Narration of Some Church Courses, Chapter 12 – Chapter 14
CHAP. XII.
Of Church officers, their office, manner of calling, their power, maintainance, and the diſ-officing or depoſing of them again.
1. WHen a Church by admiſſion of more members, is now grown to a competent number (which ofttimes proves ſomegNo wonder it is long firſt, what for want of ſuch choice members as they ſeek, and what for want of choice Miniſters: for they tell us to our comfort that many that were counted good Miniſters in old Eng. are there laid aſide, becauſe the Churches there doe aime at men of ſpeciall abilities. yeares firſt) then they addreſſe themſelves to the calling of ſome to the Miniſtery, and other offices in the Church. R.M. to W.R.
2. If any of their own members be fit for the ſervice, they make choice of them. If not, they procure elſewhere. Yet ſo that none is choſen to be an officer in any Church, till he be firſt formally admittedhChurch memberſhip is the ſalt that ſealons all things. 'Its ſtrange that his memberſhip in the Church whence he laſt came (by communion of Churches) can ſtand him in no ſtead. member of the ſame Church, in the ſame manner every way, as others have beene. H.W. to Mr B.
3. The ſeverall Churches with them, (how ſmall ſoever, and though as yet without any officers) doe challenge to themſelves both power and execution of all things whatſoever do belong to the calling and creating of their own officers, as, 1. ToiWhat abilities moſt good men have in judging of Miniſters, as reaſon ſo their own experience will tell them, when as (if I be rightly informed) all the members of the Church of Boſton (ſome few excepted) did ſtrongly ſtickle to have had Mr Wheelwright (that famous Familiſt) joyned as co teacher with Maſter C. in that Church. Alſo ſee Apol. Narr. p. 24. examine and try their abilities and fitneſſe. 2. To elect them. 3. To inſtruct them in their office, at their ordination. 4. To ordaine them with impoſition of hands, prayers, and charges given them. And in ſumme, to give them all the power of their office in that Church in the name of Chriſt. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 40, 41, 42, 68, 71. Diſcourſe of Cov. p. 23. | Anſ. to 9. Poſ. p. 70, 77. R.M. to W.R. | H.W. to Mr B.
Rob. juſtif. p. 300, 303. Cannes Neceſs. of ſepar. p. 29. Barr. refut. of Giff. p. 130. A light for th… ign. p. 7. Rob. Apology.
4. Whereby it is come to paſſe, that every of their firſt Miniſters (at leaſt) in every of their Churches, is ordained by one or morekHave not wee as much cauſe to doubt of the truth of their miniſterie, as they of ours, they being made by meere private men (i.e.) not in any office, ours by Presbyters at leaſt, and therein according to the Apoſtles rule, 1 Tim. 4.14. ſeeing the Biſhops themſelves were Presbyters, with whom were other Presbyters ever joyned in Ordination of any: Beſides, the choice and approbation of many of us by our people alſo: whether they or we come neerer to the Rule, let the Reader judge. private men, appointed by the reſt, in their names to pray over them, impoſe hands upon them, inſtruct, charge them, and give them authoritie there to miniſter: The act being the act of the whole Church, but for order, and eaſe ſake, the formalitie is committed to one or two, in name of the reſt:lThe Levites election was from God immediately, and their Ordination by the Prieſt by Gods appointment, Numb. ….11, 13, 14. The peoples laying on of their hands in this work was not authoritative, that were needleſſe, when God had authoriſed them both immediately by himſelfe and mediately by the Prieſt before, if not preſumptuous, that they ſhould interpoſe their authoritie, when God himſelfe had eſtabliſhed them by his. But either it was obedientiall only, to declare their approbation of Gods choice and Ordination, and then it is nothing to our brethrens authoritative impoſition of the peoples hands. Or rather (as I conceive) for the ſame end for which they were commanded to lay hands on the head of the ſacrifice to be oftred (as verſ. 12.) viz. to ſigniſie that they, i.e. their firſt born by right were all the Lords, and did owe to be, but that God of his goodneſſe was now pleaſed to accept of the Levites for them, verſ. 16. As the Iſraelites laid hands on the Levites, Numb. 8.10. | J.M. to R.M. | Anſ. to 32. q. p. 68, 69, 70. R.M. to E.B. p. 10.
Rob. juſtif. p. 328, 331, 338.
