Whole Works, Tracts 1 · Tract 4 · Part 5

Whole Works · Tracts 1 · Tract 4 · Part 5

p. 319An aunſwere to M. Mores fourth booke.

CHriſtes church hath the true doctrine already, More.and the ſelfe ſame that S. Paule woulde not geue an Angell audience vntounto the contrary.

Tyndall. But the Tyndall.Popes Church will not heare that doctrine.

More. Confirmed with ſuch a multitude of miracles, and ſo much bloud of More.martyrs, and commō conſent of all Chriſtendome.

Tyndall. Who ſhewed a miracle to confirme his preaching of eare confeſſion Tyndall.and Pardons with like pedlery? Eare confeſſion and pardons were neuer confirmed by miracle.or who ſhed his bloud for them? I can ſhew you many thouſandes that ye hauehave ſlayne for preaching the contrary. And agayne, Grecia the one halfe of Chriſtendome cōſenteth not vntounto thē, which Greekes, if ſuch thinges had come from the Apoſtles, ſhould hauehave had them er ye.

M. The ſpiritualtie be not ſo tender eared, but that they may heare their ſinnes More.rebuked.

Tyndall. They conſent not vntounto the way of truth, but ſinne of malice, and Tyndall.of profeſſiō. And therfore as they hauehave no power to repent, euen ſo can they The Popiſh ſpiritualitie are tyr…unts & perſecutorsnot but perſecute both him that rebuketh them and his doctrine to, after the enſamples of the Phariſeis and all tyrauntes that begunne before, namely, if the preacher touch any ground wher by they ſhould be reformed, or by what meanes they maintaine their miſchief.

The ſecond Chapter.

MOre. A Fryers liuing that hath maryed More.a Nunne, maketh it eaſie to know that his doctrine is not good.

Tyndall. The profeſſion of either other Tyndall.is plaine Idolatry, and deceauing of a mās ſoule and robbing him of his good, and taken vponupon them ignoraūtly therto. Wherfore when they be come vntounto the knowledge of the truth, they ought no longer therein to abyde, but the Popes forbyddyng Matrimony p. 320and to eate of meates created of God Pope forbiddeth matrimony & the eatyng of meates.for mans vſe, which is deuilliſhe doctrine by Paules propheſie, hys geuing licence to hold whores, his continuall occupiyng of Princes in ſhedding of Chriſten bloud, his robbing of y^e poore thoroughout Chriſtendome of all that was geuen to maintaine them, his ſetting vp in Rome a ſtues not of womē The wicked & monſtrous doynges of the Pope.onelyonly, but of the male kynde alſo agaynſt nature, and a thouſand abhominations to groſſe for a Turke, are tokens good inough that he is y^e right Antichriſt and his doctrine ſprong of the deuill.

More. In penaunce Martin ſaith there More.needeth no contricion nor ſatisfaction.

Tyndall. Call it repentaunce and thē Tyndall.it is contricion of it ſelfe. And as for mendes making with worldly things, that do to thy brother whom thou haſt offended, and vntounto God offer the repē taunce of thine hart, and the ſatiſfaction of Chriſtes bloud.

M. Tyndall ſaith that the confeſſour More.vttereth the confeſſions of them that be rich. But yet we ſee that both rich and poore keepe whores openly without paying peny.

Tyndall. If they be very rich they Tyndall.be ſuffered, becauſe they may be good defenders of the ſpiritualty, and if they be very poore, becauſe they hauehave no money to pay, or els they fine with one or other ſecretly.

More. Ʋppon that lye Tyndall buildeth More.the deſtruction of the ſacrament of penaunce.

Tyndall. Sacrament is a ſigne ſignifiyng Tyndall.what I ſhould do or beleue, or both. As Baptim is the ſigne of repē taunce, ſignifiyng that I muſt repent All Sacramentes teach vsus what to do, or what to beleue.of euill, and beleue to be ſaued therfrō by the bloud of Chriſt. Now Syr in your penaunce deſcribe vsus which is y^e ſigne and the outward ſacrament, and what is the thing that▪ I muſt do or beleue, and then we will enſearch whether it may be a ſacrament or no.

More. Tyndall ſaith that confeſſion is the worſt inuention that euer was.More.

Tyndall. As ye faſhion it meane I, Tyndall.and of that filthy priapiſhe confeſſion which ye ſpew in the eare wherewyth Eare confeſſion deſtroyeth the bene…ite of Chriſtes bloud.ye exclude y^e forgeuenes that is in Chriſtes bloud for all that repent and beleue therein, and make the people beleue that their ſinnes be neuer forgeuen vntill they be ſhriuen vntounto the Prieſt, and thē for no other cauſe ſaue that they hauehave there tolde them, and for the holy deedes to come which the confeſſour hath enioyned them more pro…itable ofttimes for himſelfe then any man els.

More. Neuer man had grace to ſpie More.that before Tyndall.

Tyndall. Yes very many. For many nacions neuer receaued it. And the Tyndall.Greekes when they had proued it, and ſaw the baudery that folowed of it, put it downe agayne. For which cauſe and to know all ſecretes, and to leade the conſciences captiue, the Pope falſely maintaineth it.

M. What fruit would then come of More.penaunce?

Tyndall.▪ Of your iugglyng terme Tyndall. Repētaūcepenaunce I can not affirme. But of repentaunce would come this fruit, that no man that had it, ſhould ſinne wyllingly, but eueryevery man ſhould continually fight againſt his fleſhe.

More. He teacheth that the ſacrament More.hath no vertue at all, but by faith onelyonly.

Tynd. The fayth of a repēting ſoule Tyndall. Sacramēt.in Chriſtes bloude doth iuſtifie onelyonly. And the ſacramēt ſtandeth in as good ſtead as a liuely preacher. And as the preacher iuſtifieth me not, but my faith in the doctrine: euen ſo the ſigne iuſtifieth not, but the faith in the promiſe which the ſacrament ſignifieth & preacheth. And to preach is all the vertue of the ſacrament. And where the ſacramentes preach not, there they hauehave no vertue at all. And ſir we teach not as ye do, to beleue in the ſacrament or in holy church, but to beleue the ſacrament and holy church.

More. He teacheth that fayth ſuffiſeth More. Fayth.vntounto ſaluation without good workes.

Tyndall. The Scripture ſayth, that Tyndall.aſſoone as a man repenteth of euill, & beleueth in Chriſtes bloud, he obtayneth mercy immediatly, becauſe he ſhould louelove God, and of that louelove do good woorkes, and that he tarieth not in ſinne ſtil till he hauehave done good workes, and then is firſt forgeuen for hys workes ſake, as the Pope beareth his in hand, excluding the vertue of Chriſtes bloud. For a man muſt be firſt reconciled The P… piſtes a… ſlaund…s of the Goſpell.vntounto God by Chriſt and in Gods fauour, yer his workes can be good and pleaſaunt in the ſight of god. But we ſay not as ſome damnably lye on vsus, that we ſhould do euill to be iuſtified by faith, as thou maiſt ſee Rom. iij. how they ſayde of the Apoſtles for like preaching.

M. He calleth it ſacrilege to pleaſe god with good workes.More. Wo… Tyndall▪

Tyndall. To referre the worke vntounto p. 321the perſon of God to buy out thy ſin therewith, is to make an Idole of god or a creature. But if thou refer…e thy worke vntounto thy neighbours profite or taming of thine owne fleſhe, then thou pleaſeſt God therwith.

More. Item that a man can do no good More.woorke.

Tyndall. It is falſe. But he ſayth a Tyndall.man can do no good woorke till he beleue that his ſinnes be forgeuen hym in Chriſt, and till he louelove Gods lawe, and hauehave obtayned grace to woorke with. And then ſayth he that we cā not do our workes ſo perfectly, by the reaſon We can do no good worke except we beleue that our ſinnes are forgeuē in Chriſt.of our corrupte fleſhe, but that there is ſome imper…ectnes therein, as in the workes of them that be not their craftes maſter. Which is yet not reckoned, becauſe they do their good willes, and be ſcholers & goe to ſchole to learne to do better.

M. Item that the good and righteous More. Sinne.man ſinneth alway in doing well.

Tyndall. In all his woorkes there Tyndall.lacketh ſomewhat and is a faulte vntil he do thē with as great louelove vntounto his neighbour as Chriſt did for him and as long as there is more reſiſtaunce in his fleſh then was in Chriſtes, or leſſe hope in God: and then no lenger.

M. Item that no ſinne damneth a man More. Ʋnbel…efe.ſaue vnbeleffe.

Tyndall. What ſoeuer a man hath Tyndall.done, if he repent and beleue in Chriſt, it is forgeuen him. And ſo it foloweth, that no ſinne dāneth ſaue there where there is no belefe.

M. Item that we hauehave no frewill to do More. Frewill.ought therewith, though the grace of God be ioined therto, and that God doth all in vsus both good and bad and we doe but ſuffer as waxe doth of the workemā.

Tyndall. Firſt where hee affirmeth Tyndall.that we ſay, our will is not free to doe good and to helpe to compel the members, when God hath geuen vsus grace to louelove his lawes, is falſe. But we ſay that we hauehave no frewill to captiuate our wittes and vnderſtandyng, for to beleue the pope in what ſoeuer he ſaith without reaſon geuing, when we find in the Scripture contrary teſtimonie, and ſee in hym ſo great falſehead and deedes ſo abhominable and thereto all the ſignes by which the Scripture teacheth vsus to know Antichriſt.

And we affirme that we hauehave no frewill We hauehave no freewill to preuent grace & prepare our ſelues.to preuent God & his grace, & before grace prepare our ſelues thereto, neither cā we conſent vntounto God before grace be come. For vntil god hauehave preuēted vsus & powred y^e ſpirit of his grace into our ſoules, to louelove his lawes, and hath grauē thē in our harts by the outward miniſtration of his true preacher and inward workyng of his ſpirite or by inſpiratiō onelyonly, we know no… God as he is to be knowen nor feele y^e good neſſe or any ſwetneſſe in his law. How then can we conſent thereto▪ Sayth not the text, that we can do no good Math. 12.Matt 12while we be euill, and they which ſeke glorie and to clyme in honour aboue Iohn. 5.John 5their brethren can not beleue the truth, and that whores, theues, murtherers, 1. Cor. 6.1 Cor 6extortioners & ſuch like hauehave no parte in the kyngdome of God & Chriſt nor any felyng therof? And who ſhall take thoſe diſeaſes from them? God onelyonly through his mercy, for they cā not put The hearing of gods word cauſeth repentaunce.of that complection of them ſelues, vntill they be taught to beleue and to fele that it is damnable and to conſent vntounto the contrary liuing.

And vntounto the ſecond part I aunſwere, that in reſpect of God we doe but ſuffer onelyonly and receaue power to Iohn. 19.John 19do all our deedes whether we do good or bad, as Chriſt aunſwered Pylate, that hee could hauehave no power agaynſt him except it were geuen him from aboue, and no more could Iudas neither. There can be no repē taunce in vsus but god doth firſt worke in vsus by hys grace.But in reſpect of y^e thing, wherin or wherwith we worke and ſheade out agayne the power that we hauehave receaued, we woorke actually. As the axe doth nothyng in reſpect of the hād that heweth, ſaue receaue: but in reſpect of the tree that is cut, it worketh actually & powreth out agayne the power that it hath receaued.

