A Way to Zion Sought out and Found for Believers, Treatise · Objection 16

A Way to Zion Sought out and Found for Believers · Treatise · Objection 16

p. 210Object. from Revel. 21.22.

And I saw no Temple therein, (i. e. in the City) No formes of worship say they, Objection from Rev. 21.22. answered.Rev 21:22in the Church, no outward Administration.

I answer: This cannot be no Church of God; as the Temple is called, but worship, And then it meaneth, I saw no Jewish worships, p. 211such as were used in the Temple, which many preached up in the Apostles times; and which many weak Jews stood for, though they beleeved, **Act. 21.20.Acts 21:20and which were to cease; according to Jer. 3.16, 17, 18. when Jerusalem shall be the Throne of the Lord, according to Rev. 21. and 22. Then (saith he) they shall say no more the Arke of the Covenant of the Lord; neither shall it come into minde, nor remember it, nor visit it, nor do that any more.

I shall onelyonly adde some Observations and Answers unto some sentences in these Books, as I finde them set downe; for I cannot keepe the method I desire, because I finde them brokenly placed without order, as they came to hand (as Mr Saltmarsh saith) and so I must speak to them.

And first, consider, These men say they doe what they doe, Some sayings in Mr. Saltmarsh book set downe, and answered as they come to handby the motions of the Spirit of God: Mr. Saltmarsh saith, He wrote this Book as it came to hand, and not according to man; meaning as God gave it by his Spirit; in the Epistle to the Reader, hee saith, Hee wrote briefly, and not in the common method of Paraphrases, and tedious Discourses, because much of man is seene in that, and not the Spirit of God; and he received this according as it is written. And Mr. Sedgwick saith, He preached his Sermons as God gave them in, without premeditation, or to that purpose.

To which I say, I would advise men to take heed what they cast upon the Spirit of God, for it speaketh like it selfe: And in their Bookes are direct contradictions; Therefore all they say and write extempore, cannot be of the Spirit.

Mr. Saltmarsh saith, the two witnesses were MEN, Contradictions amongst themselves are evident, therefore all they say is not of the Spirit of God, as they give out.that prophesied according to the measure that God had given them. Mr. Sedgwick saith, They were Christ in flesh, and Christ in Spirit. Now these two, say they were both guided by the Spirit, and yet they give severall Interpretations, one contrary to another. If this be true, that they were both guided by the Spirit, here will be an imputation cast upon the Spirit one way or other; If these Interpretations, or one of them be not true, then the Spirit is wronged to have them both cast upon it; If they were both of the Spirit, then the Spirit will be found to contradict it selfe, which cannot be; Joh. 16.13.John 16:13for it is the Spirit of Truth So that the Spirit is wronged, by these mens casting all that they deliver upon the Spirit; when they deliver some things contradictory to themselves, and also one to another; And yet the Spirit must be the Author. And in this particular (I conceive) Mr. Sedgwick mistaketh; For this is the Revelation of Jesus Christ Revel. 1.1. And he here saith, MY two witnesses; Mr. Sedgwick mistaken about the two witnesses.shewing it could not be he himselfe, especially in flesh; for so he was before this Revelation was given, and was ascended before (Mr. Saltm. saith) out of flesh into Spirit; And the Revelation was of things to come. Nor it could not be Christ in Spirit, but in men witnessing to him; It could not be Christ in flesh; for he was dead, buried, risen, and ascended, p. 212before this Revelation was given to John; yea he was buried, so was not these witnesses; Beside, these lay dead three dayes and a halfe, but he rose againe the third day. And it could not be Christ in Spirit, because Christ in Spirit cannot dye, Rev. 1.18. nor lye dead, nothing being left but a carcasse.

It is not possible but these men must wrong the Spirit, in making him the Author of all they deliver; because they say they are not infallible: But if they be not infallible, How dare they say that what they deliver is as God giveth it in, and from the Spirit? If they be infallible, why will they deny it, and so dishonour the Spirit, to make men they dare not so confidently rest upon them, which they might do, did they know they were infallible? And so the Spirits testimony is questioned by their owne words; for they say, That they deliver is bearing witnesse to God, and it is by the Spirit of God; and yet they are not infallible: And how can they maintaine the one, and not the other?

Mr. Saltmarsh in his Epistle to the Reader,

Saith, God is in all his severall dispensations and measures; and Christians are not to hasten out of any, Replyes to some sayings of Mr. Saltmarsh in the Epistle to the Reader.till God himselfe say, Come up hither.

Whence observe;

1 God hath his severall dispensations, and is in them: But Baptisme by water is his dispensation; for Peter commanded it, Act. 10. And breaking bread, is his dispensation, 1 Cor. 11. Therefore (by HIS owne confession) God is in them: And therefore we are to continue in them.

2 We are not to hasten, &c. Then those that hasten out of them to the Taverne, and Ale-house, to lye drinking there commonly; and to loosenesse of life, cannot say God hath called them up: This is downe sure. And those that hasten from Ordinances, backe to their common old road, to communion with Antichrists ministery, and members; to pay and receive Tythes, which they say they can doe, which is of the Law; is not comming up, but going down.

Againe he saith, He is not against Ordinances, so they proceed from their right principles, to their right ends. And page 55. For my part (saith he) I am farre from denying any Gospell forme, or way which appeareth to be the practice of the Saints then, because I conceive the Saints so gathering and practising, &c. And page 281. God is seen in Ordinances, as in created things. And 287. Christians enjoy God sweetly in them.

See how he speaketh here. And yet he saith, page 119. It shall be as much apostasie in the Saints to goe back to the first Ministery of Gospell times, which was the Ministery to the first discovery of the mystery hid from Ages, as it would be in them to goe back to Jewish Temple and Priesthood, &c. But hee proveth none of all this, nor p. 213much more that he speaketh after: for this is to deny Christ came in the flesh, and so to be an Antichrist. And saith Paul, If ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing, Gal. 5. See how strangely he contradicteth himselfe; confesseth truth, and then denyeth it againe.

I reply a word or two more.

If God be seen in Ordinances, Then he hath not left them, Ordinances maintained from his own sayi…gs.as hee saith elsewhere, And it is lawfull to eye God in created things, Psal. 19.1 Rom. 1.20. But God is seene in Ordinances more then in created things, even in instituted things, for those ends that God hath ordained them.

And if it be not against them, why doth he plead against them so in his Booke? This very confession intimateth that in his conscience he was convinced that Christians ought to walke in them, and make use of them. But in the same Epistle it seemeth he counteth Baptisme with water, breaking bread, &c none of Gods dispensations: for saith he, I have spoken of the liberty of some that are spirituall, in some things of worship and discipline without sinne, yet of no other, but as the wisdome of God shall direct to edification, and care of offence, and Scriptures allow, 1 Cor 9.22. To the weake I became weake, &c. Those words under the Law containe liberty to things once Instituted; [So that there he maketh Ordinances of the New Testament of the same nature of those under the Law, as Circumcision, &c. or as Idolls] Those words, without Law, to things not Instituted (saith he) therefore an Idoll is nothing in the world. [All outward forms of worship, are matters of liberty it seemeth; Liberty whether a man will preach, or declare Gods goodnesse, though there be a Command, Mar. 16 for that is a forme of words: And though Paul say, 2 Tim. 1.13. 1 Cor. 9.2 Tim 1:131 Cor 9Woe is me if I preach not the Gospell. And a forme of wholesome words are to be held fast. Liberty whether a man will use words of prayer, or exhortation, or acknowledgement of God; for al these must be done in one form or other. So it seemeth it is in a mans liberty whether he will performe any outward service to God in his body or no: So that now it seemeth Christ hath no Commands, but hath left all things to mens liberty.] And to that purpose he pleadeth in his Book, as I have shewed.

He seemeth to intimate that, That under the Law, and without Law, was liberty to things of former Institution by God, and of no Institution.

But is there liberty from things of later Institution, I meane since Christ revealed in the flesh? or liberty to things forbidden by God, as Idol-worship? &c. which he seemeth to plead for; for in that place of the Corinthians, We know an Idoll is nothing in the world; 1 Cor. 8.1 Cor 8Paul speaketh not to excuse those who worshipped the Idoll, or performed an Idolatrous service; But of such as did eat meat that was of the Idols sacrifice, the over-plus sold in the Shambles.

He saith, There are two things make Ordinances in divine right p. 214stood for. 1. There is an opinion that there is a very modell in Scripture, to be discovered; which is to reduce Christians to bondage againe, and to a forme without those very gifts, which are not to be found in the same. Meaning (as I gather by his Booke) Apostolicall extraordinary gifts, speaking with Tongues and Miracles.

1 There is a Modell in the Scripture, Answ. how God will be worshipped; what the Church is, (I meane the visible Church) what members, and order, and ordinances, as in the first Epistle to Timothy; which charge he commandeth to keep till the appearing of Christ.