5. They hold that the peoplesmBy this reaſon (me thinks) all that are elected by the people to a conſtant exerciſe to a conſtant exerciſe of the chiefe dutie of the Paſtours office (which is prenching of the Word) and do alſo by compact receive the tithes and wages due by law to the Paſtour, ſhould be the Paſtours of the places where by the peoples choice they doe ſo preach, and by conſequent many of our brethren of that way, here in London, and England, ſhould be Paſtours of many of our Pariſh Churches. But doe they count themſelves ſo? or do they carry themſelves ſo? Election is not onelyonly eſſentiall unto, but alſo the whole ſubſtance of the calling of the Miniſter, or other officer. But as for Ordination with impoſition of hands of the Presbyterie, or other ſigne, they hold it not eſſentiall at all, but a meere formalitie, or ſolemnitie of the calling; the preſence whereof addeth nothing to the ſubſtance of the calling, and the abſence thereof takes nothing from it. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 67, 68, 69. Diſcourſe of Cov. p. 23. | R.M. to E.B. p. 10. Apol. p. 24.
Rob. juſtif. p. 308, 332, 333, 334, 335. Rob. Apol. p. Per electionem jus miniſterii Presbyteris confertur, &c. Barr. refut. of Giff. p. 219, 130.
6. After the firſt officers are thus made by the Church, the formalitie of ordaining the reſt, is ordinarily committed to ſuchnSo that if they have but one Paſtour or Teacher he alone laies hand on the next officer to be ordained: But Se Pauls rule for Ordination is, that it ſhould bee done by the hands of the Presbyterie, not of one Imgle Preſbyter, much leſſe of one private man. officers as are alreadie called and ordained, not as having any more power (by vertue of their office) to doe it, then before; for the power is the Churches, and belongs equally to every member, as a member; but as being the Churches publike ſervants, to doe it for them, and in threi name and ſtead. See the quotations cited before Art. 4. Rob. juſtif. p. 321, 323, 327.
7. In the ſorts or kinds of their officers, they agree with others of the beſt reformed Churches.oI will not impute to the generall that private opinion (but too publikely here) by ſome of them vented: that the Paſtor is only to feed the people with wholeſome doctrine, the ruling Elders onelyonly to viſit them, and ſee to their manners. OnelyOnly whereas in opinion and tenent they preciſely diſtinguiſh between the Paſtors and Teachers office, yet in practiſe they uſually confound them: both Paſtour and Teacher equally teaching and equally applying both the Word and Seales without any difference. And either of them uſually ſupplying the place of both in divers of their Churches, which are not furniſhed with both. See J. C. his Sermons on Revel. and other texts, for proof of this: Beſides what we have by others report.
8. They hold the officers ſo called and made by this Church, are officers onelyonly in and unto this particular Church, that hath ſo called them. And bound onelyonly to miniſter to that, and the members thereof, and to none other. So that the Paſtors and Teachers thereof may lawfully doe nopYet their Miniſters frequently adminiſter the Sacraments to the members of other Churches then their own: They will anſwer, that is done by vertue of the communion of Churches. I reply, But this latter rule quite overthroweth the former and all the reaſons they bring for it; which ſome perceiving, queſtion this rule of communion of Churches, others to maintain the former have invented a power in every particular Church and Miniſter to transfer their own power over to another Church and Miniſter pro tempore, to adminiſter the Seales, (yea, and cenſures too) to any of their members, ſo that tranſlation be formally done, as before Chap. 10. If there can be no act valid where there is no power. Whether miniſteriall acts done by a miniſter in and unto another Church be not null and voide: which if they be, then have we millions of perſons of age unbaptized to this very day. miniſteriall act whatſoever in or unto any other Church or the members thereof, then their own. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 11, 15, 70. Anſ. to 9. Poſ. p. 64, 67, 70, 76, 78. Apol. p. 14, 26, 29, 38.
Rob. justif. p. 317, 318, 335.