M. Item that God is author of good More.and euill: as wel of the euill will of Iudas in betraying Chriſt, as of the good will of Chriſt in ſufferyng his paſſion.

Tyndall. The power wherewith we Tyndall.do good and euill is of God & the will is of God. As y^e power which the murtherer All power that we hauehave to good or euil is of God: But y^e croked and naughty vſage of the ſame is of our owne c…kerd & corrupt n… ture.abuſeth and wherewith he killeth a man vnrighteouſly is of God & the will wherewith he willeth it. But the wickedneſſe of his wil and crokedneſſe or frowardneſſe wherewith hee ſleath vnrighteouſly, to auēge him ſelfe & to ſatiſfie his owne luſtes, & the cauſe why he knoweth not the law of God and conſenteth not to it, whiche law ſhould hauehave informed his will and corrected the crokedneſſe therof and hauehave taught him to vſe his will & his power right, is his blindneſſes fault onelyonly and not Gods. Whiche blindneſſe the deuill hath poyſoned him with.

p. 322M. Item matrimonie is no Sacramēt.More. Matrimonye. Tyndall.

Tyndall. Matrimonie is a ſimilitude of the kyngdome of heauen, as are many thynges mo, like as it appeareth by Chriſt in the Goſpell. But who inſtitute it to be a Sacrament? Or who at his mariage was taught the ſignification of it? Who was euer bound to receaue it in the name of a Sacrament. I Matrimony cā be no Sacramēt except a doctrine be added therunto that the people may know the benefite of Chriſt that we hauehave by matrimonywould to Chriſtes bloud that ye wold make a Sacrament of it vntounto all men and women that be maryed and vntounto all other, and would at eueryevery mariage teach the people to know the benefite of Chriſt through the ſimilitude of Matrimony. And I affirme that in the popes Churche there is no Sacrament. For where no ſignification is, there is no Sacrament. A ſigne is no ſigne vntounto him that vnderſtādeth nought therby: as a ſpech is no ſpech vntounto him that vnderſtādeth it not. I would to Chriſtes paſſion that ye would let them be Sacramentes which Chriſt inſtitute & ordeined for Sacramentes. And then if ye make of your own braynes fiue hū dred therto I would not be ſo greatly greued, though I would not geue my conſent vntounto ſo great a multitude, partly for the bondage, and ſpecially leſt we ſhould in tyme to come, the ſignifications of them loſt, fall into Idolatrie agayne and make holy workes of them, after the exāple of the blindneſſe wherin we be now, but I would hauehave the woorde euer liuely preached out of the playne text.

M. Item that all holy orders bee but More. Orders.mens inuention.

Tyndall. The office of an Apoſtle, Tyndall.Byſhop, Prieſt, Deacon, and Widow, are of God: But as concerning the ſhanyng, the oylyng and diuerſitie of rayment and many degrees ſence added therto, proue that they be but mens traditions. But and ye will make Sacramentes No Sacrament is w^t out ſignification.of the oylyng, ſhanyng, ſheryng, and garmentes, put their ſignifications vntounto them and let the kyngs grace compell them to keepe them and I admitte them for Sacramentes, and vntill that tyme I hold them for the falſe ſignes of hypocrites.

M. Itēm that eueryevery man and woman More. Cōſecrate.is a Prieſt and maye conſecrate the body of Chriſt.

Tyndall. In bodyly ſeruice if the officer Tyndall.appoynted be away, eueryevery other perſon not onelyonly may, but alſo is boūd to helpe at neede, euen ſo much as hys neighbours dogge. How much more then ought men to aſſiſte one an other in the health of their ſoules, at al times of nede? if the man be away, the womā may and is bound to Baptiſe in tyme of nede, by the law of louelove, which office perteineth vntounto the prieſt onelyonly. If ſhe be Lady ouer the greateſt ordeined by God, that ſhe may Baptiſe, why ſhuld Womē that are vertuous and diſcrete may in caſes of neceſſitie miniſter the Sacramentes as well as the Prieſt.ſhe not hauehave power alſo ouer the leſſe, to miniſter the ceremonies whiche the Pope hath added to, as his oyle, his ſalt, his ſpitell, his candle and creſomcloth? And why might ſhe not pray all the prayers, except that Idole the pope be greater then the very God? if womē had brought a child to Church & while the Prieſt & other men taryed the child were in ieoperdy, might they not baptiſe him in the font, if there were no other water by? And if other water were by, yet if that holpe better one mite, louelove requireth to baptiſe him therin. And then why might not women touch all their other oyle? If a woman learned in Chriſt were driuen vntounto an Ile where Chriſt was neuer preached, might ſhe not there preach and teach to miniſter the Sacraments and make officers? The caſe is poſſible, ſhew thē what ſhould let that ſhe might not? louelove thy neighbour as thy ſelfe doth cō pel. Nay, ſhe may not conſecrat. Why? If the pope loued vsus as wel as Chriſt, hee would finde no faulte therewith, though a womā at nede miniſtred that Sacrament if it bee ſo neceſſary as ye make it. In bodyly wealth, he that would hauehave me one ace leſſe then hymſelfe, loueth me not as well as himſelfe how much more ought we to louelove one an other in thynges pertainyng vntounto the ſoule?

M. Item that the hoſt is no ſacrifice.More. Sacrifice. Tyndall.

Tyndall. Chriſt is no more killed. It is therfore the Sacrament ſigne & memoriall of that ſacrifice wherewith Chriſt offered his body for our ſinnes and commaūded ſaying, this do in the remembraunce of me. We be not holpe with any viſible deede that the Prieſt there doth, ſaue in that it putteth vsus in remembraunce of Chriſtes death & paſſion for our ſinnes. As the garmentes and ſtraunge holy geſtures, helpe vsus not, but in that they put vsus in remembraunce of thyngs that Chriſt ſuffered for vsus in his paſſion. Euen ſo the ſhewyng, breakyng, and eatyng of the hoſt, the ſhewyng and drinkyng of the cup of Chriſtes bloud, and the wordes and the conſecration, helpe vsus not a pinne, nor are gods ſeruice, ſaue onelyonly in that they ſtyrre vp our repentyng fayth to p. 323call to mynde the death and paſſion of Chriſt for our ſinnes. And therfore to call it a ſacrifice, is but abuſed ſpeach, In enſample.as when we call one that is new come home to breakfaſt and ſet a Capon before him and ſay, this is your welcome home, meaning yet by that ſpeach, that it is but a ſigne of y^e louelove of myne hart The ſupper of the Lord is geuen vsus to be a memoriall of his death once offered for all.which reioyſeth and is glad that he is come home ſafe and ſounde. And euen ſo is this but the memoriall of the very ſacrifice of Chriſt once done for al. And if ye wold no otherwiſe meane, ye ſhal hauehave my good will to call it ſo ſtill, or if ye can ſhew me a reaſon of ſome other meanyng. And therfore I would that it had bene called (as it in deede is and as it was commaūded to be) Chriſtes Chriſtes memoriall Maſſe.memoriall, though that I doubt not but that it was called Maſſe of his He brue woord Miſach, which ſignifieth a a penſion geuyng, becauſe that at eueryevery Maſſe, mē gaue eueryevery man a portiō accordyng vntounto his power vntounto the in ſtentation of the poore. Which offering yet remayneth. But to a falſe vſe and profite of them that hauehave too much, as all other thinges are peruerted.

Finally it is the ſame thinge that it was when Chriſt inſtitute it at hys laſt ſupper. If it were then the very ſacrificing of Chriſtes body, and had that ſame vertue and power with it that his very paſſion after wrought, why was he ſacrificed ſo cruelly on the morow, and not holde excuſed therwyth, ſeyng he was there verely ſacrificed?

M. Item that there remayneth bread More. Bread.and wine in the ſacrament

Tyndall. Improue it. What is that Tyndall.that is broken, and that the Prieſt eateth wyth hys teeth, ayre onelyonly? if a childe were fed with no other foode he ſhould wax haply as long as his father. Wherof then ſhould his body, his fleſh and bones grow? wherof ſhould that come (with reuerence I ſpeake it) that he piſſeth and ſo forth? all by miracle will they ſay. O what wonderfull miracles muſt we faine to ſaue Antichriſtes doctrine, I might wyth as The corrupt and vayne diſputations of men to proue chriſt to be really in the Sacrament.good reaſon ſay that the hoſte is neyther rounde nor white, but that as my mouth is deceaued in the taſt of bread, euen ſo mine eyes are in the ſyght of roundnes, and ſo is there nothing at all. Which all are but the diſputations of men with corrupt myndes, without ſpirite to iudge. Neuer the later when the Prieſt hath once rehearſed the teſtament of our ſauiour thereon. I looke not on bread and wine, but on the body of Chriſt broken, and bloud ſhed for my ſinnes, and by that fayth am I ſaued from the damnation of my ſinnes. Neyther come I to Maſſe for any other purpoſe then to fet forgeuenes for Chriſtes deathes ſake, nor for any other purpoſe ſay I Confiteor, & knowledge my ſinnes at the beginning of Maſſe. And if ye hauehave other doctrine, teach vsus a reaſon & leade vsus in light, & we will follow. Chriſt ſayth Iohn. xi. Iohn. …it is the ſpirit that quickeneth, the fleſh profiteth nothing at all, the woordes which I ſpeake ſaith he are ſpirite and lyfe. That is, the fleſhely eatyng and drinking of Chriſtes body and bloude profit not, as his carnall preſence profited not, by the reaſon of his preſence onelyonly, as ye ſee by Iudas and y^• Phariſeis, and the ſouldiours that touched hym, and how his bodely preſence did let the diſciples to vnderſtand ſpiritually. But to eate and drinke in the ſpirite, that is, to harken vntounto his wordes, and with a repenting hart to beleue in hys death, bringeth vsus all that Chriſt can do for vsus.

More. Item that the maſſe auaileth no More. Maſſe.man but the Prieſt.

Tyndall. If ye ſpeake of the prayers, Tyndall.his prayers helpe vsus as much as ours him. If ye ſpeake of y^e ſacramēt, The Sacrament of Chriſtes body when it is faithfully miniſtred doth profite as many as do beleue in Chriſtes death.it helpeth as many as be preſent as much as hym, if moued therby they be leue in Chriſtes death as well as he. If they be abſent, the ſacrament profiteth them as much as a ſermon made in the church helpeth them that be in y^• fieldes. And how profiteth it the ſoules of the deade tell me, vntounto whome it is no ſigne?

If ye meane the carnall eating and drinking, then it profiteth the Prieſte onelyonly, for he eateth and drinketh vppe all alone, and geueth no man parte wyth hym.

More. Item that a man ſhould not be More.howſeled till he lay a dying.

Tynd. That is to ſhameleſſe a lye.Tyndall.