2 I deny that ever the Scriptures of the New Testament were called the Letter: What the Letter in the true sense of it is.This is an unwholsome word, we have not footing for it in the Booke of God; so applyed. I confesse, I finde the outward part of the Ceremoniall Law, or Commandments of enmity contained in ordinances called, the Letter, as Rom. 2.27.29. Letter and Circumcision. Those outward ordinances of the Law. But that is Circumcision in the Spirit, not in the LETTER (i. e.) in the outward part according to the Law. And so Rom. 7.6. We are delivered from the Law, (meaning the Ceremoniall Law; for from the substance of the Law contained in love they were not delivered) that we should serve—not in the oldnesse of the LETTER (i. e.) not in the Law; but according to the Gospell or Spirit. And so, 2 Cor. 3.6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11. where that which he calleth the LETTER, ver. 6. he calleth, The ministration of death, ver. 7. of condemnation, ver. 9. That which was made glorious, ver. 10. which is done away, ver. 11. And that which is called, Spirit, ver. 6. is called, The ministration of the Spirit, ver. 8. of Righteousnesse, ver. 9. That which excelleth in glory, ver. 10. That which remaineth, ver. 11. And the discourse from ver. 13. to the end, sheweth the Apostle speaketh of Law and Gospell; and not of outward parts, and inward. And so his conclusion is true, the modell in the Letter (that i…, in the Law, and so himselfe expoundeth it, pag. 240.) tendeth to reduce Christians to bonda…e. But the Modell in the Scriptures of the New Testament, or Gospell, is a part of their Christian Liberty, which they are to maintaine, Gal. 5.1.

Another opinion is (saith he) That the setting up of such a forme is an immediate way of fixing God and his Spirit upon it, which is a finer kinde of Idolatry, to conceive that God entereth into outward things, and conveyeth his all glorious, and Almighty Spirit by them; when as they are only signes, &c.

I answer; What he calleth a fine kinde of Idolatry, answered.For my part I know none that hold this opinion; if Mr. Saltmarsh did, he might have done well to have laid open who they had been, and not to have made all that stand for ordinances to be reproached, because he hath written this: I make them not immediate wayes, (for that cannot be, seeing there is meanes used it cannot be immediate) nor mediate; but waite upon God in the use of them, for the discovery of himselfe, how, and when he pleaseth; And to discover to men my readinesse to obey God in whatsoever he commandeth, as Abraham in p. 215that command of offering his Son, went about it, Heb. 11.17. Gen. 22.2, &c.Heb 11:17Gen 22:2not as an immediate way of fixing God to it, but obeying God in what he commanded. A man may look upon God, and the enjoyment of God, and all for selfe, Isa. 58.2. But we use ordinances to manifest to men our obedience to God, whether we enjoy God in them or no.

2 Where God hath promised his presence, or Spirit, or comforts in the use of ordinances, or outward things, (as some terme them) I may expect his making it good, without any fine kinde of Idolatry at all, Prov. 1.23 Turne you at my reproofe; Behold, I will poure out my Spirit unto you, &c. Men are to heare his reproofs which he proclaimeth; and in hearing this, there is hope of turning; and turning he promiseth there to poure out his Spirit, and make knowne his Word. It is no fine kinde of Idolatry therefore to heare the Word, Rom. 10.Rom 10and waite at the posts of Wisdomes doores when she cryeth: Faith commeth by hearing, and hearing by the Word preached, and yet an outward thing; and this way the Galatians received the Spirit, Gal. 3. And yet not blamed for fine Idolaters for hearing the Word, and having faith wrought that way; and why should it be a fine kinde of Idolatry to waite for Gods discoveries in other ordinances, that are no more outward then that? And he himselfe confesseth, God is enjoyed sweetly in them? Was not Peter one of these finer kinde of Idolaters, Act. 2. When he biddeth them repent, and be baptised, and they should receive the gift of the Holy Ghost? And doth not Mr. Saltmarsh say, God gave them the Holy Ghost in the Apostles ministery, and it was promised (saith he) in the commission, Mat. 28? And was it a fine kinde of Idolatry therefore to expect it there? Thus you see when men run from Scripture, how they contradict themselves in what they write; Contradiction.when God had promised his presence betweene the Cherubims, over the propitiatory, was it any fine kinde of Idolatry to expect it there? See this mans owne confession, pag. 108. he saith, God did appeare in wayes of outward Administrations, as Tabernacle, Temple, &c.

He saith, That of Gods appearance and conveyance of himselfe in outward things, according to this opinion, is such as the Papists hold as to Images, and things conferring grace, Ex opere operato; and all Idolaters accordingly, &c.

Doth Mr. Saltmarsh look upon the ordinances of Christ, and his Apostles instituting, which is all one; as an Image made by a Papist, or a Golden Calfe, made by Idolatrous Israel, directly against Gods commands? Then certainly they are to be rejected: And he saith, they are not, in the next words, in the same page, where he saith, Christians sweetly partake of them, and God maketh heavenly things appeare by earthly; as Thomas, may see and beleeve. But what heavenly thing doth God make appeare by Papists Images, or Israels Golden Calfe? or how sweetly did they partake of them, or of God in them? or what Parables, figures, or types of Spirituall things were they? If ordinances be p. 216such, away with them, grind them to powder: The people of God are far from partaking of spirituall things in them; and from seeing any thing of Christ in the sides of an Image, and so to beleeve as Thomas did. If they be not alike; Then I wonder that men should make such similitudes, to work the hearts of people (who idolize their persons, and take all they say as an Oracle) to a base esteem of the Ordinances of God, by such unequall comparisons.

He speaketh of a mystery of Satan; It is (saith he) to fortifie corrupt nature against the Spirit of God, and therefore counterfeiteth the spirit by false revelations, and appearances, as casting reproach upon the Spirit of God; as praying by the spirit, and preaching by the spirit, and new revelations, and new light; thus making the world blaspheme, and the weaker Saints afraid of the glory of the spirit, lest it prove a delusion.

1 He saith, Satan counterfeiteth false Revelations, and appearances, And such Revelations and appearances there is, not onelyonly in the world, but among such as are against Ordinances. For when they hold forth things directly contradicting one another, the one must needs be a false revelation or delusion. As to say, I own the Scripture to be the word of God; Contradictions noted.and the same man to say, I know no other word of God but Christ; the one of these is a delusion, unlesse there be a further explication of the sayings.

2 He saith It maketh the world blaspheme, and weaker saints afraid of the glory of the spirit.

I Answer, no; They are not afraid of that, but of receiving delusions for Truth. All the Saints are commanded to try the spirits, and not to beleeve every spirit; And because weaker Saints (as they please to tearm them that walk in the use of Ordinances, assuming strength to themselves) dare not receive every thing that they say is by the spirit, (though there be meer contradictions to Scripture, and their owne sayings one among another,) This argueth not that they are afraid of the glory of the spirit, but that they desire to glorify the spirit.

Mr. Saltmarsh saith, The perfecting of the saints, Ephes. 4. was in all Ages, D.P.and therefore that hath relation to Christ, and not to the gifts spoken of there. Another of them saith, the perfecting of the saints, was for that Age only, because Apostles, &c. do not continue. Here is a contradiction one against another.

Mr. Saltmarsh maketh the Baptisme of the spirit, to be the Baptisme of gifts, page 33. and yet pag. 39. he saith, it is the being Baptised into Christs spirituall body, 1 Cor. 12.13. By one spirit are we all Baptised, &c. That is another Baptisme, for we all have not those gifts. And if he mean they are one and the same, Why doth he distinguish them? If they be not one, why doth he make them one? So that here is contradiction.

Mr. Saltmarsh saith, that the Gospel is the revelation of the mystery of p. 217salvation in spirit only, in one place. And pag. 68. he calleth the Gospel Graces, or the second Heaven. pa. 106. He calleth the Gospel Christ. And Doctrine of Baptisms pa. 19. saith, The word preached is the Gospel. Here is contradiction againe.

One saith, the ministery of the revelation is come, which he saith, D. P.is the ministery of Christs God-head, Lord of Lords, and KING of KINGS And Mr. Saltmarsh pag. 123. saith, it is not the time of Christs reign.

He that writeth the Doctrine of Baptismes, pa. 5, saith, speaking of those Act. 19. this Baptisme into the name of Christ, was not the repeating of any Water. Mr. Saltmarsh saith, it was alwayes with Water, and proveth it; and the Scripture is clear for it. Here is contradiction.

He saith pa. 6. The greatest glory of the New Testament is, the Baptism of the spirit, which is that of gifts, as he instanceth in Act. 2. Mr. Saltmarsh saith, the glory of the spirit in after times is greater. Here is one against another.

He saith pag. 14. The Commission is, I would have you go teach all Nations. Mr. Saltmarsh saith, it is, Goe ye into all the world, I Disciple the Nations, and Baptise them. Here is contradiction among themselves.

He saith pag. 19. Teaching the word, was the outward means of Baptising with the spirit, and saith Mat. 28. sheweth it; Others make the laying on of hands the outward meanes: So here is contradiction among themselves.

But the truth is, Mat. 28. with Mar. 16 shew, That teaching the word, is the outward meanes of begetting faith, and then those Beleevers have right to water Baptisme; That it sheweth: So Mark. 16. Go preach the Gospel—He that beleeveth and is Baptised shall be saved. I have noted these contradictions for this end; That the Reader may take notice, that all that men say is of the spirit, is not so. TRY THE SPIRITS 1 John 4.1.