9. They grant indeed that Miniſters may preach unto, and pray with other Churches and their members, becauſe theſe are properly no miniſteriall acts. OnelyOnly the adminiſtration of theqPreaching and Baptizing were wont to be joyned together, Matth. 28. And the Word and Prayer to be counted chiefe imployments of the Miniſters, Act. 6. yea, Preaching rather then Sacraments, 1 Cor. 1. But it is the nature of popular government to incroach upon all or moſt of the rights of the miniſterie, which muſt either have nothing to doe, or but what the people will allow them, and lend them their power for to do. Alas poore Miniſters, it ſeemes it is their deſtinie ever to be ſervants (if good) yea ſlaves and foot-ſtools. Hitherto they have been troden under foot by the Prelates, and now they muſt be by their people! Sacraments (with them) are properly miniſteriall, and therefore belong onelyonly to the Miniſters. All other acts are common to other members, either by vertue of their gifts, and ex communi officio charitatis, or by the power of the Keyes, which they have received in common with that Church of which they are members, or by a temporarie deputation from the ſame. Anſ. to 9. Poſ. p. 78.
Rob. juſtif. p. 195.
10. They hold that a Miniſters calling lives and dyes with his union unto and diſuniting from that particular Church wherein and whereby he was ſo called, as before. So that if a Miniſter lawfully choſen and ordained in one place, ſhall remove (upon never ſo juſt and neceſſary grounds) to another Congregation: He is thereby diveſted of his former Miniſterie, and now become as a meere private man again, unleſſe and untill he ſhall be called and ſo created again by the ſame or ſome other Congregation. In which caſe he is not only to be elected anew, but alſo to be ordained anew, by the impoſition of the hands (perhaps of ſome meere private man or men) as if he had never been ordained before. And ſo toties quoties. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 69, 70. Anſ. to 9. Poſ. p. 67, 77. J. W. anſ. to 10. quest.
Rob. juſtif. p. 317.
11. They hold the Miniſters are but the Churches ſervants, her mouth by whom ſhe ſpeakes, and hands whereby ſhe acts. And therefore though they meet together to conſult of matters for the good of the Churches, or to prepare matters for the Churches hearing; yet in point of Government they canrYet Mr ̄ P. tels us that the Miniſters have there agreed amongſt themſelves that none of them ſhall preach any doctrine that is not commonly received amongſt them, till he have firſt communicated it with the teſt of the Miniſters: And what's this but in effect a compound Presbyterie ruling without peoples votes, and alſo a Canon made by common conſent and impoſed: both contrary to their own principles. decree, act, or executeſThey call them rulers, and tell us they have great power of Government, but ſhew us nothing that they may doe (except Adminiſtration of Sacraments) which others may not as lawfully doe as they: unleſſe they will ſay (as Rob juſtif. p. 116.) that Miniſters rule conſiſts in ſerving the Church, and the people obey their Miniſters in uſing their ſervice: which is moſt abſurd in reaſon and contradictious to it ſelf. nothing but what the Church doth dictate and direct: Anſ. to 32. q. p. 57.
Rob. Apol. p. 49. Sions royall Prerog. p. 26, 20.
12. Miniſters (they hold) are onelyonly Miniſters of Churches already gathered, which are all ſuppoſed to be already reall Saints, effectually called. So that the end and work of the office of Miniſters and their Miniſterie, is onelyonly the confirmation and building up of men already converted and inchurched. Nor are they bound by vertue of their office to attend unto the work oftThus the Converſion of ſinners which is the crowne of Miniſters Calling, 1 Cor. 4.15. 1 Theſ. 2. ult. is pulled off their heads, and put on the head of every gifted brother, and why not ſiſter too? ſince ſuch may poſſibly convert alſo: and if they may convert, belike they may conſirme as well, and ſo they may take all; For what then hath the Miniſter left him to doe by office? But if this were ſo it would follow, 1. That a Miniſter of a Church need not by office preach ſome Doctrines, viz. the Doctrines of the beginnings of Chriſt, at leaſt not in ſome manner of teaching them: whence it is that ſpire have held that the Miniſter is to apply himſelfe in all his Sermons to the members, and not to them that are without: the reſt of the members are to doe that in their prophecying. N. P. 2. That Miniſters being fixed to particular charges, to which they ovve themſelves, and all that they can poſſibly doe, are thereby bound out from labouring in the worke of converſion of others at all: it being both without the compaſſe of their calling (by this doctrine) and beyond the poſſibilitie of their povver too, 3. And therefore that either men unconverted muſt ſo continue, and periſh in their ſins, for want of ſome body to ſeek and bring them home, Or elſe men gifted, that are no Miniſters (which I feare upon account will prove but few) muſt leave their callings, and give themſelves to the preaching of the word and Prayer, which both were diligently practiſed by the Apoſtles (as Miniſters) and with ſtrict charge impoſed upon all Miniſters to practiſe (as belonging to their office) to the end of the world. Again, it this be ſo, how is it that ſome of our brethren of that way, are far more buſie in ſeeking our cunverſion here (not ſo much to grace, as to their Church covenant) then to build up their own Churches, with which they are in covenant already at home? converting ſouls, any more then other gifted brethren are, who owe it by the office of common charitie. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 80, 82.