M. Item that men and women ſhould More. Touch. Tyndall.not ſpare to touch it.

Tynd. A perillous caſe. Why? Becauſe the Pope hath not oyled them. Neuertheleſſe Chriſt hath annointed them wyth hys ſpirite and wyth hys bloud. But wot ye why? The Pope thinketh if they ſhould be too buſie in handeling it, they woulde beleue that there were bread, and for that cauſe to ſtrength their faythes, he hath imagined little prety thinne manchetes that ſhine thorow, and ſeeme more lyke to p. 324be made of paper or fine Parchement then of wheate floure. About which was no ſmale queſtion in Oxforde of late dayes, whether it were bread or none: ſome affirming that the floure with long lying in water was turned to ſtarch, and had loſt his nature.

M. Item that the ſacramēt ſhould not More. Worſhip.be worſhipped.

Tyndall. It is the Sacrament of Tyndall.Chriſtes body and bloud. And Chriſt calleth it the newe and euerlaſting teſtament in hys bloud, and commaunded that we ſhoulde ſo do in the remembraunce of hym, that hys bodye was broken and his bloude ſhed for our ſinnes. And Paule commaundeth thereby to ſhewe or preach the Lords death. They ſay not pray to it, neither put any fayth therein. For I may not beleue in the ſacramēt, but I muſt beleue The true worſhipping of the Sacramēt, is to beleue that it is a true ſigne that Chriſt ſuffered death for vsus.the Sacrament, that it is a true ſigne, and it true that is ſignified therby (which is the onelyonly worſhippyng of the Sacrament, if ye geue it other worſhip ye plainly diſhonour it). As I may not beleue in Chriſtes Church, but beleue Chriſtes Church, that the doctrine which they preach of Chriſt is true. If ye hauehave any other doctrine, teach vsus a reaſon and lead vsus in light, and we will follow.

More. Item that a Chriſtē is not bound to keepe any lawe made by man or any More.at all.

Tynd. You ſay vntruely: a Chriſtē man is bound to obey tyranny: if it be Tyndall.not agaynſt hys fayth nor the lawe of God, vntill God deliuer him thereof. But he is no Chriſten man that byndeth hym to any thing ſaue that which louelove and his neighbours neceſſitie requireth of them.

And when a lawe made, is no longer profitable, Chriſten rulers ought to breake it. But now a dayes whē tyraunts hauehave gotten the ſimple people vnderunder, they compell thē to ſerue theyr luſtes and wyly tyranny, without reſpect of any common wealth. Which wyly tyranny, becauſe the truth rebuketh it, is the cauſe why they perſecute it, leaſt the common people ſeing how good they ſhould be, and feeling how wicked they are, ſhuld withdraw their neckes frō their vnrighteous yooke. As ye hauehave enſample in Herode, in the Scribes and Phariſeis, and in many other.

More. Item that there is no Purgatory.More. Purgatory

Tyndall. Beleue in Chriſt and thou Tyndall.ſhalt ſhortly finde purgatoryes inow, as ye now make other feele.

M. Item that all ſoules lye and ſleepe More. Soules ſleepe. Tyndall.till domes day.

Tyndall. And ye in putting them in heauen, hell, and purgatory, deſtroy y^e argumentes wherwith Chriſt & Paul proue the reſurrection. What God doth with them, that ſhall we know when we come to them. The true faith The ſoules departed reſt at Gods will & pleaſure.putteth the reſurrection which we be warned to looke for eueryevery houre. The Heathen Philoſophers denying that, did put that the ſoules did euer lyue. And the Pope ioyneth the ſpirituall doctrine of Chriſt and the fleſhly doctrine of philoſophers together, things ſo contrary that they can not agree, no more then the ſpirite and the fleſhe do in a Chriſten man. And becauſe the fleſhly mynded Pope conſenteth vntounto heathen doctrine, therefore he corrupteth the ſcripture to ſtabliſh it. Moſes ſayth in Deut. the ſecrete thinges pertaine Deut. 2….Deut 2vntounto the Lord, and the thynges that be opened pertaine vntounto vsus, that we do all that is written in the booke. Wherfore Sir if we loued the lawes of God and would occupy our ſelues to fulfill them, and woulde on the other ſide be meeke and let God alone wyth hys ſecretes and ſuffer him to be wiſer then we, we ſhould make none article of the faith of this or that. And againe, if the ſoules be in heauen, tell me why they be not in as good caſe as the Angels be? And then what cauſe is there of the reſurrection?

M. Item no man ſhall pray to ſaintes.More. Saintes. Tyndall.

Tyndall. When ye ſpeake wyth ſaintes that be departed, it is not euill to put them in remembraunce to pray for you.

M. Why do they not heare vsus?More.

Tyndall. If they louelove you ſo feruētly Tyndall.and be ſo great with God, why certifie they you not, that they ſo do?

More. So they do in that we feele our More.peticions graunted.

Tyndall. God ſaued the olde Idolaters Tyndall.with worldly ſaluacion, and gaue them their peticions, which they yet aſked of their Idoles, as ye ſee thorow out all the olde teſtament. God heareth the crowes, foules, beaſtes, and wormes of the earth, as the text ſaith, men and beaſtes doth God ſaue, which beaſtes yet pray not to God.

The Iewes and Turkes doth god ſaue in this worlde, and geueth them their worldly peticions, which yet worſhip not God, as his godly nature is p. 325to be worſhipped but after their owne Saintes are not to be called vponupon, for we hauehave no promiſe nor aſſuraunce that either they heare vsus or can profite vsus.imagination: not in the ſpirite wyth fayth, hope, and louelove, but wyth bodely ſeruice as the Pope doth. As the popiſhe ſerue S. Appoline for the tooth ache and are healed: euen ſo the Iewes and Turkes be healed and pray not to her, but ſerue God after an other maner for the ſame diſeaſe. So that God doth ſaue in this world all that keepe y^• worldely lawes worldely, that is to wete, outwarde in the body for bodely rewarde and not in the hart of louelove that ſpringeth out of the mercy that God hath geuen vsus in Chriſt, which ſame, though they be Turkes, if they breake the worldly lawes, he rebuketh them, as the Niniuites and puniſheth them diuerſly. And if they knowledge their ſinne and mende, he healeeh them agayne. But and if they harden and ſinne as beaſtes, and will not amend, he deſtroyeth them vtterly as the Sodomites. And yet all ſuch hauehave no part in the life to come.

But with his children in whoſe hartes he writeth the fayth of hys ſonne The children of god are obediēt to hys lawes.Ieſus and the louelove of his lawes, he goeth otherwiſe to worke hys lawes in their will: and their peticions are his honour & their neighbours welth: and that he will prouide them of all thinges neceſſary vntounto this life, and gouerne them that their hartes be not ouercome of euill. And he heareth thē vntounto his honour and their euerlaſting ſaluation, and purgeth them and teacheth them thinges wherof the popiſh and all they whoſe hartes the God of this world hath blynded, to ſerue God with workes, hath no feelyng.

And when he ſayth, that the Emperour Images.and that coūſell which decreed that Images for the abuſe ſhould be put out of the church, were heretikes. It is much eaſier ſo to ſay, then ſo to proue. Ʋnderſtand therefore, that Images were not yet receaued in the Churche in the tyme of S. Hierome, at the leaſt waye generally, whether in ſome one Hierome.place or no, I can not tell. For S. Hierome rehearſeth of one Epiphanius a Byſhop in the countrey of Cipres, & that the moſt perfect of all y^e Byſhops of hys tyme, how that the ſayd Epiphanius Images were not allowed in the primitiue church& the Byſhop of Ieruſalem went together to Bethell, & by the way they entred into a Churche for to pray and there found a vayle hāgyng before the doore and an image: paynted thereon, as it had bene of Chriſt or ſome Saint. For the Byſhop was ſo moued therwith becauſe ſayth S. Hierome, that it Epiphanius cut the Image.was contrary to the Scripture, that he cut & counſeled to bury ſome dead ther in, and ſent an other cloth to hāg in the ſtede. And afterward when they were crept in a litle and litle: there was no woorſhyppyng of them, at the leaſt waye generally vntill the tyme of S. Gregory.

In ſo much that when Cirenus the Byſhop of Maſſilia offēded with the ſuperſtitiouſnes of the people burnt thē, S. Gregory wrote that he ſhould not deſtroy Gregory Cirenus.the Images, but teach onelyonly that the people ſhould not worſhyp them. But whē it was ſo farre come that the people worſhypped them with a falſe fayth (as we now know no other vſe) and were no longer memorials onelyonly, then the Byſhops of Grece & the Emperour A Councel gathered in Grece dyd put downe all Images.gathered them together, to prouide a remedy agaynſt that miſchief & cōcluded that they ſhould be put down for the abuſe, thinkyng it ſo moſt expedient, hauyng for them, firſt the example of God whom a man may boldly folow, which commaunded in the begynning of all his preceptes, that there ſhould be no image vſed to worſhip or pray before, not for the Image it ſelfe, but for the weakeneſſe of hys people: and hauyng agayne before their eyes, that the people were fallen vntounto Idolatrie and imageſeruyng by the reaſon of them.

Now aunſwere me, by what reaſon cauſt thou make an hereticke of hym, that concludeth nought agaynſt God, but worketh with God & putteth that blocke out of the way, where at his brother the price of Chriſtes bloud ſrō bleth and loſeth his ſoule. They put not downe the images for hate of God and of his Saintes, no more then Ezechias brake the braſen Serpēt for enuy Ezechias.of the great miracle that was wrought by it, or in ſpite of God that commaū ded it to be kept for a memoriall. But to kepe the people in the true faith onelyonly. Now ſeyng we may be all without Images are not to be had in Churches.images & to put them downe is not againſt Gods cōmaūdemēt but with it, namely if they be abuſed, to the diſhonour of God and hurt of our neighbours, where is charitie, if thou which knoweſt the truth and cauſt vſe thyne image wel, wilt not yet forbeare thyne image and ſuffer it to be put out of the way, for thy weake brothers ſake whō thou ſeeſt periſh there through? yea & what thyng maketh both the Turke & p. 326the Iew abhorre our fayth ſo much as our imageſeruice? But the Pope was then glad to finde an occaſion to picke a quarell with the Emperour, to get the Empire into hys owne handes, which thyng he brought to paſſe with the ſword of Fraunce & clame ſo highe that euerſence he hath put his own authoritie in ſtede of Gods word in eueryevery generall Councell and hath concluded what him liſte, as agaynſt all gods word and agaynſt all charitie he condemned that bleſſed dede of that Councell and Emperour.

M. They blaſpheme our Lady and all More. Our Lady.Saintes.

Tyndall. That is vntrue. We honour Tyndall.our bleſſed Lady and all holye Saintes and folow their fayth and liuing vntounto the vttermoſt of our power and ſubmit our ſelues to be ſcholers of the ſame ſchole.

M. They may not abyde Salue regina.More. Salue Regina. Tyndall▪

Tyndall. For therin is much blaſphe mie vntounto our bleſſed Lady, becauſe Chriſt is our hope and lyſe onelyonly and not ſhe. And ye in aſcribyng vntounto her that ſhe is not, diſhonour God & worſhyp her not.

M. They ſay if a woman beyng alyue Mors.beleue in God and louelove him as much as our Lady, ſhe may helpe with her prayers as much as our Lady.