I shall now come to speak to some sentences in Mr. Saltmarsh his book. He saith pag 15. That is the true Church or body of Christ, Some sentences in M. Saltmarsh book, answered.which is Baptised by one spirit, into onenesse, or unity of spirit; An unity or incorporation with Christ, being made perfect in one, even in one, as thou Father art in me, and I in thee.

I Answer, The Scripture speaketh also of particular Churches, that are true Churches But he saith, they were types of this, but bringeth no proof for it.

He saith pag. 17. This Church was the pillar and ground of Truth. I Answer, so were particular Churches, 1 Tim. 3.15. for such a one was Timothy in, the Church of the Ephesians, 1 Tim. 1.3.

Pag. 18, 19. He saith, This Church is not to be divided by any outward thing, which is of this creation, which are visible, outward, or perishing. Col. 2.20, 21. Or by any fellowship, or Ordinances, below the glory of the spirit, which are part of the first Tabernacle. [But the Ordinances p. 218of the Gospel are no part of it.] And therefore whatsoever fellowship in pretence of Church notion, or Baptisme notion, or Presbiteriall notion, shall cast it self into any modell of the Letter [That is of the Law.] which alloweth not communion with other Beleevers in spirit, [How shall we know them but by their works? Neither do we deny fellowship in spirit, with any that are in spirit,] in whom the power of the spirit cannot be denyed, but to be visible and apparent beleevers; though not in the practice of some particular Ordinance; such fellowships will in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ, or clearer revelations of Christ, see how they have offended many little ones.

So will he that hath written to beat down Ordinances of Christs instituting; as appeareth plainly in Scripture. And whether doth he offend most, that dare not walk contrary to what he findeth to be the rule of Scripture; or he that refuseth so to do, and will have no fellowship in Ordinances at all. Whom in these outward things they ought to have pleased to edification; The law of love, and spirit, and life, being more excellent then any worldly rudiment whatsoever, Col. 2.20. [That is not Gospel Ordinances.] And why ought not they in these outward things to please their weak Brethren to edification, to walk in the use of them?

If Baptism by water, and the Supper, be a signe and figure; and so legall; and particular Churches, a signe and figure of the true Church; (as he saith it) is not the Scripture written also, a figure of the Law written in our hearts? And so when the spirit is revealed, the Scripture is flesh, of the first creation, &c. And Mr. Saltmarsh his Preaching, is but a type or figure of the Preaching of Christ, the true Prophet; And so his preaching the Gospel was but Flesh, Carnall, a type of the first creation, &c.

Pag. 31. He saith, Therefore we are said to be Circumcised with him in Baptism, Col. 2.12. The Spirit guided him not here; for it saith, BURIED with him in Baptism.

He saith, Christ Baptized none, but his Disciples, John 4.1. so as his Disciples Baptised not as his only ministration, but from John; and as in his ministration, unto the Lord Jesus; as a ministration that was so acceptable to the Disciples; And Pag. 80. he saith the same: (The Scripture saith it was Christs act, Joh. 3.23. & 4.1, 2, 3.

He saith, pag. 33. The Baptisme of water was called the Baptisme of Repentance, and manifestation to Israel; because the comming of Christ in the flesh, was the first opening of the mystery of Christ in the flesh to those who were under sin and bondage, as the Jews and Gentiles were, Act: 19.4. Joh. 1.32.

He might have done well to have proved his reason from Scripture, we are not bound to beleeve it else; And are not Jews and Gentiles under sin and bondage now, as well as then? And therefore his reason holdeth good now as well as then. Beside, I conceive it is, That hee might be made manifest to Israel, The reason is, because he was to come to Israel after the flesh; and Israel looked for the Messiah; Therfore it was reason p. 219he should be made manifest to Israel. And beside, the word of grace was first tendered to Israel, and he was first sent to Israel. Acts 13. Mat. 15.Acts 13Matt 15And he calleth it the Baptisme of Repentance, because the Subjects of this Baptism were such as repented; for they confessed their sins, Mat. 3.

Pag. 35. The Baptisme of God, or the Holy Ghost, was administred from Christ, in the Apostles ministration; Be Baptised, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, Act. 2.

This was, be Baptised with water; for if it had been the Baptisme of the Holy Ghost, it had been non-sense; Bee Baptized with the Holy Ghost, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Pag. 37, 38, 39, 40. He defineth what the Baptisme of Christ is, which he calleth. His owne proper, and spirituall, and only ministration.

We doe not affirm that the Baptisme with water, is the Baptisme of Christ in this sense, because it is his own proper, and spirituall, and only ministration: But a thing ordained, and instituted by Christ, and so it is the Baptisme of Christ, as truly as the other. And so the Disciples preaching was truly the teaching of Christ, they being sent out to do it, as truely as his teaching the heart; though it was not his proper, and spirituall, and only ministration. So the sufferings of the Saints, are called the sufferings of Christ, 2 Cor. 1.5. So the Churches are called, the Churches of Christ, yet gathered, and planted by the Apostles and Disciples ministery, and not by his owne proper, and spirituall, and only ministration, Rom. 16.16. Christ is said to work, and the works that he did are called, the works of Christ, Mat. 11.2. And yet the work that Epaphreditus did is called, the work of Christ too, Phil. 2.30. So a man is called, a minister of Christ, not that he ministreth Christ himselfe, but is appointed of Christ to minister in the things of Christ, Col. 1.7. So the word of Christ is not only his owne proper, and spirituall, and only ministration; But the word of the Gospell, written by the Apostles, and Evangelists, and preached to us, Col. 3.16.

He saith, The Baptisme of Christ thus administred, in his own spirituall nature upon his, is the very Baptisme by which we are in the fellowship of his sufferings and death. Phil. 3.10. Rom. 6. [And yet he acknowledgeth that, that Rom. 6. is the Baptisme with water in his Exceptions] here is contradiction.

He saith page 44. That Apostles, Prophets, and Evangelists, Pastors, and Teachers, were knowne to be such, both by the Saints and people of God, to whom they did according to their gifts administer; And to themselves, they administring in the knowledge of such gifts of spirit as were in them; [If they were so certainly knowne to the Church, How came the Churches so far out of conceit with Paul, as the Corinthians? 2 Cor. 1.1. And to fall into faction concerning men? 1 Cor. 1. I am of Paul, and I am of Ap…llo, &c. And the Galathians to be Pauls enemy, Gal. 4.

He saith, page 47. All gifts now, are either naturall, or artificiall, or p. 220purely spirituall; upon that account, not upon any account of distinction of gifts, and offices, as at the first, &c. [All gifts come from God, both officers and order for them: But for officers they are either sent immediately by Christ, or chosen by the Church; and that remaineth still.

Page 48. he saith, Then the Spirit of God was powred out in gifts, and the Disciples were taught from God, and Prophesied and Preached from the meer Gift, and Spirit received: But now Prophets and Pastors are taught from another account, viz. upon a more artificiall, and industrious, and humane account, and their regenerate nature; then they ministred and spake as the Oracles of God.

And did they not use Industry and Art then? What meaneth Paul to bid Timothy STUDY to shew himselfe a man approved, 2 Tim. 2.15. 1 Tim. 4.13. 2 Tim. 4.13.2 Tim 2:151 Tim 4:132 Tim 4:13and give attendance to reading, &c. And to charge Timothy to bring him the Books and parchments that he left at Troas?

2 Is not their regenerate nature, and their enlightnings of the Spirit that way; and their gift by that means a gift of the Spirit, as well as the others?

3 If he meane by that phrase (Then they taught as the Oracles of God) infallibly, as he seemeth to import in his Epistle to Mr. Knollis page 328. where he sheweth he meaneth infallibly, purely, and immediately from the Spirit: I would faine have him shew me where he hath any warrant to teach or preach now; seeing I conceive, he will not say, he teacheth infallibly, by a pure spirituall gift immediately: for there is a Command, that every man that speaketh, speake as the Oracles of God: and I would fain have him give me a Scripture proofe that any man spake otherwise, that was allowed of God to teach in all the New Te…stament, where the proofe is that any may teach that cannot so speake, if his argument hold against it?

And if there be no restoring of those gifts (as he saith) why will they undertake to doe as they doe, to professe they have the same gift? for they say they speake not by Art or study, but as the Spirit moveth, and God giveth them utterance: And if so, then the gift is restored in them one way, though they deny it another way; If they have not that gift, why doe they cast all they say upon the Spirit then?

Saltm. Page 52. The present Ministery of men among all the Churches, &c. [This man would have but one Church before and now he himselfe acknowledgeth CHURCHES at this day.]

Page 53. he saith, This principle of local Separation, he findeth is both Jewish, and Legall, and Literall; and is sucked in by the Saints from the first Gospell discovery, and from the Law, and Mosaicall principles of Separation. I answer, what is this, but to charge Paul that writeth to the Corinthians the Commandements of the Lord, to hold Legall, and Mosaicall principles? for he writeth to them to separate locally … Cor. 6.17.

p. 221Page 54. he saith, All the Law of outward order and forme, is onelyonly a supplement to the absence of the Spirit of God, and to order their outward man among men, to their fellow Saints, and the world; while the Law of the Spirit of life is not in them shining and conforming them in Spirit and love to the Image of Christ.