Rob. juſtif. p. 308, 11, 47.
whence it muſt needs follow that either none are converted in their Churches by their miniſterie, or elſe if any be, that fals out only accidentally, not as the direct end of their office, and Gods Ordinance.
13. They acknowledge a moſtuA right tenent, if rightly underſtood & limitted: But how comes it then that ſome of them that have charges, as Paſtours, in other Kingdomes far off, yet take and hold places of ſetled miniſteriall imployment here? ſtrict tye between the Miniſter and his people, and that the one hath ſpeciall proprietie in the other. Apol. p. 11, 24. R. M. to E. B. p. 11.
14. They conceive it unwarrantable that Miniſters ſhould have ſet and certain ſtipends or wages, much leſſe that they ſhould live upon tithes: But rather upon the peoples*Let the unpartiall Reader (now laying all ends together) judge whether the Miniſters, according to the…r rules, be not the unhappieſt ſervants under Heaven; For 1. they muſt ſerve many maſters, perhaps many hundred. 2. doe great worke. 3. Yet nothing (in effect) proper to them, but as other ſervants of the Church. 4. Yet may neither know the certain bounds of their obedience: 5. Nor indent for certain wages: 6. Nor change their maſter or miſtreſle if they doe not like, they may poſſibly be expulſt, at the Churches pleaſure, but never can depart at their own: But if this be ſo, how comes it to paſſe that ſome of them amongſt us, doe not only receive, but ſtrictly require ſo much ſet ſtipend for ſuch a Lecture, and ſo much more for ſuch another, or elſe they will not preach; but alſo can be content to take the glebe, tithes and other profits of ſequeſtred Parſonages and Vicaridges amongſt us, as well as others. But in ſome ſort, I marvell not at it, if that be true (which we are credibly informed) that ſome of our brethren of the miniſterie there have not long ſince complained that their Prophets did now prophecie in ſacke for want of maintainance. M. B. to S. A. and others of them out of their love have warned us of the like danger, if tithes (amongſt us) ſhould goe downe. Mr. W. to Mr. M. And therefore no marvell if our brethren that have been bitten with the peoples cold contributions there, be content to forſake that rule, and to covenant for wages, as we doe here. voluntary contribution, weekly caſt into the common treaſurie, according to their weekly gaines: Out of which the Deacons are to diſtribute both unto the officers and poore, according to that which is brought in, and as they conceive to be fit and needfull for every one. R. M. to W. R. | Mr B. to S. A. | J. W. to T. S. | Anſ. to 32. q. p. 77. Cott. cat. p. 7, 8. R. M. to E. B. p. 7, 8.
Rob. justif. p. 214, 353. Barr. Diſcov. p. 53, 61, 62. Brow. Confeſſ. art. 20, 45.
15. As this Church hath power to make her own Miniſters, ſo alſo toxWhich power (we heare) alſo they have uſed upon very ſlender grounds, as in M. W. | S. B. | R. S. their caſes. queſtion, cenſure, unmake and depoſe them; and by reaſſuming their power, to reduce them into the ſtate of meere private men again. And this alſo they claime power to doe (as well as the other) without any authoritative concurrence of any others whomſoever; whoſe counſell although they may, and perhaps will crave and uſe, yet that is done freely without any authoritative obligation in foro externo. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 41. Anſ. to 9. Poſ. p. 77. | J. C. printed letter, p. 3.
Rob. juſtif. p. 111, 176, 177. Sions royall Prerog. p. 26. | Seper. Conf. art. 23. Cann. neceſſ. of ſe. par. p. 155.
CHAP. XIII.
Of thoſe whom they call Prophets, and of prophecying, or private mens preaching.