Tyndall. Tell why not. Chriſt whē Tyndall.it was told him that his mother & his brethren ſought him, aunſwered, that his mother, his ſiſters and his brethrē Math. 12.Matt 12were all they that did his fathers will. And vntounto y^e womā that ſayd to Chriſt, bleſſed be the wombe that bare the and pappes that gaue thee ſucke, Chriſt anſwered, Nay bleſſed are they that heare Luke. 1….Luke 1the word of God & keepe it. As Paule ſayth. 1. Cor. ix. I hauehave nought to reioyce though I preach, for neceſſitie lyeth vponupon me, and wo is me, if I preach not. If I do it vnwillingly, an office The prayers of all good womē are aſwell accepted of God as the prayers of our Lady.is committed vntounto me, but and if I do it with a good will, then I hauehave a reward. So now carnall bearyng of Chriſt and carnall geuyng hym ſucke make not our Lady great. But our bleſſed Ladyes greatneſſe is her fayth and louelove wherein ſhe exceeded other. Wherfore if God gaue his mercy that an other woman were in thoſe twoo poyntes equall with her, why were ſhe not like great and her prayers as much heard.

M. Item that men ſhould not worſhip More. Croſſe. Tyndall.the holy croſſe.

Tyndall. With no falſe worſhip and ſuperſtitious fayth, but as I hauehave ſaid, to hauehave it in reuerence for the memoriall of him that dyed theron.

M. Item Luther hateth the feſtes of the More.croſſe and of Corpus Chriſti.

Tyndall. Not for enuy of the croſſe Tyndall.which ſinned not in the death of Chriſt nor of malice toward the bleſſed body of Chriſt, but for the idolatrie vſed in thoſe feſtes.

M. Item that no man or woman is bound to kepe any vow.More. Ʋow. Tyndall.

Tyndall. Lawfull vowes are to be kept vntill neceſſitie breake them. But vnlawful vowes are to be broken immediatly.

M. Martine appealed vntounto the next generall Councell that ſhould bee gathered More. Martine. Tyndall.in the holy ghoſt, to ſeke a long delay.

Tyndall. Of a truth that were a lōg delay. For ſhould Martine liue, till the Pope would gather a Councell in the holy ghoſt or for any godly purpoſe, he were like to be for eueryevery heere of hys head a thouſand yeares old.

Then bringeth he in the inconſtancie of Martine, becauſe he ſaith in his later Martine.booke, how that he ſeeth further then in his firſt. Paraduenture, he is kynne to our Doctours whiche when with preachyng agaynſte pluralities All falſehode is not eſpyed on in one ….they hauehave got them thre or foure benefices, alledge the ſame excuſe. But yet to ſay the truth the very Apoſtles of Chriſt learned not all truth in one day. For long after the Aſcention they wiſt not that the heathē ſhould be receaued vntounto the fayth. How then could Martin (brought vp in the blyndneſſe of your ſect aboue xl. yeares) ſpye out all your falſehead in one day.

M. Martine offered at Wormes before More.the Emperour and all the Lordes of Germany, to abyde by his booke and to diſpute, which he might well doe, ſithens he had his ſafe conduct that he ſhould hauehave no bodyly harme.

Tyndal. O mercyful God, how come Tyndall.ye out your owne ſhame? ye cā not diſpute except ye hauehave a mā in your owne daunger to do hym bodyly harme, to diote him after your faſhion, to tormēt him and to murther him. If ye might hauehave had him at your pleaſure, ye wold hauehave diſputed with him: firſt with ſophiſtrie and corrupting the Scripture: ☜then with offeryng hym promotions: thē with the ſword. So that ye would hauehave bene ſure, to hauehave ouercome hym with one Argument or other.

M. He would agree on no Iudges.More. Martine. Tyndall.

Tyndall. What Iudges offered ye p. 327hym, ſane blynd Byſhops and Cardinals, enemyes of all truth, whoſe promotions and dignities they feare to be plucked from them, if the truth came to light, or ſuch Iudaſes as they had corrupt with money to maynteine their ſect? The Apoſtles might hauehave admitted as well the heathen Biſhops of Idoles to hauehave bene their iudges as he them. But he offered you autenticke Scripture and the hartes of the whole world. Which ij. iudges, if ye had good conſciēces and truſt in God, ye would not hauehave refuſed.

The iiij. Chapter.

THe fourth Chapter is not the firſt Poetrie that he hath fayned.

The v. Chapter.

IN the end of the fift he vntruly reporteth, that Martine ſayth, no man is bound to kepe any vowe. Lawfull promiſes are to be kept; and vnlawfull to he broken.

The vj. Chapter.

IN the beginning of the vj. he deſcribeth Martine after the example of his own nature, as in other places he deſcribeth God after the complection of Popes, Cardinals & worldly tyraūts.

M. Martin will abyde, but by the Scripture More. Martin.onelyonly.

Tyndall. And ye will come at no ſcripture Tyndall▪onelyonly: And as for the old doctours ye will heare as litle; ſaue where it pleaſeth you, for all your crying, old holy fathers. For tell me this, why hauehave ye in England condēned the vnion Vn…n.of Doctours, but becauſe ye would not hauehave your falſhead diſcloſed by the doctrine of them.

M. They ſay, that a Chriſten man is diſcharged of all lawes ſpirituall and temporall More.ſaue the Goſpell.

Tyndall. Ye iuggle, we ſay that no Tyndall.Chriſten man ought to bynde his brother violently, vntounto any law wherof he could not geue a reaſon out of Chriſtes doctrine and out of y^e law of louelove. And on the other ſide we ſay, that a How far a Chriſten man is bounde to ſuffer.Chriſten man is called to ſuffer wrong and tyranny (though no man ought to bynde hym) vntill God rid vsus therof: ſo farre yet as the tyranny is not directly agaynſt the law of God and fayth of Chriſt, and no further.

More. Martin was the cauſe of the deſtruction of the vplandiſh people of Germanie.More.

Tyndall. That is falſe, for then he Tyndall.coulde not hauehave eſcaped himſelfe. Martin was as much the cauſe of their cō fuſion, as Chriſt of the deſtruction of Ieruſalem. The Duke elector of Saxon came from the warre of thoſe vplandiſhe people and other Dukes with him into Wittenberge where Martin is, with xv. hundred men of armes, ſo that Martin if he had bene giltie, coulde not hauehave gonne quite. And therto all the Dukes and Lordes that cleaue vntounto the word of God this day, were no leſſe cumbred with theyr common people then other men.

Then after the loudeſt maner he ſetteth out the cruelnes of the Emperors ſouldiours which they vſed at Rome: but he maketh no mention of the treaſon which holy church wrought ſecretly, wherwith the men of warre were ſo ſet on fire.

The viij. Chapter.

M. What good deede will he do, that More.beleueth Martin, how that we hauehave no frewill to do any good with the helpe of grace.

Tyndall. O Poete without ſhame.Tyndall. More.

More. What harme ſhall he care to forbeare, that beleueth Luther, how god alone; without our will worketh all the miſchiefe that they do.

Tyndall. O naturall ſonne of the father Tyndall.of all lies.

More. What ſhall he care, how long More.he liue in ſinne that beleueth Luther, that he ſhall after this life feele neyther good nor euill in bodye nor ſoule vntyll the day of dome?

Tyndall. Chriſt and hys Apoſtles Tyndall.taught no other, but warned to looke for Chriſtes comming agayne eueryevery houre. Which comming agayne; becauſe ye beleue will neuer be, therfore hauehave ye fayned that other marchaundiſe.

M. Martins bookes be open, if ye will More.not beleue vsus.

Tyndall. Nay, ye hauehave ſhut them Tyndall.vp, and therefore be bolde to ſay what ye luſte.

M. They liue as they teach, and teach More.as they liue.

Tyndall. But neither teach nor lyue Tyndall.as other lye on them.

The ix. Chapter.

M. Though the Turke offer pleaſures vntounto the receauers, and death vntounto More.the refuſers of his ſecte (as the Pope doth) yet he ſuffereth none to breake their promiſes of chaſtitie dedicate to p. 328God (though haply they vſe no ſuch vowes, and as the Pope wil not except it be for money) but Luther teacheth to breake holy vowes.

Tyndall. Luther teacheth that vnlaw Tyndall.full vowes grounded on a falſe fayth vntounto the diſhonouring of God are to Vnlawfull vowes are not to be obſerued.be broken and no other. And agayne, conſtrayned ſeruice pleaſeth not God. And thirdly, your Pope geueth licēce and his bleſſing to breake all lawfull vowes, but with the moſt vnlawfull of all will ye not diſpence.

Then he bringeth forth the enſample of the heathen, to confirme the Popes chaſtitie. And no wrong, for the ſame falſe imagination that the heathē had in theirs, hath the Pope in hys. Ʋnderſtand therfore, if thou vow any indifferent thing, to pleaſe God in his Vowes.owne perſon, he receaueth not thyne Idolatrie: for hys pleaſure & honour is, that thou ſhouldeſt be as he hath made thee, and ſhouldeſt receaue all ſuch thinges of his hand and vſe them ſo farforth as they were needfull, and geue him thankes, and be bounde to hym: and not that thou ſhouldeſt be as thou haddeſt made thy ſelfe, & that he ſhould receaue ſuch thinges of thee to be bounde to thee, to thanke thee & rewarde thee. And agayne, thou muſt geue me a reaſon of thy vow out of the worde of God. Moreouer when thou All vowes are to be made wyth great aduiſement.voweſt lawfully, thou maiſt not do it preciſely, but alway except, if thyne owne or thy neighbours neceſſitie required the contrary. As if thou haddeſt vowed neuer to eate fleſhe, or drinke wine, or ſtronge drinke, to tame thy fleſhe, and thou afterwarde felleſt in diſeaſe ſo that thy body in that behalfe were to tame, or that there coulde no other ſuſtinaunce be gotten. Thā thou muſt interprete ſuche caſes excepte, though thou madeſt no mention of them at the making of thy vow. Some man woulde ſay, other ſhifte might be made: What then? If other drinke as We m…ſt vſe Gods creatures for our nec…e.hoate as wine and of the ſame operation, and other meate of the ſame power and vertue as fleſhe is, muſt be had, why ſhouldeſt thou forſweare wine or fleſhe, ſeing it is now no longer for the taming of thy body. And ſo forth of all other, as I hauehave aboue declared.

And when he bringeth in the Apoſtles, martyrs, confeſſours, and xv. hundred yeares, it is cleane contrary. For they had no ſuch falſe imagination of chaſtity or of any other worke: but they vſed it to ſerue their neighbour and to All our abſtinence & chaſtiſing of our ſelues, is to our owne profite.auoyde trouble in time of perſecution, and to be eaſed of that burthen that was to heauy for their weake ſhoulders, and not to cōpell God to thāke them for that libertie for which they be bound to thanke hym.

The tenth Chapter.