I answer, 1 They had the Spirit of God gloriously in the primitive times, and outward order too: Therefore it could be no supplement to the Spirit.

2 We are to order our selves among men, to the Saints and world, that they may see our good workes, and glorifie God, Mat. 5.16.Matt 5:16as well as those in those times; Therefore we are to stand for outward order as well as they. I must see a mans life ordered by the Spirit as well as hear him speake spiritually, else I shall question whether it be the Spirit of God, seeing …athan can transforme himselfe into an Angell of light.2 Cor. 11.2 Cor 11

He saith page 55. I am far from thinking these Administrations to be our glory, and high point of reformation; which our brethren of the Independent, and Baptisme, and Presbyteriall way do.

I answer, For some of them of Baptisme way, I can testifie they think no such matter; but they thinke the high point of reformation lyeth in heart and spirit, to have that spirituallized and filled with the enjoyments of Christ, and so to live upon him dependingly and derivingly, and to live unto him obedientially in heart and life, But we do not think this is no point of reformation, to maintaine that order, and those Ordinances Christ hath left us upon record in the New Testament; for to make no matter how and where we worship, or what worships we are in, we think it is a point of no reformation: Seeing we are tyed in Scripture to glorifie God with our bodies, as well as with our spirits.1 Cor. 6.20.1 Cor 6:20

He saith, page 56. It is cleare our living in such administrations is our bondage; and citeth 1 Cor. 13.8, 9, 10, 11, 12. to prove it, Now we see darkly through a glasse, and see in part, and when that which is more perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

I answer, 1 The words are not truly read; He saith, when that which is MORE perfect is come. Answer to 1 Cor. 13.8, 9, 10, 11, 12 cited by M. Salt.1 Cor 13:81 Cor 13:91 Cor 13:101 Cor 13:111 Cor 13:12All the Translations in English that I can finde say, When that which IS perfect, not MORE perfect: Not as if when a man is a little more drawne up into spirit, then he must throw off use of Ordinances: But when that which IS perfect, which is not in this life, as I shewed before. For saith the Apostle, Here we know but in part; Then it seemeth we must have greater knowledge when we cast off Ordinances, then ever Paul had in all his life; for he used them.

And when that perfect teaching is come, that we have no need of Mr. Saltmarsh, nor other mens teaching; Then I conclude such a perfect Baptisme is come, that we shall not need water Baptisme.

2 I leave it to the judgement and consideration of any man of judgement to conclude, whether that [THEN] be in this life or no, p. 222while the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, in Tabernacles where we groan to be delivered; Gal. 5.17. 2 Cor. 5.1, 2.Gal 5:172 Cor 5:12 Cor 5:2or when we shall see face to face, and know perfectly as we are knowne; seeing this knowledge cannot be while we are in this body, 1 Joh. 3.2.

3 The Apostle speaketh not of the utter abolishing those things that are but in part; for he knew but in part, and prophesied but in part: Now he meaneth not, when that which is perfect is come, his knowledge shall be done away, for it shall be much more inlarged and glorious.

Pag. 60. Speaking of different Administrations, and having spoken to Johns, which I have answered before; he saith The other ministration was the Gospel in the flesh of Christ, &c. [Johns ministration was the Gospel, Mar. 1.1-5. and Luk. 16.16. The Law and the Prophets were untill John, since that time the Kingdome of Heaven is preached, &c. TILL John, that is strictly observed till then; not till the end of Iohns ministration, but till the beginning: as appeareth, not only by Luk. 16.16. but clearly by Mat. 11.11. All the Prophets prophesied till Iohn, And this is intimated also by Christ, Mat. 5.17. Thinke not that I am come to destroy the Law and the Prophets, &c. Why should Christ intimate such a thing to them, but that he knew they took occasion to think so from somthing which Iohn had revealed, which they saw not in the Law and Prophets before, concerning a new ministration under the Gospel, both in his Preaching and Baptising? And men pressed into the Kingdome, (i. e.) into the Gospel under Iohns ministration; which made them think that Christ intended sure to destroy the Law and the Prophets: And so Christ speaketh to their thoughts, as Iohn Baptist did to the Pharisees and Saduces, Mat. 3.9. And Christ to his Disciples, Mat. 10.34.

2 If the finishing of Iohns ministration put an end to the Law, and Legall ministrations: Then were the Administrations of the Law ended before the death of Christ, for Iohn was beheaded before Christs death. But that is false, Col. 2.14. Therefore the other.

Pag. 61. Another ministration (saith he) is in the Graces, operations, and fruits of the Spirit, as of Faith, Repentance, Self-deniall, Humility, Meeknesse, &c. Gal. 5 22. [And this ministration was also in time of the Law, and under gifts and ordinances, and now also; and shall be while this world standeth: when will the time be that a man is not to be humble, or to deny selfe, &c?

Pag. 62. He speaketh of the ministration of Angels, Revel. chap. 1. & 2. whether any man on earth shall have any such Administration to him, remaineth to be proved.

He speaketh of another ministration of patient bearing, suffering, and doing good to enemies. [And this also was under the administration of Ordinances, both of Law and Gospel.]

He saith, pag. 66. concerning the last ministration, which he calleth, The mere full and naked ministration of God by himselfe in Spirit; he saith, It is not only at the last day, done upon the whole Body of p. 223Christ, but is fulfilled in its particular accomplishments in the Saints here.

[But I see no Scripture proofe for it. He citeth, Revel. 22.22, 23. but telleth us not the meaning of the text; and if it doe not meane as he meaneth, then it doth not prove the thing. For we may ask, 1. To what time that relateth? 2. To what Church, or people? 3. What he meaneth by Temple? If he say, Gifts, and Ordinances, and Baptisme by water, &c. Then he himselfe contradicteth himselfe, for he saith, these are the Court of the Temple given to the Gentiles.

Pag 69. saith he, As Christ was in the world, so is every Christian; he was made under the Law, under Circumcision, &c. [It is true, Gal. 4.4] under Baptisme, and the Supper of Bread, and Wine; [The Scripture revealeth no such thing] and then he crucified all that flesh he walked in under those dispensations, and entred into glory: For thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to enter into his glory, Luk. 22.

I answer; 1. That every Christian is made under Circumcision with hands, I know no Scripture affirmeth it. He saith, As Christ was in the world, so, &c. I say, every Christian was in the world. But if he meane under the same dispensations, I say, No: for then every Christian must come into the Temple, and be Circumcised the eighth day.

2 And then (saith he) he crucified all that flesh, &c. And if he will but allow us, that which he seemeth here to allow; That we shall be as Christ was under Baptisme, and the Supper of Bread and Wine till we dye, as the Scriptures cited proveth he was, why will he plead against it so? And this may serve for answer to the like thing affirmed, pag. 260.

Pag. 70. He saith, And while God lived in each ministration, quickning, and glorifying, and acting it for himselfe, the presence of God, and of Spirit, was to the Disciples like the Sun in Summer shining upon them; the candle of the Lord shining upon their heads, and his secret upon their Tabernacle: But when the line of Gods season was run out to its point, and extremity, that he would no longer stay there, nor have his glory inhabite in such and such a ministration; then that ministration became a place of desolation, a solitary place, for the Satire to dwell in, and the Scritch-owle to sing in (i.e.) for the spirit of Apostasie and Antichrist to possesse, and act in, &c. And so he goeth on shewing we should not abide in a ministration, when God hath left it.

I say so too, when God hath utterly left it. But he hath not yet proved the ministration of Baptisme by Water, and the Supper, and other Ordinances are left of God. Where is the Bill of divorce that God hath given them? Is there no Christian under Baptism with water? if there be, Doe all his experiences faile him, that tell him, that he enjoyed God in that ordinance, and doth still sweetly in the use of the Supper? And if God have left these, and the Spirit also, why doth he tell Mr. Knollis, he is not against the Baptism of water; and it occasioneth abundance to fall off from their obedience, and some to loosenesse of life, and look upon Ordinances p. 224as an Odium, by his writing this Book? And if God be gone from those Ordinances, and those that use them be possessed with a spirit of Apostasic, and Antichristianisme or iniquity; as he intimateth those are that continue in Ordinances when God is gone, or that they finde such a spirit dancing or singing there; How durst he say, he was not against it? For my part, I think all Christians should be against a spirit of Apostasie, and Antichristianisme, and Iniquity; and if God be not gone, but be still found there, how can he prove they be ceased, and carnall, and flesh, and only for the age of the Apostles?

From Pag. 84-93. He maketh a discourse of the life of outward ordinances, as he saith, and telleth us, what the new Creature is, and the true spirituall ministery by which he groweth up; and the true spirituall Baptism, and the Supper of the Lord; and Minister, and Pastor, and Elders, and Church, and Keyes, and Excommunication, and Gospel order, and Government, and Covenant, and Ordination, and Trial of gifts.

