more probably avoid this way, (which would fruſtrate our endeavours in the other) that is, clamour, paſſion, and tumults. Again from written words we ſhall not ſo ſoone ſtart and fly, as from words ſpoken (which in ſuch a way with ſuch people have ſeldome proved any better then wind.)

For my part, I profeſſe it in the preſence of God, that it is, and by Gods grace ſhall be my endeavour, that love may be increaſed, that jealouſies, heart burning and evill ſurmiſings may be removed: And that we may live in love and peace as becomes Chriſtians. I truſt the Lord Jeſus who is the great Prophet of his Church, and the teacher of Iſrael, will alwayes direct me, not onelyonly to ſpeak of, but to endeavour after the peace of the Church, by convincing and ſtopping the mouthes of gainſayers, who are crept in to diſturbe our Peace, by perverting the truths of God once delivered to the Saints. And my prayers in ſpeciall are, that that God, whom I ſerve in my ſpirit, who knoweth the heart and prayers of his ſervant, would onelyonly ſo be with me in theſe endeavours of mine, as it is the truth which I endeavour to maintain.—Amen.

You ſubſcribe your ſelves, My loving friends, ſo farre as I love the Lord Jeſus.—

For your love and friendſhip to me, I know not how I have of late forfeited it. There are but few ſignes of it at preſent to be ſeen. But for p. 75love to the Lord Jeſus, I here ſet my heart, tongue, pen, to that of Paul, as the concluſion of his Epiſtle, 1 Cor. 16. 22. If any man love not the Lord Jeſus Chriſt, let him be Anathema Maranatha.

March—1648. Kemble. Yours to ſerve you in the work of the Goſpel of the Lord Jeſus: THO: THACHE.

Poſtſcript.

FRiends; If hereupon you finde grace to ſee, and heal your Errors, we ſhall with all brotherly meekneſſe, love, and humilitie, be willing to receive you, and ſhall bleſſe God on your behalf: But if the ſway of your miſ informed and miſ-reſolved Conſcience be heady and unreſiſtable, and your return hopeleſſe;—Even theſe poore endeavours of mine, ſhall one day be a fearfull and materiall evidence againſt you, before that awfull Judge who hath already ſaid, That judgements are prepared for ſcorners, and ſtripes for the back of fools.

FINIS.

End of the text · Thomas Thache, Gainsayer Convinced (1649)