IN the tenth he inueyeth and rayleth againſt that which neither he nor any Freewi…t.fleſhly mynded Papiſte can vnderſtand; as they hauehave no power to cōſent vntounto the lawes of God, which herein appeareth, that they compell their brethren which be as good as they, to do and beleue what they luſt, & not what God commaundeth. He affirmeth that Martin ſayth, how that we do no ſinne our ſelues with our owne will, but that More blaſphemeth God.God ſinneth in vsus, and vſeth vsus as a dead inſtrument, and forceth vsus therunto and dāneth vsus, not for our owne deedes but for his, and for his owne pleaſure, as he compelleth vntounto ſinne for his pleaſure or rather he for hys pleaſure ſinneth in vsus. I ſay, that a man ſinneth voluntarily, but the power of the will and of the deede is of God, and eueryevery will and deede are good in the nature of the deede, and the euilneſſe is a lacke that there is, as the eye, though it be blinde is good in nature, in that it is ſuch a member created for ſuch a good vſe: but it is called euill for lacke of ſight. And ſo are our deedes euill becauſe we Our dedes are euill, becauſe we lacke know ledge to referre them vntounto the glory of God.lacke knowledge and louelove to referre them vntounto the glory of God. Which lacke commeth of the deuill that blyndeth vsus with luſtes and occaſions that we can not ſee the goodneſſe and righteouſnes of the law of God & the meanes how to fulfill it. For could we ſee it, and the way to do it, we ſhould louelove it naturally as a childe doth a fayre apple. For a childe whē as a mā ſheweth him a fayre apple, and will not geue it hym weepeth, ſo ſhould we naturally mourne when the members woulde not come forwarde to fulfill the lawe according to the deſire of our hartes. For Paule ſayth. ij. Cor. iiij. If our 2. Cor. 4.2 Cor 4Goſpell be hid, it is hid vntounto thē that periſhe, among which the God of this world hath blynded the wittes of the vnbeleuers, that the light of the glorious goſpell of Chriſt ſhould not ſhine The deuill is the blinder & kepee of vsus frō y^• vnderſtanding of gods wyll.to them. And Chriſt ſayth that the birdes eate vp the ſeede ſowen vppon the way, and interpreteth by the ſeede the worde, and by the foules, the deuill. So that the deuill blindeth vsus wyth p. 329falſhead and lyes which is our worldly The deuill is the blinde… and keper of vsus from the vnderſtandyng of Gods wil.wiſdome, and therewith ſtoppeth out the true light of Gods wiſdome, which blindenes is the euilneſſe of all our deedes.

And on the other ſide, that an other man loueth the lawes of God and vſeth y^e power that he hath of god well, and referreth hys will and his deedes vntounto the honour of God, commeth of the mercy of God which hath opened his wittes, and ſhewed him light to ſee the goodnes and righteouſnes of the lawe of God, and the way that is in Chriſt to fulfill it, wherby he loueth it naturally and truſteth to do it. Why doth God open one mans eyes & not an others? Paule Rom. ix. forbiddeth to aſke why. For it is to deepe for mās We may not be curious to ſearch gods ſecretes.capacitie. God we ſee is honoured therby, and his mercy ſet out, and the more ſeene in the veſſels of mercy. But the popiſhe can ſuffer God to hauehave no ſecret hid to himſelfe. They hauehave ſearched to come to the botome of hys botomleſſe wiſdome, and becauſe they cā not attayne to that ſecrete and be to proude to let it alone, and to graunt themſelues ignoraūt with the Apoſtle that knew no other then Gods glory A Papiſticall opiniō.in the elect, they go and ſet vp freewill with the heathen philoſophers, and ſay that a mans freewill is the cauſe why God chuſeth one and not an other, cō trary vntounto all the ſcripture. Paul ſaith it commeth not of the will nor of the deede, but of the mercy of God. And they ſay that eueryevery man hath at y^e leaſt way power in his freewill, to deſerue that power ſhoulde be geuen hym of god to kepe the law. But the ſcripture teſtifieth that Chriſt hath deſerued for y^• elect, euen thē whē they hated God, that their eyes ſhould be opened to ſee the goodnes of the lawe of God, and the way to fulfill it, and forgeuenes of all that is paſſed, wherby they be drawen to louelove it and to hate ſinne.

I aſke the popiſhe one queſtion whether the will can preuent a mans witte Witte, reaſon, & iudgement goeth before will.and make the witte ſee the righteouſneſſe of the lawe, and the way to fulfill it in Chriſt? If I muſt firſt ſee the reaſon why yer I can louelove, how ſhall I with my will do that good thing that I know not of? how ſhall I thanke God for the mercy that is layde vp for me in Chriſt, yer I beleue it. For I muſt beleue the mercy yer I can louelove the worke. Now fayth commeth not of our frewill, but is the grace of God geuen vsus by grace yer there be any will in our hartes to do the lawe of Faith is the gift of God & commeth not by free wil.God. And why God geueth it not eueryevery man I can geue no reckoning of his iudgementes. But well I wot, I neuer deſerued it, nor prepared my ſelf vntounto it, but ranne an other way cleane contrary in my blyndneſſe, and ſought not that way, but he ſought me, and found me out, and ſhewed it me, and therwith drew me to him. And I bow the knees of mine hart vntounto god night and day, that he will ſhew it all other men. And I ſuffer all that I can to be a ſeruaunt to open their eyes.

For well I wot they can not ſee of themſelues before God hauehave preuēted them wyth hys grace. For Paule ſaith Phil. i. he that began a good worke in Phil. 1.Phil 1you ſhall continue or bring it vntounto a full ende, ſo that God muſt beginue to worke in vsus. And Phil. ij. God it is Phil. 2.Phil 2that worketh both the willing and alſo bringing to paſſe. And it muſt needes God is the firſt worker & bringger to paſſe of our well doynges.be, for God muſt open mine eyes, and ſhew me ſomewhat and make me ſee the goodneſſe of it, to draw me to hym, yer I can louelove, conſent, or hauehave any actuall will to come.

And when I am willing, he muſt aſſiſte me and helpe to tame my fleſhe, and to ouercome the occaſions of the worlde, and the power of the fendes. God therfore hath a ſpecial care for his Math. 24.Matt 24elect, in ſo much that he will ſhorten y^e wicked dayes for their ſakes, in which no man, if they ſhould continue might endure. And Paule ſuffereth all for the electe. ij. Timothy. ij. And Gods ſure foundation ſtandeth ſayth Paule, God knoweth hys. So that refuſe the truth who ſhall, God will keepe a nū ber of his mercy, and call them out of blindneſſe; to teſtifie the truth vntounto the reſt, that their damnation may be with out excuſe.

The Turke, the Iew and the Popiſh build vponupon frewill & aſcribe theyr iuſtifying vntounto their woorkes. The Turke when he hath ſynned, runneth to the purifyinges or ceremonies of Mahomet, and the Iew to the ceremonies of Moſes, and the Pope vntounto his owne ceremonies, to fet forgeueneſſe of their ſinnes. And the Chriſten goeth The Chriſtians ſeeke helpe of Chriſt.thorough repentaunce towarde the law, vntounto the fayth that is in Chriſtes bloud.

And the Pope ſaith that the ceremonies of Moyſes iuſtified not, compelled with the woordes of Paule. And how then ſhould his iuſtifie? Moyſes Sacramentes were but ſignes of promiſes p. 330of fayth, by which fayth the beleuers are iuſtified, and euen ſo be Chriſtes alſo. And now becauſe the Iewes hauehave put out the ſignifications of their Sacraments and put their truſt in the workes of them, therfore they be Idolaters, and ſo is the Pope for like purpoſe. The Pope ſayth that Chriſt dyed O abhominable blaſphemy.not for vsus, but for the Sacramentes, to geue them power to iuſtifie. O Antichriſt.

The xj. Chapter.

HIs xj. chapter is as true as his ſtory Doct. Ferman.of Ʋtopia & all his other Poetrie. He meaneth Doctour Ferman perſon of Hony lane. Whō after they had hādled after their ſecret maner and diſputed with ſecretly and had made him ſweare that he ſhould not vtter how he was dealt with, as they hauehave made many other, then they contriued a maner of diſputatiōs had with him, with ſuch oppoſitions, aunſwearynges and argumentes as ſhould ſerue onelyonly to ſet forth their purpoſe. As M. More thoroughout all his booke maketh, quoth Maſter doctour Fermon was a vertuous godly and learned māhe, to diſpute and moue queſtions after ſuch a maner as he can ſoyle them or make them appeare ſoyled, and maketh him graunt where he lyſteth and at the laſt to be concluded and lad whether M. More will hauehave him. Wherfore I wil not rehearſe all the arguments, for it were to long, and is alſo not to be beleued that he ſo made them or ſo diſputed with them, but that they added and pulled away & fayned as they liſte as their guiſe is. But I will declare in light that which M. More ruffeleth vp in darkeneſſe, that ye may ſee their falſhead.

Firſt if ye were not falſe hypocrites, A true note to know hypocrites.why had ye not diſputed openly with him, that the world might hauehave heard and borne recorde, that that whiche ye now ſay of him were true? what cauſe is there that the lay people might not as well hauehave heard his wordes of hys own mouth, as read them of your writyng, except ye were iugglyng ſpirites that walke in darkneſſe?

When M. More ſayth, the Church teacheth that men ſhould not truſt in theyr workes, it is falſe if he meane y^e Popes Church. For they teach a man to truſt in domme ceremonies & Sacramētes, in penaūce and all maner workes that come them to profite, whiche yet helpe not vntounto repentaunce nor to fayth nor to louelove a mans neighbour.

M. More declareth the meanyng of no ſentence, hee deſcribeth the proper ſignification of no word, nor the difference of the ſignificatiōs of any terme, but runneth foorth confuſedly in vnknowen wordes and generall termes. And where one word hath many ſignifications he maketh a man ſome tyme beleue that many thynges are but one thyng, and ſome tyme he leadeth from one ſignification vntounto an other & mocketh a mans wittes. As he iuggleth M. More … a iuggle… with termes.with this terme Church, makyng vsus in the begynnyng vnderſtand all that beleue, and in the concluſion the Prieſtes onelyonly. He telleth not the office of the law, he deſcribeth not his penaūce nor the vertue therof or vſe, he declareth no Sacrament, nor what they meane nor the vſe nor wherin the frute of cō feſſion ſtandeth, nor whence the power of the abſolution commeth, nor wherin it reſteth, nor what iuſtifying meaneth, nor the order nor ſheweth any diuerſitie of faythes, as though all faiths were one fayth and one thyng.

Marke therfore, the way toward iuſtifying or forgeueneſſe of ſinne, is the The order of iuſtifying.law. God cauſeth the law to be preached vntounto vsus & writeth it in our harts and maketh vsus by good reaſons feele that the law is good and ought to bee kept and that they which keepe it not are worthy to be damned. And on the other ſide I fele that there is no power in me, to kepe the law wherupon it would ſhortly folow that I ſhould diſpaire, if I were not ſhortly ho…pe. But A lyuely deſcriptio… of our … fication.God which hath begon to cure me and hath layde that coroſy vntounto my ſores, goeth forth in his cure, and ſetteth hys ſonne Ieſus before me and all his paſſions and death, and ſayth to me: this is my deare ſonne, and he hath prayed for thee & hath ſuffred all this for thee, and for his ſake I will forgeue thee all that thou haſt done agaynſt this good lawe, and I will heale thy fleſh & teach thee to kepe this law, if y^• wilt learne. And I will beare with thee & take all a worth that thou doeſt, till thou cauſt do better. And in the meane ſeaſon, not withſtandyng thy weakeneſſe, I will yet louelove thee no leſſe then I do the aungels in heauen, ſo thou wilt be diligent to learne. And I will aſſiſte thee and keepe thee and defend thee and be thy ſhielde and care for thee.