I answer; If he meane there is no outward ministery, nor Baptism, nor Supper, nor Minister, nor Pastor, nor Elder, nor Church, nor Keyes, nor Excommunication, nor Gospel-order, &c. And that all is false but that which he nameth; then it is against the cleare Scriptures of the New Testament; or else these Scriptures will prove of no use. As for example; The true Spirituall Minister is Jesus Christ, saith he, &c. Was Paul and Apollo false Ministers therefore? If so, then Paul abuseth the people of God when he saith, 1 Cor. 4.1. Let a man so account of us as Ministers of Christ: And yet these were not Christ. If he meane these things are truly Spirituall in way of preheminency to the outward, the life of them; not condemning the outward, I yeeld to him: But that I think is not his meaning; and then see whether this tendeth. There is no Church to be seen outwardly, if the Christian be the minde only; as Mr. George Hassell would have it; nor no outward order. What is being in the Church then, Job 10. ult.Job 10but as being in the Grave, a place where there is no order? So that in the Thessalonians, 2 Thess. 3. That reproveth idlenesse in outward calling as a disorderly walking, is nothing; idlenesse may be: that is no disorder now. Sins that both Law and Gospell condemneth are no disorder now. If they be, then there is a true Spirituall order outwardly, as well as the members differing one from another in glory, and spirit, and power. And he seemeth, pag. 90. to be of George Hassels mind, that the Spirit only is the Christian; Christ being a spirituall head, hath a spirituall body. It is true. But by his discourse he seemeth to meane a body only in spirit, and nothing outward; and so the outward members of the outward man may doe what he will, and walk loosly in all sin, for they are no part of Christs Body; yet he confesseth outward excommunication. pag. 306.

Pag. 100. He saith, There have been Christians in severall formes and worships, under Episcopacy, Prelacy, Presbitery, &c. in all places among Jewes, and Gentiles. [I yeeld to this, yet give us leave to say p. 225according to Scripture truth, The Churches which are false, are false; in their constitution, order, &c. Beare with us, for your censure of Administrations possessed with a spirit of Apostacy, Antichristianisme, and iniquity, is as harsh. We confesse true Christians, possessed with the Spirit of God, though living in Churches of false constitution, as Gentile Idolatrous societies were; and though God had his people there, this will not warrant their staying there, when once they see the evill of it.

Pag. 109. He saith, Before the Administrations God was in, as Tabernacle, Temple, Priests, Prophets, &c. which God laid by, he never appeared in them more: Nor Christ when he had once ended his Administration in the flesh, he never restored it in that very way againe.

I say no; he never did, nor intended to suffer more: But he declared to his Disciples the things concerning his Kingdome, in his Body, before his Ascention, Act. 1.4.

And so in all reformations, respectively to these former Administrations, they never returned back, or re-assumed the same againe, after once God refused it, or laid it by: When Christ came in the flesh, he did not make it his work to settle the Priesthood againe, &c.

I answer; When God layeth by an Administration utterly, forever; then indeed the people of God are to lay it by, and re-assume it no more; but not till then. Now where hath God laid by preaching of the Gospel, or baptisme with water, of the Supper?

Againe, the Priests, &c. were types of Christ, and his comming in the flesh was to put an end to them; among other ends, Heb. 10. so that if he had setled them againe, he had fought against himselfe in it. Prove the same of these Ordinances or Administrations.

He saith, The falling away hath put an end to them.

I answer; Where will any Scripture prove, that Apostacy, or the creeping in of Anti-christ putteth a finall end to any Administration of God? This is an enemy to God, and the Saints; and when enemies have spoyled them of administrations, they have taken them up againe; as the Jewes, concerning their first and second Temple. But when Christ putteth an end to them, then they are no more to be used. Israel Apostated and fell away from the worship of God often-times under Idolatrous Kings: yet the godly Kings re-assumed it againe, till Christ came, and put an end to that kinde of service. Israell Apostatized from dwelling in Booths; yet finding it in the Word as their duty, they took it up againe: And there was no end put to it by their Apostacy, till Christ came, who was the end of those types and shadowes. And if we have figures and types now under the Gospell, as he saith we have; then it must be Christs comming must lay them by, and not Apostasie. Israell being recovered from Babilon, built her Temple againe, and set up her Administrations: And though God was gone, as in Ezekie. I proved before, p. 226yet he came againe when it was built againe. So the Israell of God recovering from mysticall Babilon, may take up her Ordinances againe, though they have been corrupted by Anti-christ, and God gone in that respect: till Christ reveale otherwise. And since the people of God have re-assumed them, God hath come againe, and been seen and enjoyed in them; and they have found God in Sodome, and Christ in the Grave; if Ordinances be Sodom, and the Grave (as he intimateth.) And for those extraordinary gifts which the Church hath not, she cannot take them unlesse God give them.

2 Is not Preaching an administration that was from Christs time to the falling away? And was not Doctrine corrupted by Anti-christ, as well as other Ordinances? 2 Pet. 2.1, 2.2 Pet 2:12 Pet 2:2And were not gifts gone from false Doctrine as well as from false Worships? Did not false Teachers creepe in, and bring in damnable Heresies, as well as false Worships, and corrupt Ordinances? What warrant is there then to re-assume Doctrine, but to wait upon the higher teachings of the Spirit, seeing this was laid by at the time of Apostasie and corruption, as well as other Ordinances?

Pag. 110. He saith, The falling away was no more, but the Lord gathering up, and taking in the out-goings and operations or gifts of the Spirit, in such ministrations.

I answer; When the Lord gathereth up his Spirit, no man can have it in any ministration; that is true. But the gathering up of those gifts did not prove the ceasing of Ordinances, as Baptisme with water, preaching the Gospell, the Supper: Neither hath the Lord said any where, they shall cease; neither hath he revealed it, that they were ordained upon some speciall Reason, and then to cease; as gifts and miracles were for confirmation of the word then spoken, Mar. 16. ult. Heb. 2.2. Therefore the one might cease, and God gather up one? and the other continue, that was not given for that end.

2 It seemeth by this affirmation, it was long of God that men fell away, whereas the Scripture sheweth it was their owne corruption; Because iniquity aboundeth, the love of many shall wax cold, and because of false Teachers, 2 Pet. 2.1, 2. And Heb. 3. Take …eed least therebe in any of you an EVILL heart of unbeleefe, in departing from the living. God. And indeed God gathered up his Spirit because of sinne, Gen. 6. My Spirit shall not alwaies strive with man for that he also is flesh, and the imaginations of his heart are only evill continually.

Pag. 114. He calleth the Saints, Spirituall vessels, or Golden cups of the Lords Temple, carried away captive, and live under the flesh.

I answer; If so, then when the Lord bringeth them out of Captivity, they may returne and build their Temple; I meane, not only Christ in Spirit; but all those Ordinances that he left them in his Word to walke in.

He saith, pag. 121. All that pretended refomatrion by gifts and p. 227Ordinances, which tendeth to the reducing of us to that first Ministery of the Apostles times, which they of the Presbytery, Independency, and Baptisme endeavour; is but a building up those things which the Lord would have destroyed, &c.

I answer; 1. This is not proved; and beside, we have warrant from Christ to reduce things to their first purity, so neare as we can, when they are out of order; as I have shewed.

He saith, And therefore the Lord suffered the Man of Sinne to prevaile upon it, &c. I answer; Did it follow, that because the Babilonians of old prevailed over the people of Israel, and destroyed their Temple, and worships; that therefore it was Gods minde to have it utterly destroyed for ever? No such matter. Neither doth it now follow, that because the Man of Sin prevailed through the negligence of the Church, therefore God would have his Ordinances in the first purity destroyed. This is but reason, and he that writeth it giveth no Scriptuie proofe for it.

Page 115. In describing what is the Beast, and false Prophet, and Whore, he saith, This is the Whore too; for when the Spirit is departed from God, and the life of God, is become an Adultresse; having lost its first love, or husband, even the Lord himselfe; and sitteth upon a Beast, even the flesh, &c.

I answer, This is the Spirit of whoredome, but there is whoredome in act also; And so he confesseth, That Antichrist worketh as well without to the world, as within in the flesh of every Saint. And therefore though the false Prophet, and Beast, and Whore, be within in the spirits of false Prophets, Beasts, Whores; yet they are without also.

Page 132. He asketh, Where are those gifts of pure anointing now?

I answer, In the Scripture: And so farre as Pastors and Teachers teach the truths of Scripture, so farre they teach the pure Anointing.

Page 249. He affirmeth, That the Jewes were but figures of the children of the Bona-woman, and of Christians under the Apostasie, in meer letter, and corrupt formes of worship: And as the Jews were reckoned before to be the people of meer Ordinances, &c.

I reply, The Apostle speaketh of calling that very people that were broken off, Rom. 11.1. Hath God cast away his people whom he foreknew? God forbid, saith Paul. How doth he prove he hath not? For I also (saith he) …m an Israelite, &c. A man may easily see he meaneth that people, of the seed of Abraham according to the flesh. And so he goeth on to shew that as God had a remnant of them in Elijahs time, when the rest were fallen to Baals Idolatry; So at this time (saith he) God hath a remnant of the same people, Rom. 11.5. Againe he speaketh of such Jewes, that the Gentiles, other Nations were opposed to, such as were the Romans, as ver. 12, 13.30. 4 He speaketh of a people which he calleth, ver. 14. them that are his flesh, whom he desired to provoke to emulation, and save some of them; Therefore it is that people: And this may serve for answer to that that he saith, Page 250. That the p. 228calling of the Jewes is nothing else but bringing the Christian from Letter to Spirit.