1. THey hold it lawfull for meere private perſons (i.e. ſuch as neither are in office, nor are ever likely to be) to exerciſe their gifts in and before the whole Congregation, inySome ſay without any Moderator, at pleaſure, whereby ſtrange things have been vented, & Scriptures ſometimes notoriouſly abuſed. Mr W. preaching, i. e. in expounding and applying the Scriptures to the ſeverall uſes of the auditors, by inſtruction, confutation, reprehenſion, with all authoritie; yea, that this is an ordinary and perpetuall ordinance in the Church grounded upon 1 Cor. 14. | Anſ. to 32. q. p. 78. Cott. cat. p. 6. | R. M. to E. B. p. 7. There is a book printed, called, A Sermon preached at Plimmouth in N. E. which (as I am certified) was made there by a Comber of wooll.
Rob. justif. p. 183. Johnſ. Inq. p. 7. A light for the ignor. p. 19.
Some of them (indeed) tell us that its ſeldome uſed, viz. only where the Church iszBut ſuch occaſions are not rare with them, who oft for a long time want Miniſters in their Churches, at leaſt a full ſupply. Alſo ſome of them have their farmes, and ſo their families or ſervants ſo far off from their ſettled Congregations, as that they cannot poſſibly come every Sabbath (hardly any) to the Miniſterie there; and therefore muſt either preach one to another, or elſe be utterly without. I. P. Beſitles (we are informed from thence) the people, of late, grow more violent in clayming that their pretended libertie and priviledge of publike prophecying, urging for it the writings and arguments of Mr Rob. the Browniſt, ſometimes alſo contemning and deſerting their own Miniſters and Churches, becauſe they are not ſuffred to injoy it. M. B. to S. A. unfurniſhed with officers, or in caſe of their abſence or ſickneſſe. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 77.
2. Alſo after their Preaching they take upon them to bleſſe the people at their diſmiſſion, as the Miniſters doe.
3. Likewiſe they have a courſe (before their diſmiſſion) to give leave to any that doubts of any thing that hath been then or formerly delivered in publike by the Miniſter or any other,aMe thinkes its an abrupt courſe at the firſt daſh openly to implead the Miniſter of errour delivered, before all the people; were it not more civilitie, pietie, charitie, and prudence to talke with him firſt in private: whereby either the doubter may be ſatisfied, or the Miniſter reduced, and both without any moleſtation or ſcandall to the people, or repreach to the Miniſter? Beſides, who muſt be judge in ſuch a caſe, muſt the injudicious multitude? For other judge they will not allow (I meane in foro externo) nor any appeale to an higher Court. publikely to propound their doubts, and make their objections, and to argue pro and con, about any matter good for edification. W. T. to P. H. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 78. Cot. cat. p. 6.
Barr. diſcov. p. 139. Johnſ. Inq. p. 7.
CHAP. XIIII.
Of the bOf late, ſome of them grow ſhy of the word Independent, H. P. in his Epiſtle to the Reader. Some utterly renounce it, Apol. Narr. p. 23. But yet its generally owned by moſt in the name, R. M. to E. B. p. 9. Anſ. to 32. q p. 46, 47, 64, 65. by all in the thing, as after, Anſ. to 32. q p. 43, 44, 46.independencie of one Church upon another, and the Combination of ſeverall Churches together, in Claſſes, Synods, &c.
1. THey grant that Churches may and ought to conſult and adviſe one with another, in any doubtfull matter incident, and ought to hearken to the good advice of one another. And therefore they ſometimes allow combinations of divers Churches for conſultation: But notcThey love no imperative Synods or Presbyteries, but they have ſtore of imperative Churches, who may command, yea, compell both members and Miniſters to act, it may be what they like not: why have not many Churches united as much power over every particular church within the union, as many members united have over every perſon amongſt themſelves. imperative or coercive. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 64, 65, 66.
Johnſ. plea, p. 251.
2. But that each particular congregationall Church is the ſupreme judicature, whoſe power is abſolute and imperiall, and therefore may and ought to tranſact all things within themſelves without ſeeking or ſubmitting unto any authoritative concurrence of any other Churches. R. M. to W. R. Cott. cat. p. 12, 13. Anſ. to 32. q. p. 44, 62, 64, 65, 66. J. W. anſ. to 10. queſt.
Rob. juſtif. p. 107, 112, 444. Johnſ. plea, p. 70, 251. Barr. diſcov. p. 261.
3. Therefore they hold it unlawfull for any ſuch combinations, whether in Claſſes, (i.e. compound Presbyteries) or Synods provinciall, nationall, or others to take upon them authoritatively to determine or decree any thing in matter of doctrine or practiſe, as intending thereby to oblige any more, or others then their own perſons, no not in foro externo. page missing