And the hart here beginneth to mollifie and waxe ſoft & to receaue health and beleueth the mercy of God and in beleuyng is ſaued frō the feare of euerlaſtyng death, and made ſure of euerlaſtyng p. 331life, and then beyng ouercome The great mercy and kindenes of God moueth mā to repētaūce.with this kindneſſe, begynneth to louelove agayne and to ſubmitte her ſelfe vntounto the law of God to learne them and to walke in them.

Note now the order, firſt God geueth me light to ſee the goodneſſe and righteouſneſſe of the law, & myne own ſinne and vnrighteouſneſſe. Out of whiche knowledge ſpryngeth repentaunce. The right order of our iuſtificatiō.Now repentaunce teacheth me not that the law is good, and I euill, but a light that the ſpirite of God hath geuen me, out of whiche light repentaunce ſpringeth.

Then the ſame ſpirite woorketh in myne hart truſt and confidence to beleue the mercy of God and his truth, that he will do as hee hath promiſed. Whiche beleffe ſaueth me. And immediatly out of that truſt ſpryngeth louelove toward the law of God agayne. And what ſoeuer a man worketh of any other louelove thē this it pleaſeth not God, nor is that louelove godly.

Now louelove doth not receaue this mercy but fayth onelyonly, out of whiche fayth louelove ſpringeth, by which louelove I power out agayn vponupon my neighbour that goodneſſe which I hauehave receaued of God by fayth. Hereof ye ſee that I cā not be iuſtified without repentaūce and yet repentaunce iuſtifieth me not. And hereof ye ſee that I can not hauehave a fayth to be iuſtified and ſaued, except louelove ſpryng therof immediatly, and yet louelove iuſtifieth me not before God. For my naturall louelove to God agayne doth not make me firſt ſee & feele the kyndneſſe of God in Chriſt, but fayth thorough preachyng. For we louelove not God firſt, to cōpell him to louelove agayn: but he loued vsus firſt & gaue his ſonne for vsus, that we might ſee louelove and louelove 1. Iohn. 4.1 John 4agayne, ſayth S. Iohn in his firſt Epiſtle. Which louelove of God to vsus ward we receaue by Chriſt thorough fayth ſayth Paule.

And this example hauehave I ſet out for Faith only apprehendeth our iuſtification.them in diuers places, but their blynd Popiſh eyes hauehave no power to ſee it, couetouſneſſe hath ſo blynded them. And when we ſay faith onelyonly iuſtifieth vsus, that is to ſay, receaueth the mercy wherewith God iuſtifieth vsus and forgeueth vsus, we meane not fayth whiche hath no repentaunce and fayth whiche hath no louelove vntounto the lawes of God agayne and vntounto good workes, as wicked hypocrites falſly belye vsus.

For how thē ſhould we ſuffer as we do all miſery, to cal the blind and ignoraūt vntounto repentaunce & good workes which now do but conſent vntounto all euill, and ſtudy miſchief all day long, for all their preachyng their iuſtifying of good woorkes. Let M. More improue this with his ſophiſtrie and ſet foorth his owne doctrine that we may ſee the reaſon of it and walke in light.

Hereof ye ſee what fayth it is that what faith iuſtifieth.iuſtifieth vsus. The fayth in Chriſtes bloud of a repentyng hart toward the law doth iuſtifie vsus onelyonly and not all maner faythes. Ye muſt vnderſtād therfore, that ye may ſee to come out of Mores blynd maze, how that there be many faythes and that all faythes be not one faith, though they be al called with on generall name. There is a ſtory There are diuerſities of faith, and but one faith that iuſtifieth vsus.faith without feelyng in the hart, wher with I may beleue the whole ſtory of the Bible & yet not ſet myne hart earneſtly thereto, takyng it for the fode of my ſoule, to learne to beleue and truſt God, to louelove him dread him and feare him by the doctrine and examples ther of, but to ſeme learned & to know the ſtory, to diſpute and make marchaundiſe, after as we hauehave exāples ynough. And the fayth wherewith a man doth miracles, is an other gift then the faith of a repētyng hart to be ſaued through Chriſtes bloud, and the one no kynne to the other though M. More would hauehave them ſo appeare. Neither is the deuils fayth & the Popes fayth (wherwith they beleue that there is a God & that Chriſt is & all the ſtory of the Bible and may yet ſtond with all wickedneſſe and full cōſent to euil) kynne vntounto the fayth of them that hate euill and repent of their miſdeedes and knowledge their ſinnes and be fled with full hope and truſt of mercy vntounto the bloud of Chriſt.

And when he ſayth, if fayth certifie our hartes that we bee in the fauonr of God and our ſinnes forgeuen, & become Workes.good yer we do good workes, as the tree muſt be firſt good yer it bring forth good fruite, by Chriſtes doctrine, thē we make good workes but a ſhadowe wherewith a man is neuer the better. Nay Sir we make good woorkes, fruites whereby Out of a liuely and iuſtifiyng faith ſpringeth good workes.our neighbour is the better, and whereby God is honoured, and our fleſhe tamed. And we make of them ſure tokēs wherby we know that our fayth is no fayned imagination and dead opinion, made with captiuing our wits after the Popes traditions, but a lyuely thyng wrought by the holy Ghoſt.

p. 337And when he diſputeth, if they that hauehave faith, hauehave louelove vntounto the lawe, and purpoſe to fulfill it, then faith alone iuſtifieth not, how will he proue that argument? Fayth alone iuſtifieth.he iuggleth wyth this worde alone: and would make the people beleue that we ſaid, how a bare faith that is without all other company, of repē taunce, louelove, and other vertues, yea & without Gods ſpirite to, did iuſtifie vsus, ſo that we ſhoulde not care to do good. But the Scripture ſo taketh not alone, nor we ſo meane, as M. More knoweth well inough. When an horſe A ſimilitude.beareth a ſaddell and a man therin, we may wel ſay, that y^t horſe onelyonly & alone beareth the ſaddell, and is not holpe of the man in bearing thereof. But he would make men vnderſtand that we ment, the horſe bare the ſaddell emptie and no man therin: let him marke this to ſee his ignoraunce, which woulde God were not coupled with malice. EueryEvery man that hath wit, hath a will More is maliciouſly blynde.to, and then by M. Mores argument, witte onelyonly geueth not the light of vnderſtanding. Now the concluſion is falſe and the contrary true. For y^t wit without helpe of the will geueth the light of the vnderſtanding, neyther doth the will woorke at all, vntill the wit hauehave determined this or that to be good or bad. Now what is faith ſaue a ſpirituall light of vnderſtanding, and an inwarde knowledge or feelyng of mercy. Out of which knowledge louelove doth ſpring. But louelove brought me not that knowledge, for I knew it yer I loued. So that louelove in the proceſſe of nature to diſpute from the cauſe to the An ap… and proper exſample of louelove.effect helpeth not at all to the feeling that God is mercifull to me no more than the louing hart and kinde behauiour of an obedient wife to her huſband maketh her ſee his louelove & kyndneſſe to her, for many ſuch hauehave vnkinde huſbandes. But by hys kynde deedes to her, doth ſhe ſee hys louelove. Euen ſo my louelove and deedes make me not ſee Gods louelove to me in the proceſſe of nature: but his kinde deedes to me, in that he gaue his ſonne for me, maketh me ſee his louelove, & to louelove againe.

Our louelove and good workes make not God firſt louelove vsus, and chaunge hym from hate to louelove, as the Turke, Iewe, and vaine popiſhe meane, but his louelove and deedes make vsus louelove, & chaunge vsus from hate to louelove. For he Rom. 5.Rom 5loued vsus when we were euill, and his enemies, as teſtifieth Paule in diuers God loued vsus firſt, that weplaces, and choſe vsus, to make vsus good and to ſhew vsus louelove, and to draw vsus ſhould louelove him againeto him, that we ſhould louelove agayne.

The father loueth his childe, when it hath no power to do good, & when it muſt be ſuffered to runne after the owne luſtes without lawe, and neuer loueth it better then then, to make it better, and to ſhew it louelove, to louelove agayne. If ye coulde ſee what is writtē in the firſt epiſtle of Iohn, though all the other ſcripture were layde a parte, he ſhould ſee all this.

And ye muſt vnderſtand, that we ſometyme diſpute forwarde, from the cauſe to the effect, and ſometyme backward from the effect to the cauſe, and muſt beware that we be not therwyth beguiled, we ſay ſommer is come and therefore all is grene, and diſpute forwarde. For ſomme… is the cauſe of the ☜greneſſe. We ſay the trees be grene, & therfore ſommer is come, and diſpute backward from the effect to the cauſe. For the grene trees make not ſommer but maketh ſomme… knowen. So we diſpute backward, the man doth good He that loueth God loueth hys neighbour.deedes and profitable vntounto his neyghbour, he muſt therefore louelove God: he loueth God, he muſt therefore hauehave a true fayth and ſee mercy.

And yet my woorkes make not my louelove, nor my louelove my faith, nor my faith Gods mercy: But cōtrary, gods Note here the mercy & goodnes of God.mercy maketh my fayth, and my fayth my louelove, and my louelove my works. And if the Pope could ſee mercy and worke of louelove to his neighbour, and not ſell his woorkes to God for heauen after M. Mores doctrine, we needed not ſo ſuttle diſputing of faith.

And when M. More alleageth Paule to the Corinthians, to proue that faith may be without louelove, he proueth nothing, but iuggleth onelyonly. He ſaith, it Faith may be had w^t out louelove, but it is a barreine & naked faithis euident by the wordes of Paule, that a mā may hauehave a faith to do miracles without louelove, & may geue all his good in almes without louelove, and geue his body to burne for the name of Chriſt, & al without charitie. Wel I will not ſticke with hym: he may ſo do without charitie & without fayth therto. Then a mā may hauehave faith without faith. Ye verely becauſe there be many differēces of faith, as I hauehave ſayd, and not all faithes one fayth, as maiſter More iuggleth. We read in the woorkes of S. Ciprian, that Ciprian.there were martyrs that ſuffered martyrdome for the name of Chriſt all the Martyrs that ſuffered all a yeare long.yeare long, and were tormented and healed agayne, and then brought forth a freſhe. Which martyrs beleued as ye p. 333do, that the payne of their martyrdom ſhould be a deſeruing & merite inough not onelyonly to deſerue heauen for themſelues, but to make ſatiſfaction for the ſinnes of other men thereto, and gaue pardons of their merites, after the enſample of the Popes doctrine, and forgaue the ſinnes of other men, which had openly denyed Chriſt, and wrote vntounto Ciprian, that he ſhoulde receaue thoſe men that had denyed Chriſt into the congregation agayne, at the ſatiſfaction of their merites. For whiche pride Ciprian wrote to them and called The deuils Martyrs.them the deuilles martyrs and not Gods. Thoſe martyrs had a fayth without fayth. For had they beleued that all mercy is geuen for Chriſtes bloudſhedding, they would hauehave ſent other mē thether, and would hauehave ſuffered their owne martyrdome for louelove of their neighbours onelyonly, to ſerue thē and to teſtifie the truth of God in our ſauiour Ieſu, vntounto the worlde, to ſaue at the leaſt way ſome, that is to wete, the elect, for whoſe ſake Paule ſuffereth all thing, and not to winne heauē. If I worke for a worldly purpoſe, I We muſt doe good workes of louelove, and not for reward.get no rewarde in heauen: euen ſo if I worke for heauen or an hyer place in heauen, I get there no rewarde. But I muſt do my woorke for y^t louelove of my neighbour, becauſe he is my brother, and the price of Chriſtes bloude, and becauſe Chriſt hath deſerued it, and deſireth it of me, and then my rewarde is great in heauen.