Page 254. he saith, Christ in us, is when we are made the Anointed of God, which is the Christ, or the whole entire Christ as one spirituall new man, 1 Cor. 12.12. [So that by this Doctrine we are as much Mediator, Redeemer, Justifier, as Christ, that was borne of the Virgin Mary, and suffered at Jerusalem. Beside, the place of Scripture he citeth calleth the Church Christ, in relation of body to Head; and not that every Saint is as whole entire Christ as he.

Page 256. He maketh the fiery triall spoken of by Peter, To be a going out of more Legall administrations, to lesse Legall, or more Gospell, &c. Whereas the Apostle speaketh of persecutions, of being reproached for the Name of Christ, and suffering not as a murtherer, nor theefe, &c. but as a Christian, 1 Pet. 4.14.16. This is the fiery tryall he speaketh of, and not the other.

Page 265. he saith, The six dayes were a figure of Christians under bondage, or working administrations, as those of the Law and Gospell are; as all Forms of worship, duties, graces, prayers, or Ordinances, &c. And some say, All outward things are Forms. So that by this Tenet, All outward duties, graces, prayers, ordinances, are ceased, to them that are in God or Christ. If they mean dissolved, and with Christ, as Paul speaketh, I say so too; but else I require their Scripture proofe for it.

2 Consider, here is affirmed, that all duties and graces too, are bondage; so that all acts of righteousnesse and holinesse, all spirituall qualifications are a bondage; here is either loosenesse or nothing.

Page 246. he saith, The New Covenant, or God revealed in his, is not by any outward way, or ministration, or means, but by the inward, or unction, or anointing; Ye are all taught of God, Heb. 8. No man shall teach his Neighbour or Brother, saying, know the Lord: And all conference, or discovery in letter or speech, is but meer witnessing to the Lord, and discovery of God of what we are taught, not any Ministery (as formerly) for teaching.

I answer 1. That ye shall be all taught of God, is teaching men to beleeve, and come to Christ; as appeareth clearly, Joh 6.44, 45, 46, 47, 48. And it is true, God alone teacheth the heart to beleeve, but yet by outward means; For faith commeth by hearing, and hearing by the word of God, Rom 10.17. (i. e.) not by Christ alone, as some would have no other word of God; but by the word of Faith, or Gospell preached, as appeareth ver. 14.15. and 1 Cor. 1.21. Yea the whole sequell of the Chapter, Rom 10. maketh it cleare, witnesse the saying of Isay to prove that Israel heard the word of God. Concerning Heb. 8. I have answered it, in the objection upon Heb. 8. And in the objection that none may preach but infallible men.

Page 247. he saith, No outward Ordinance or ministration of the p. 229creature, or of the letter, can convey, or conferre, or bring in pure spirituall things, Joh. 3.8. There is a great mistake in that; they are but signes and shadows of spirituall things; and they are to the Spirit in the New Testament, as the shadows in the Old were to the flesh of Christ, figures, and perishing things, and to be fulfilled in Spirit, and in the comming of Spirit, Col. 2.20.1 Cor. 11.26.

See how he here overthroweth preaching; is not that an outward Ordinance? And saith he, They are to be fulfilled in Spirit, and the comming of the Spirit, and citeth 1 Cor. 11. which some plead for laying downe breaking of bread. And saith he, No outward Ordinance, &c. I wonder why they doe not lay down preaching, exhorting, instructing, witnessing to God; their words are but outward things.

Beside, we say not, They can convey pure spirituall things; but God can convey them in the use of outward Ordinances: As faith commeth by hearing.

Page 265. he saith, The first patterne in Scripture of Offices and Ordinances, was but a more purely legall dispensation or a discovery of the Gospel, rather as to Christ after the flesh then after the Spirit, and a discovery, as to the weaknesse both of Jewes and Gentiles then, respectively to visible administrations, and gifts of Spirit.

I answer, It was the minde of Christ concerning his Kingdome; for the Apostles preached it up, and acted it, and that by Commission from Christ; for in the forty dayes he conversed with them, Act. 1. he spake of things concerning the Kingdome of God.

He saith, God never set up any Administration, or Office, but for a time and season, and used it as a temporary dispensation, as the Tabernacle, Temple, Law, Priesthood, &c. and then left them never to be restored; So the first Gospell administration of Ordinances, Gifts, &c. And yet he saith, page 278. There is a knowledge of God by outward Ordinances, and duties. Here is contradiction. If God have left them, How can he be known by them?

Now I shall speake briefly to some things in, The Doctrine of Baptismes, and so conclude.An answer to the most mat…rial passages in the Doctrine of Baptismes.

Page 2. he saith, Johns Baptisme was NEW and famous. [Therefore I conclude from his saying, it was not of the Law.

Page 4. He proveth Johns Baptisme, and Christs distinct (one was water, and the other fire) by Arguments. 1 They have distinct appellati…ns or names, That of water was still called Johns. [I say water Baptisme was not alway called Johns, neither Joh. 3 nor Act. 10.

And speaking of the honour of Johns Baptisme, he saith, Christ himselfe who was borne under the Law, and subject to the Law, submitted himselfe to the Baptism of John, as to the last and liveliest Ceremony, Mat. 3.13.

It is strange, And we read not in the whole Law of any such Ceremony; But it was a thing as he confesseth, immediately revealed from p. 230God, at which the people stranged, and was new and famous, page 2. the Scripture saith, J…h. 1. Mar. 1.1.Mark 1:1The Law was given by Moses; but Moses spake not a word of this; Therefore this is of the Gospell, as Mark saith

Page 5. He saith, Paul preacheth the Doctrine of faith to them, Act. 19. And Paul repeateth only Johns Doctrine.

He maketh a long Discourse to prove the Baptisme of John and Christ distinct; [which need nor be, we acknowledge it; but when we mention the Baptisme of Christ, and mean water; we mean not that Christ administred that Ordinance; we can distinguish of such things, The teaching of Christ by his Spirit, and the teaching of Christ by his Servants, and yet both the teachings of Christ, as Jer. 31.33. So the Baptisme of Christ administred immediately from Christ by his Spirit, and the Baptisme of Christ by water, administred by Christs Servants by his Commission; and yet both the Baptisme of Christ.

Page 6. He saith, So far as John preached Christ spiritually, he did it not as Baptist, but as John a beleever. [Was not John a Baptist as he was a beleever? Was he not sent from God to Baptise? And doth he send unbeleevers upon any spirituall worke about his worship? And did not God give him a Commission to Preach and Baptise both, as he was a beleever? Here is a needlesse distinction.

Page 9. He saith, Some baptised with Johns Baptisme, did not know the way of God perfectly; that is (saith he) had no certaine knowledge of Christ, the way of God, as Apollo, Act. 18. [This is contrary to Scripture; for it saith, He taught diligently the things of the LORD; And saith, in the same place, He was instructed in the WAY of the LORD.] And some of them did not so much as know whether there were any Holy Ghost, Act. 19. much lesse had received the Spirit. [How could they beleeve then? Gal. 5.22.Gal 5:22Is not faith a fruit of the Spirit? But they did not know those gifts of the Holy Ghost that afterward they received]

He saith, Repentance and Remission of sins is the work of Christs owne Baptisme, which is the Baptisme of the Spirit, [But this is not the Baptisme of fire which he said was Christs owne Baptisme, and came upon the Apostles at Penticost; for they had Repentance and Remission of sins before, That onelyonly was gifts.

Page 10. Mat. 19 28. Luke 10.20.Matt 19:28Luke 10:20He saith, Sin was remitted in hope onelyonly in Johns Baptisme, but really in Christs. [It seemeth then by this, That the Apostles that followed Christ in the regeneration, it was onelyonly in hope; And their names written in the Booke of life onelyonly in hope, till Penticost: But the Scripture speaketh no such thing. And we are not to think of men above what is written.

'The Kingdome of God is a Spirituall Kingdome, saith he [It is and spiritually outward, as well as inward: It consisteth in Righteousnesse, &c. And Righteousnesse is not all inward, but outward Righteousnesse in life, as well as in heart, And Baptisme of water is acknowledged by p. 231Christ to be a part of Righteousnesse: So that it was of the Kingdome.]

He saith, It hath been the mistake of many Ages, that have made Johns Baptisme equall to Christs. [I thinke never any so simple to make water equall to the Spirit: But to make water Baptisme of Christs Institution, and so Johns the same, is no mistake.

Page 11. Speaking of the duration of Johns Baptisme he saith, It was very short, It continued till Christs Ascention. [But where doth the Scripture say, or shew, it ended then, or that John was a type of Christ? He was Christs Messenger before his face not his type. And for water Baptisme, the Scripture is cleare it continued after Christs Ascention, as Act. 2.38. when the Spirit was come to teach them all things, and did doe its office sure; I dare not think otherwise: yet Peter commandeth them to be Baptised. And Act. 10.48 and Act. 8.12 and 18.8. and 19.