And all they which beleue that their ſinnes be forgeuen them, and they receaued as the ſcripture teſtifieth, vntounto the enheritaunce of heauē for Chriſtes merites, the ſame louelove Chriſt and their brethren for his ſake, and do all thyng for their ſakes onelyonly, not once thinking of heauen when they worke, but on their brethrens neede. When they ſuffer themſelues aboue might, then they comfort their ſoule with the remē braunce of heauen, that this wretchednes ſhall hauehave an ende, and we ſhall hauehave a thouſand folde pleaſures and rewardes in heauen, not for the merites Our doynges can deſerue nothyng, but Chriſte hath deſerued for vsus.of our deſeruings, but geuen vsus freely for Chriſtes. And he that hath y^t louelove, hath the right faith, and he that hath y^t faith hath the right louelove. For I cā not louelove my neighbour for Chriſtes ſake, except I firſt beleue that I hauehave receaued ſuch mercy of Chriſt. Nor can I beleue that I hauehave receaued ſuch mercy of Chriſt, but that I muſt louelove my neighbour for his ſake, ſeing that he ſo inſtantly deſireth me.

And when he alleageth S. Iames, Iames. ….it is aunſwered him in the Mammon, and S. Auguſtine anſwereth hym. And S. Iames expoundeth himſelfe. For he ſaith in the firſt chapter, God which begatte vsus of his owne will wyth the worde of truth, which worde of truth, is his promiſes of mercy and forgeueneſſe in our Sauiour Ieſus, by which he begat vsus, gaue vsus life and made vsus a new creature thorow a faſt faith. And Iames goeth and rebuketh the opinion Iames …eproueth ſel… …tes and not a true and liuely ſayth.and falſe fayth of them that thinke it inough to be ſaued by, if they beleue that there is but one god, & that Chriſt was borne of a virgine, and a thouſand things which a man may beleue, and yet not beleue in Chriſt, to be ſaued from ſinne thorow him. And that Iames ſpeaketh of another faith then at the beginning appeareth by his enſample. The deuils hauehave faith ſaith he: yea but the deuilles hauehave no faith that can repent of euil or to beleue in Chriſt to be ſaued thorow him, or that cā louelove God and worke his wil of louelove. Now Paule ſpeaketh of a fayth that is in Chriſtes bloude to be ſaued thereby, which worketh immediatly thorough louelove of the benefite receaued. And Iames at the beginning ſpeaketh of a fayth that bydeth trying, ſaying, the trying of your faith worketh or ca…ſeth pacience. But the faith of the deuilles will bide no trying, for they will not woorke Gods will becauſe they louelove him not. And in like maner is it of the Fayth that will not woorke when oportunitie ſerueth cā not iuſtifie.fayth of them that repent not, or that thinke themſelues without ſinne. For except a mā feele out of what daunger Chriſt hath deliuered hym, he can not louelove the worke. And therfore Iames ſayth right, that no ſuch fayth that will not woorke can iuſtifie a man.

And when Paule ſaith faith onelyonly iuſtifieth: And Iames, that a man is iuſtified by woorkes and not by fayth onelyonly, there is great differēce betwene Paules onelyonly and Iames onelyonly. For Paules onelyonly is to be vnderſtand, that faith iuſtifieth in the harte and before God, without helpe of workes, yea & yer I can worke. For I muſt receaue life thorow faith to worke wi…h, yer I can worke. But Iames onelyonly is thys wiſe to be vnderſtand, that faith doth not ſo iuſtifie, that nothyng iuſtifieth How workes iuſtifie.ſaue fayth. For deedes do iuſtifie alſo. But faith iuſtifieth in the hart and before God, and the deedes before the worlde onelyonly, and maketh the other p. 334ſeene, as ye may ſee by the ſcripture.

For Paul ſayth Rom iiij. it Abrahā Rom. 4.Rom 4hauehave woorkes, he hath whereof to reioyce, but not before god. For if Abrahā had receaued thoſe promiſes of deſeruing, then had it ben Abrahās prayſe & not gods, as thou mayſt ſee in the text: neither had God ſhewed Abrahā mercy and grace, but had onelyonly geuen hym his dutie and deſeruyng. But in that Abraham receaued all the mercy that was ſhewed hym, frely through fayth, out of the deſeruynges of the ſeed that was promiſed him, as thou mayſt ſee by Geneſis & by the Goſpell of Iohn, Iohn. 8.John 8where Chriſt teſtifieth that Abraham ſaw his day and reioyced, and of that ioy no doubt wrought, it is gods prayſe, and the glory of his mercy. And the ſame mayſt thou ſee by Iames, when he ſayth Abraham offered his ſonne, & ſo was the Scripture fulfilled, that Abraham beleued, & it was rekened him for righteouſneſſe and he was thereby made Gods frend.

How was it fulfilled? before God? Nay, it was fulfilled before God many yeares before, and he was Gods frend many yeares before, euen from the firſt appointement that was made betwene God and hym. Abraham receaued Abrahā beleued gods promiſes & therefore was iuſtified.promiſes of all mercy & beleued and truſted God and went & wrought out of that fayth. But it was fulfilled before vsus which can not ſee the hart, as Iames ſaith, I wil ſhew thee my faith out of my workes, and as the aungell ſaid to Abrahā, now I know that thou dreadeſt God. Not but that he knew it before, but for vsus ſpake he that, whiche can ſee nought in Abraham more then in other men, ſaue by his workes.

And what workes ment Iames? verely the workes of mercy. As if a brother or a ſiſter lacke rayment or ſuſtenaunce and ye be not moued to compaſſion nor feele their diſeaſes, what fayth hauehave ye then? No fayth (be ſure) Hee that ſeeth hys neighbour in neceſſitie & hath no compaſſion on him, hath no fayth.that feeleth the mercy that is in Chriſt. For they that feele that, be mercyfull agayne & thankefull. But looke on the workes of our ſpiritualitie which will not onelyonly be iuſtified with workes before the worlde, but alſo before God. They hauehave had all Chriſtēdome to rule this viij. hundred yeares, and as they onelyonly be annointed in the head, ſo hauehave they onelyonly bene Kyng and Emperour and hauehave had all power in their hands and hauehave bene the doers onelyonly and the leders of thoſe ſhadowes that hauehave had the name of Princes, and hauehave led them whether they would & hauehave brethed into their braynes what they lyſted. And they hauehave wrought the world out of peace and vnitie and eueryevery man out of his wellfare and are become alone well at eaſe, onelyonly free, onelyonly at libertie, onelyonly hauehave all thyng & onelyonly do nought therefore, onelyonly laye on other mēs backes & beare nought thē ſelues. And the good woorkes of them that wrought out of fayth and gaue theyr goods & landes to finde the poore, thē deuoure they alſo alone. And what workes preach they? OnelyOnly that are to The Papiſtes preach workes that are profitable to them ſelues.them profitable & wherbey they raigne in mens cōſciences as God: to offer, to geue to be prayed for & to be deliuered out of Purgatory and to redeme your ſinne of them, and to worſhyp ceremonies and to be ſhryuen and ſo forth.

And when M. More is come to him ſelfe and ſayth the firſt fayth and the firſt iuſtifying is geuen vsus without our deſeruyng. God be thanked, and I would fayne that he would deſcribe me what he meaneth by the ſecond iuſtifying. I know no more to do, then whē I hauehave receaued all mercy and all forgeueneſſe of Chriſt frely, to go and powre out the ſame vponupon my neighbour.

M. Dauid loſt not his fayth, when hee More. Dauid. Tyndall.committed adultery.

Tyndall. No, and therfore he could not continue in ſinnne, but repēted aſſoone as his fault was told him. But was he not reconciled by fayth onelyonly, & not by dedes? ſayd he not hauehave mercy on me Lord for thy great mercy and for the multitude of thy mercies put away Pſal. 51.Ps 51my ſinne. And agayne, make me heare ioy and gladneſſe, that the bones whiche thou haſt broken may reioyce. That is let me heare thy voyce that my ſinne is forgeuen and then I am ſafe & will reioyce. And afterward he knowledgeth that God deliteth not in ſacrifices When we hauehave offended God we muſt returne qui…kly by repentaunce and call vponupon God to heare vsus for Chriſt our Sauiours ſake.for ſinnes, but that a troubled ſpirite and a broken hart is that whiche God requireth. And when the peace was made, he prayeth boldly and familiarly to God, that he would be good to Sion and Ieruſalem, and ſaith that then laſt of all when God hath forgeuen vsus of mercy, & hath done vsus good for our euill, we ſhall offer ſacrifice of thankes to hym agayne. So that our dedes are but thankeſgeuyng. When we hauehave ſinned, we go with a repentyng hart vntounto Chriſtes bloud, & there waſh it of thorough fayth. And our dedes are but thankes geuyng to God to helpe our neighbours at their nede, p. 335for which our neighbours and eche of them owe vsus as much agayne at our nede. So that the Teſtament or forgeueneſſe of ſinnes, is built vppon fayth in Chriſtes bloud and not on workes. M. More wil runne to the Pope for forgeueneſſe a poenae & culpae. By what merites doth the Pope that? by Chriſtes. Poena culpa.And Chriſt hath promiſed all his merites to them that repent and beleue & not geuen them vntounto the Pope to ſell. And in your abſolutiōs ye oft abſolue without ioynyng of penaūce. He muſt hauehave a purpoſe to do good woorkes will ye ſay. That cōdition is ſet before As we hauehave receaued at the hād of God mercy, ſo muſt we ſhewe mercy to our neyghbours.him to do, out of y^e mercy that hee hath receaued and not to receaue mercy out of them. But the Popiſh can not repēt out of the hart. And therfore cā not fele the mercy that fayth bryngeth, & therfore can not be mercyfull to their neighbours to doe their woorkes for their ſakes. But they faine them a ſorow for their ſinne in which they euer continue and ſo morne for them in the mornyng that they laugh in them yer midday agayne. And then they imagine them Popiſh deedes, to make ſatiſfaction to God and make an Idole of him.