He saith, Johns temporary Ministery had a temporary Baptisme: But the everlasting Gospell, which is the word in our flesh, hath an everlasting Baptisme. [1 Marke it, He maketh Faith and Repentance, and casting down mountaines, and exalting vallyes a temporary Ministery; for this was Johns. 2 The everlasting Gospel is the word preached as well as Christ within us, Rev. 14.6. Having an everlasting Gosbel to PREACH to men.

John (saith he) was to deliver up all to Christ. [And so Johns to end, It seemeth then he was to deliver up preaching to Christ, and we must look for no p…eaching now by word of mouth; for that was creature preaching word preaching, and not preaching to the heart.

Page 12. He saith, Water Baptisme hath been an unlawfull mixing or blending of he Church and world together, so that they could not … differenced from each other, to the great prejudice of the Congregation of Christ. [And since men have endeavoured to throw down water Baptisme, I mean of Beleevers (his speech I conceive is of Infants, ours is contrary) the world and the Congregation of Christ have been mixed together; for many of them can joyn with any body, and run to the world, and have communion with them.

He saith, One single man with the word may very sawfully and justly contradict the whole world without it. [I say it is very true; but he meaneth in disproving water Baptisme, &c. But fine elegant similitudes formed by man are not the WORD: And he hath brought no other to prove it.

He saith, Christ bringeth no temporall and earnall thing into his spirituall, and everlasting Kingdome. [So that Christ bringeth no preaching by word of mouth into his Kingdome; for that is but a temporall thing, nor prayer by word, nor conference, nor confession of God; all these are but temporall things: But that is not so, The word preached, is called the word of the Kingdome, Mat. 13.

Page 16. He saith, They circumcised for their sakes who were weak.

p. 232I say so too; but so they did not baptise with water, for you cannot say, those that had the extraordinary baptism of the Spirit, in those gifts of speaking with Tongues, and Prophesying, were weake: And yet such Peter commanded to be baptised with water baptism, Act. 10. but he never commanded Circumcision. And there is another difference.

Pag. 17. He saith, We finde Paul preaching in Christs Kingdom but one baptism, and this of the Spirit, Ephes. 4. [Paul doth not preach BVT one in Christs kingdom: But in unity of Spirit he saith, there IS one, not but one. See my answer to this before.]

Wherefore (he saith) seeing these things are so, The Anabaptists have been mightily mistaken, who have made their water-washing so essentiall a work of the New Testament. [Seeing these things are not so, the Anabaptists have not been mistaken, &c.

He maketh this one Baptisme to be the Baptisme of the Spirit. [If he meane that which Mr. Sal…marsh calleth, the Baptism of the Spirit, (i.e.) of gif…s; that concerneth not us, we having it not; and so we have not this one baptism; (I meane Miracle…, Tongues, and those gifts) and it seemeth he meaneth so, because he saith in the next words, This spirit Baptism did not goe along with Iohns water baptism, but followed it some four years after; that was the baptism of gifts: And we have not that baptism, and so by his conclusion are none of Christs body. For he citeth, Act. 1.5 & 2.1, 2, &c. & Ioh. 7.38. The holy Ghost was not yet given; and these Scriptures speake all of the baptism of gifts.

Pag. 19 He saith, This is the baptism wherein all the Church of the New Testament are to partake with Christ, that is the Spirit, not water.

I say, Then many beleevers are in a bad case, that dyed and never had this baptism that he mentioneth; of the gifts of the Spirit, which all the Scriptures that be citeth speaketh of.

And he saith, We have no more comfort in being one with Christ in water baptism, then Iudas had, going along in the same ship, &c. I answer; We have none in this Fire Baptism spoken of in these Scriptures that he citeth, because we have it not in this Age of ours.

He saith, Ephes. 5.16. with the washing of water by the Word; Is the spirits baptism. [This is not it that came upon the Apostles, Act. 2. nor upon the Samaritans, Act. 8. and that is it that he treateth of; for they beleeved, and their hearts were purified before, and were washed before by Christ: 2 Ioh. 1.2 John 1And so the water in the Ephesians should rather be the blood of Christ, then the Spirit; for the blood of Christ cleanseth from all sinne. So that you see how he confoundeth things together, that the Scripture maketh distinct.

Pag. 20, 21. He sheweth, This baptism of the Spirit (which as he explaineth it, is nothing but regeneration, or conversion to Christ, being made one with him by faith and the baptism of fire, or spirit that he named before) he saith, This giveth us a new nature, a new name, entreth us into a new world, enableth us to the ministery of the New p. 227Testament, to preach as it did Christ. [Then I hope converted men may preach: Some say no, except they be infallible; so they contradict themselves here also.] For he began to preach from his spirits Baptism. Saith he, We are all one with Christ who partake of it. [Divers of the fore-mentioned things belong to Regeneration, or Conversion; Contradiction.and that all that we read of, that were baptised with water had (or at least appeared to have) before they were baptised with water: And this is that we stand for, concerning the Spirits baptism, that enabled Christ to preach, and the Apostles too, was a greater measure of the Spirit, and some were eminent and excellent gifts; and this Baptism some had allo, before they had water baptism, and yet were commanded to be baptised with water, Act. 10. So that all these things are but flourishies which darken the truth to some, which by cleare Scripture will stand against all oppositions whatsoever.

Pag. 21. By the true Baptism of the New Testament we doe actually put on Christ, Gal. 3.27. I answer; There is as much for water baptism as the Spirits (as he calleth it) for the word saith not ACTVALLY (it may be professedly) it saith only, Put on Christ: And they were baptised into his name by water, and so put him on in profession. And putting on is a metaphor taken from a Garment, and Garments are on the out-side, which signifieth profession: they have not defiled the it garments. His actually, is but a consequence, mine of profession is as probable. I wonder men will so peremptorily conclude truth from their owne confrquences, and give counsell as he doth in the beginning of the book, not to rest upon men. bud… stick to the WORD, and that word he explaineth to be the Scriptures too: And yet he himselfe flyeth from them.

He saith, pag. 22. By the spirits baptism we are all one with the Church in body, 1 Cor. 12, 13. [This is not the baptism of gifts, and therefore he should have distinguished. And if he meane, the work of the Spirit in their hearts, they had this before water baptism; and yet this did not occasion them to neglect it, nor trample it under foot; If he meane the other (that he so often mentioneth) of gifts, we have not that: And if there be no other making us one with the body, we are none of the body in this time.

Pag. 23. He sheweth, by citing Tit. 3.5. he meaneth the work of Regeneration (as I have said) by the baptism of the Spirit. I say, This was not the fiery …ongues, this they had before baptism with water, and commonly before baptism with the Holy Ghost.

Pag. 24, 25. He telleth us what put an end to water baptism, &c. A Scripture cited to prove water baptism ceased 1 Pet. 3.20. answered.1 Pet 3:20There is another Scripture witnesseth the same thing, and it is, 1 Pet. 3.20. a few, that is, eight soules were saved by water, to which sigure, baptism answering, doth now also save us; not that where by the filth of the flesh is cast away; but whereby a good conscience answereth well to God, by the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Peter having said that baptism answereth p. 234to the floud, and saveth the Church now, as the floud did the Church then, yea, saith he, but I meane not the outward baptism, or the washing away of the filth of the body; but the answer of a good conscience towards God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Which place is difficult; but I thus c…nceive it. The officasie of Christs resurrection is the gift of the Spirit, and the Spirit of Christ in a beleever rectifieth his conscience and maketh it good, so that it can returne a sweet answer to God upon every word of his; for the work of the Spirit in the heart, answereth every word of faith spoken from God particularly: It can say, I was filthy and uncleane throughout; but I am now washed, and justified, and sanctified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of my God; and this Spirit Baptism is that that saveth, and not the water, which put away the filth of the flesh only, but leaveth the filth of the spirit as much as ever. So that in this place Peter putteth an end to baptism in the flesh, as Paul, Rom. 2.28. putteth an end to Circumcision in the flosh, saying, He is not a Iew which is one outwardlys neither is that eircumcision which is in the flesh, &c. that is, saith Paul, In the kingdom of Christ where all things are spirituall, circumcision in the Spirit, putteth an end to circumcision in the flesh; [By the same rule teaching in the Spirit putteth an end to teaching in the flesh; or by word of mouth; Conference in the Spirit, to conference in the flesh, or among men; Prayer in the spirit, to prayer by word; Righteousnesse in the Spirit, putteth an end to all acts of Righteousnesse done by the outward man, either towards God, or man; compassion and kindnesse in the Spirit, putteth an end to all outward kindnesse to them that are in wants: But all these are false, therefore the other upon that ground] and in the same kingdome faith Peter, baptism in the Spirit, putteth an end to baptism in the Flesh; for be is not a Christian that is one outwardly, neither is that baptisme which is in the flesh, but, &c. for under the Gospell, which is the ministration of the Spirit, we finde nothing among all outward things, through the use and exercise whereof we may attaine the cleansing and purity of righteousnesse in our natures.

[Yet faith commeth by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God preached, Rom. 10. And preaching is an outward thing, and he himselfe saith, out of the Ephes. We are washed with water, through the word, which be saith, is the Gospell PREACHED, pag. 19.] By the Word the Spirit is given, and the word cleanseth by the spirit, and the spirit by the word; (that is, the Gospell preached as he explaineth it) which is an outward thing. So here he contradicteth himselfe. And therefore Christ hath put an end to all outward, and carnall, and earthly things of the first Testament; [That is true: we stand for outward and inward of the second Testament; This cup of the NEW Testament, in MY bloud, saith Christ, not the first Testament. And by his owne death and resurrection only, not without us, but within us, through the power and efficasie of the Spirit, all the Baptisme of the New Testament is p. 235fully and perfectly performed; It seemeth by this conclusion, that the baptism of gifts is no baptism of the New Testament, for that was without us, an externall thing. There appeared to them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sate upon (not in) each of them, &c. And what then? They spake with tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance. So that either this baptism (or at least the effects of it, by this mans conclusion) was not of the New Testament; for their speaking was outward.

He said, Baptism saveth the Church now, as the Floud did the Church then. [Then it seemeth it was outward Salvation; for that was so: And then it may be outward baptism] for his Comment upon it, let that passe. But he saith, Peter put an end to baptism in the flesh, as Paul, &c. [That is not at all, for Paul doth not there put an end to it; for that was Christs worke, Col. 2.14. Ephes. 2.15.

But I conceive by his speech he meaneth, Peter declareth an end put to it. But the text saith, nor sheweth no such thing. All that can be gathered is, That the putting away the filth of the flesh doth not save: and I know no Anabaptist for my part that affirmeth it saveth. But doth this declare that there is an end put to water baptism, because it saveth not? Where Paul saith, Act. 4.12. neither is there Salvation in any other, doth this prove that Paul put an end to all things under Heaven among men, not to be used, because they did not save? By this Argument an end had been put to Circumcision, and all the Sacrifices long before they were ended. Mark what God saith, Isa. 43.11. Besideme there is no Saviour, I have declared, and saved, &c. & Isa. 45.21. A just God and a SAVIOVR, there is none beside me. Now if one had said here, Isaiah put an end to all outward Ceremonies, Sacrifices, Circumeision, should not he have wrested this Scripture? It was a Law in Israel, that the people should confesse their sins over the Goat, or Sacrifice, and Aaron should make attonement for them, Now saith God, Isa. 43.25. I am he that blotteth out thine iniquity for my names sake; should I reason according to truth, if I should say, God put an end to putting the Hand upon the head of the Sacrifice, he will take away sin himself? And this is not the saying of Isaiah, but God himself. But Christ put an end to them, and declared that God would have them no longer in plaine termes, Hebr. 10.5, 6, 7, 8, 9. And so doth the Scripture concerning all the Legall Sacrifices. But no such Scripture concerning either baptisme with Water, the Supper, Preaching, &c.

Pag. 25. He saith, The Baptism of the Spirit is sufficient now in the dayes of the Gospel and New Testament, as Christ himself only is sufficient to the faithful, without Iohn, &c. [So he was without Paul, or Peter, or any of their Epistles, or Scripture; Are these things not to be used therefore? Who is Paul, or who is Apollo, but Ministers by whom yee beleeved? 1 Cor. 3.1 Cor 3Not sufficient to save: That is Christ, without us.

But what sufficiency doth he meane? Iufficiency to enable us to good workes, I confesse it: For we have it not of our selves, as Paul saith; but mark it, Christ is sufficient to enable us, but yet he taketh in the Scriptures also, 2 Tim. 3.16, 17. God is sufficient, and Al-sufficient to be the Creatures p. 236portion, Gen. 17.2. And his grace is sufficient for his people in temptations and straits, 2 Cor. 12.9.

But there is a sufficiency of returnes to God in way of obedience, (2 Cor. 2.16. Who is sufficient for these things?) that we may glorifie him before men, for that he calleth for: And that must be by inward and outward obedience according to the rule of Scripture and Spirit, Glorisie God in your bodies and spirits, 1 Cor. 6.20.1 Cor 6:20which are Gods. And he is sufficient to inable us to this also; but no sufficiency freeth us from obedience.

I shall hereto adde an Answerto one or two passages in Mr. George Hassals book, which some admire, and use the same words.

The Apostle (saith he) in Gal. 4. saith, He preached the Gospell through infirmity of the flesh, An answer to a Scripture mistaken in Mr. Hassals booke, and indeed the whole booke hath little truth in it.being then under a low and fleshly dispensation, &c. And so he goeth on to shew that while Paul preached up Ordinances, and Rudiments (as he calleth them) they received him as an Angell of God; but when he came to preach up a Ministration above Ordinances, then they counted him their enemy: And saith he, They are so fast glewed to their formes, they cannot endure sound Doctrine; And Paul was counted their enemy, because he came not to them in the same Ministration that formerly he came to them in, but in a higher, and more spirituall, [To that he saith, Came to them in a Ministration above Ordinances, I say, above legall Ordinances, but no other. And so he did at first, even in a dispensatioa of Spirit. And that which he calleth infirmity of the flesh, is either persecutions or troubles which he endured for the Gospels sake, and so it seemeth to be by the next verse; for saith he, My temptation which was in the flesh ye despised not; And persecutions are called temptations, Jam. 1.3. Or else he stoopeth to their weaknesse, in allowing them for a time some legall Ordinances, as To the Jew, I became a Jew, &c. But what is this to Gospell Ordinances?

To that he saith Paul came not to them in the same Ministration, &c. I say he did; for Paul preached not another Gospel: He biddeth them, If be or an Angel from heaven preached any other Gospel then that he MAD preached; (Not that he NOW preached as if he changed his preaching, but that he preached at first) let him be accursed, Gal. 1. 8, 9.

Now saith he, This blessed Apostle, after Christ was formed in him, and that he was brought to live in the third heavens in Spirit, how earnest and desirous is he to have all them that formerly he had had society with, and had preached the Gospell through infirmity unto, to have the like spirituall enjoyments in them, and to be brought up to the same perfection and unity of spirit with himselfe; [And was not Christ formed in Paul till then? There he contradicteth himselfe; for he saith, Chap. 1.16. When it pleased God to reveale his Son IN me, that I might preach him among the heathen, &c. So that before ever Paul preached, D. P.Christ was formed in him. And for his living in the third heaven, one of his owne judgement saith, It was not a ministration then, p. 237but Paul saw it in a vision; This man saith, he lived in it then in spirit; And Mr. Saltmarsh saith, It was the ministration in Spirit. Contradiction.So that they …ontradict themselves in this also.

Now Paul was made partaker of the divine nature, saith he; [And not till now, not before? I had thought he had been partaker of the divine nature when Christ was revealed in him, and he was taken above all conferring with flesh and bloud; so high in spirit before ever he preached the Gospel, and it was the same Gospell the other Apostles preached, as appeareth Gal. 2. He could as well comprehend the Sea in the hollow of his hand as conceale it. The divine nature is love; and here you might see this nature in Paul, for after he knew the onenesse and unity of the Saints with the Father, he must make it knowne unto them. [So he did afore when he preached the Gospell through infirmity of the flesh; for then he knew it, he knew and see the just one at his conversion, before hee preached the Gospell, Act. 22 14, 15. And yet they kept close to their old formes. [That is not so, for that was Idolatry: But the false teachers would have led them to Jewish forms, which were abolished by Christ. And so he goeth on, adding more words to this purpose.

But to give a briefe Answer, beside what is inserted, which might suffice; I say, The Gallathians had men crept in among them which did preach up Circumcision, and keeping the Law, like those spoken of Act. 15. Yea that they could not be justified nor saved, except they kept the Law; for that was their Doctrine, as appeareth, Act. 15.1.5. And that such were among the Gallatians now, appeareth by the whole Epistle. Consider well, Chap. 1.6, 7, 8. and 2, 3, 4, 5. and 4.3.4, 5, 21, &c. and 5.2, 3, 4. And see clearly that they had men that taught these legall things, and they joyned them with Christ, to Justification and Salvation, Chap, 4.17, 18. It is good, saith he, to be zealously affected in a good thing, and not onelyonly when I am present with you; shewing by means of these men they were fallen from what they professed when he was present, or in danger of falling: for saith he, Chap. 1. I marvell ye are so soon removed to another Gospell! (So that he led them not higher, but endeavoured to establish them in the the same that he had preached.) And what these men were, that did so zealously affect them, that endeavoured to exclude the Apostles out of their affections, and get in themselves; hee sheweth, Chap. 6.12, 13. Such as made a faire shew in the flesh, and would constraine them to be circumcised, and yet themselves kept not the Law. So that you see clearly the meaning of Paul is, That the Gallatians receive the Gospell which he preached to them, and were so glad of him the Messenger of Christ, that they would have plucked out their eyes to have done him good: But now, by these Legall circumcision teachers creeping in, their mindes began to be alienated, both from the plaine simplicity of the Gospell, and from him the Minister of it; And that he told them, they were justified by Christ alone, and freed p. 238from the Laws observances in that point; Therein they looked upon him as their enemy; and this was the truth he telleth them in this Epistle; and not one word of comming in lower Administrations at first, and after in higher Administrations above Ordinances (as he falsely alleadgeth) for he came in the same Gospell as he did at first, else he had desired his owne accursing, Chap. 1.8.