And finally that good workes, as to Workes of them ſelues iuſtifie not.geue almes and ſuch like, iuſtifie not of them ſelues, is manifeſt. For as the good which are taught of God do thē well, of very louelove to God and Chriſt & of their neighbours for Chriſtes ſake, euen ſo the euill do them of vayne glorie & a falſe fayth wickedly, as we hauehave exāples in the Phariſeis, ſo that a man muſt be good yer he can do good. And ſo is it of the purpoſe to do thē: Ones purpoſe is good and an others euill: ſo that we muſt be good, yer a good purpoſe come. How then, to louelove the law of God and to conſent therto & to hauehave it written in thyne hart and to profeſſe it, ſo that thou art ready of thyne own accorde to do it and without compulſion, is to be righteous: that I graunt and that louelove may be called righteouſneſſe before God paſſiue and the lyfe & quickeneſſe of the ſoule paſſiue. He that loueth hys neighbour for Chriſts ſake the ſame is righteous.And ſo farre forth as a man loueth the law of God, ſo farre forth he is righteous, & ſo much as hee lacketh of louelove toward hys neighbour after the example of Chriſt, ſo much he lacketh of righteouſneſſe. And that thyng which maketh a man louelove the law of God, doth make a man righteous and iuſtifieth him effectiuely and actually and maketh hym alyue as a woorkeman and cauſe efficient. Now what is it that maketh a man to louelove? verely not the dedes, for they folow and ſpryng of louelove, if they be good. Neither the preachyng of the law, for that quickeneth not the hart Gal. iij. but cauſeth wrath Rom. iiij. & vttereth the ſinne onelyonly Rom. iij. And therfore ſayth Paule that righteouſnes ſpryngeth not out of the deedes of the law into the hart, as the Iewes & the Pope meane: but contrary the deedes of the law ſpryng out of the righteouſneſſe of the hart if they be good. As when a father pronounceth the law, that the child ſhall go to ſchole, it ſayth nay. For that killeth his hart & all his luſtes, ſo that he hath no power to louelove it. But what maketh his hart aliue to louelove it? verely fayre promiſes of louelove & kyndneſſe, that it ſhall hauehave a gentle ſcholemaſter and ſhal play inough and ſhall hauehave many gaye thynges and ſo forth. All our workes if they procede not of louelove are nothyng.Euen ſo the preachyng of fayth doth worke louelove in our ſoules & make them alyue & draw our hartes to God. The mercy that we hauehave in chriſt doth make vsus louelove onelyonly & onelyonly bringeth the ſpirite of life into our ſoules.

And therfore ſayth Paule, we be iuſtified by fayth and by grace without dedes: that is, yer the dedes come. For fayth onelyonly bringeth, the ſpirite of lyfe and deliuereth our ſoules from feare of dānation, which is in the law and euer maketh peace betwen God and vsus, as oft as there is any variaunce betwene vsus. And finally whē the peace is made betwene God and vsus and all forgeuen through fayth in Chriſtes bloud, & we Fayth in Chriſt maketh our ſmall workes acceptable.begyn to louelove the law, we were neuer the nearer except fayth went with vsus, to ſupply out the lacke of full louelove, in that we hauehave promiſes, that that litle we hauehave is takē a woorth and accepted till more come. And agayne when our frailtie hath ouerthrowen vsus and feare of damnation inuaded our conſciēces, we were vtterly loſt, if fayth were not bye to helpe vsus vp agayne, in that we are promiſed that when ſoeuer we repent of euill and come to the right way agayne, it ſhalbe forgeuen for Chriſtes ſake. For whē we be fallen, there is no Teſtament made in workes to come, that they ſhal ſaue vsus. And therfore the workes of repentaūce or of the Sacramētes can neuer quiet our cōſciences & deliuer vsus from feare of damnation.

And laſt of all in temptation tribulation and aduerſities, we periſhed dayly except fayth went with vsus to deliuer vsus, in that we hauehave promiſes, that god will aſſiſte vsus, cloth vsus, fede vsus & fight p. 336for vsus and rid vsus out of the handes of our enemyes. And thus the righteous ☞ The righteous lyueth by …aith.liueth euer by fayth, euen from fayth to fayth, that is, as ſoone as he is deliuered out of one temptation an other is ſet before him, to fight againſt, and to ouercome thorow fayth. The ſcripture ſayth, bleſſed is the man whoſe tranſgreſſion is forgeuen & his ſinnes hid, and vntounto whom the Lord reckoneth not vnrighteouſnes. So that the onelyonly righteouſnes of him that cā but ſinne, and hath nought of himſelfe to make amendes, is the forgeueneſſe of ſinne, which ſaith onelyonly bringeth. And as farforth as we be vn…ghteous, Faith in Chriſtes bloud doth onelyonly iuſtifie vsus.faith onelyonly iuſtifieth vsus actiuely, and els nothing on our partie. And as farforth as we hauehave ſinned, be in ſinne, or do ſinne, or ſhal ſinne, ſo farforth muſt faith in Chriſtes bloud iuſtifie vsus onelyonly, and els nothing. To louelove, is to be righteous, ſo farforth as thou loueſt, but not to make righteous, nor to make peace. To beleue in Chriſtes bloud with a repēting hart, is to make righteous, and the onelyonly makyng of peace and ſatiſfaction to Godwarde. And thus becauſe termes be darcke to them that be not expert and exerciſed, we alway ſet out our meaning wyth cleare enſamples, reporting our ſelues vntounto the hartes and conſciences of all men.

M. The blaſphemous wordes of Luther ſeme to ſignifie, that both Iohn Baptiſte More.and our Lady were ſinners.

Tyndall. Iohn Baptiſte ſayde to Chriſt Mat. 3. I had neede to be baptiſed Tyndall.of thee, and commeſt thou to me? Wherof did Iohn confeſſe that he had nede to be waſhed & purged by Chriſt, of his holynes and good deedes?

When Iohn ſaide, beholde y^e Lambe of God that taketh away the ſinne of y^e Iohn Baptiſt and our Lady alſo were ſinners & looked for the redemptiō in Chriſt.worlde, he was not of that ſorte, nor had any ſinnes to be taken away at any time, nor any part in Chriſts bloud which dyed for ſinners onelyonly. Iohn came to reſtore all thyng ſayth Chriſt. That is, he came to enterprete the law of God truely, and to proue all fleſhe ſinners, to ſend thē to Chriſt, as Paul doth in the beginning of y^e Romanes. Which lawe if M. More coulde vnderſtand how ſpirituall it is, and what it requireth of vsus, he woulde not ſo diſpute. And if there were no imperfectneſſe in our Ladies deedes, why dyd Chriſt rebuke her Iohn. 2. when he ought rather to hauehave honoured his mother, and why did he make her ſecke him three dayes. Chriſoſtomus dare ſay Chriſoſtomus.that our Lady was now and then taken with a little vayne glory. She ioked for the promiſes of him that ſhould come and bleſſe her, from what? She beleued to be ſaued by Chriſt, from what? This I graunt, that our Lady, Iohn Baptiſte, Iſaac, Iacob, Ioſeph, There was neuer any but Chriſt that was without ſinne.Moſes, and many like, did neuer conſent to ſinne, to follow it: But had the holy ghoſt from the beginning. Neuer the later, while they folowed the ſpirite and wrought their beſt, yet chaunces met them by the way and temptations, that made their woorkes come ſometimes vnperfectly to paſſe, as a potter that hath his craft neuer ſo wel, meteth a chaunce now and then, that maketh him faſhion a pot a miſſe. So that I thinke the perfecteſt of them all as we hauehave enſamples of ſome, were compelled to ſay with Paul, that good that I would, I do not and that euill that I would not, that I do. I would not ſweare on a booke that if our Lady had bene let ſlip as we other were, and as hard appoſed with as preſent death before her eyes, that ſhe would not hauehave denyed ſomethinges that ſhe knew true, ye but ſhe was preſerued by grace that ſhe was not. No but though ſhe were kept by grace from y^e outwarde deede, yet if there were ſuch wickednes in her fleſhe, ſhe had ſinne. And the grace was, that ſhe knew it, and was meeke to beleue in Chriſt, to hauehave it forgeuen her, and to be preſerued that it ſhould not bud forth Iohn the Euangeliſt, when he was as holy as euer was Iohn the Baptiſt ſayd, if 1. Iohn. 1.1 John 1we ſay we hauehave no ſinne, we deceaue our ſelues.

Then he compareth fayth & deedes together and will that fayth ſhoulde Workes are vnderunder the law.ſtand in no better ſeruice of right then deedes. Yes, for the deedes be examined by the lawe, and therfore it is not inough to do them onelyonly, or to do thē with louelove: but I muſt do them wyth as great louelove as Chriſt did for me, and Fayth is vnderunder no law.as I receaue a good deede at my nede. But faith is vnderunder no lawe, and therfore be ſhe neuer ſo feeble, ſhe ſhall receaue according to the truth of the promiſer.

M. What thing coulde we aſke God More.of right becauſe we beleue him?

Tyndall. Ʋerely all that he promiſeth, Tyndall.may we be bolde to aſke of right and dutie and by good obligation.

More. Ferman ſayd that all workes be More.good inough in thē that god hath choſē.

p. 332Tyndall. I am ſure it is vntrue, for Tyndall.their beſt be not good inough, though God forgeueth them their euill of hys mercy, at y^e repentaunce of their harts.

Then he endeth in his ſchole doctrine contrary vntounto all the ſcripture, that God remitteth not the ſinne of hys choſen people, becauſe that he hath choſen thē not of his mercy, but of a towardnes The blinde and …ond reaſoning of More.that is more in one then in an other ſaying, God ſaw before that Peter ſhould repent, and Iudas woulde diſpaire, and therefore choſe Peter. If God choſe Peter becauſe he did repent, why choſe he not Iudas to, which repented as much as he & knowledged his ſinne, and brought the money agayne? O this blindneſſe, as God had wrought nothing in the repentaunce of Peter. Sayde not Chriſt before, that Peter Luke. 22.Luke 22ſhould falle. And ſayd he not that he had prayed for him that he ſhoulde be holpe vppe agayne? Chriſt prayed a ſtrong prayer for Peter to helpe hym vp agayne, and ſuffered a ſtrong death thereto. And before his death he committed them vntounto his father ſaying, I hauehave kept them in thy name and I depart, Iohn. 17.John 17keepe them now from euill. Peter had a good hart to God, and loued his lawe, and beleued in Chriſt, & had the ſpirite of God in him which neuer left him for all his falle. Peter ſinned of no malice, but of frailtie and ſodaine The difference betwene Peters fall & the fall of Iudas.feare of death. And the goodneſſe of God wrought his repentaunce and all the meanes by which he was brought vp againe at Chriſtes requeſte. And Iudas was neuer good, nor came to Chriſt for louelove of his doctrine, but of couetouſneſſe, nor did euer beleue in Chriſt.

Iudas was by nature and birth (as Iudas.we all be) heyre of the wrath of God, in whome the deuill wrought his will and blinded his hart with ignoraunce. In which ignorannce and blindnes he grew, as he grew in age and fell deeper and deeper therein, and thereby Iudas periſhed in deſperatiō.wrought all his wickedneſſe, and the deuilles will and periſhed therin. Frō which ignoraunce God purged Peter of his mercy, and gaue him light, and his ſpirite to gouerne him, and not of any towardneſſe that was in Peter of hys owne byrth: but for the mercy that we hauehave in the birth of Chriſtes death.

And how will M. More proue that God chuſeth not of his goodnes but of our towardnes? What good towardnes can he hauehave and endeuour that is altogether blinde and caryed away at the will of the deuill, till the deuill be caſt out? Are we not robbed of all towardnes By Adam we are all made the children of the wrath of God.in Adam, and be by nature made the children of ſinne, ſo that we ſinne naturally and to ſinne is our nature? So that as now, though we would do well, the fleſh yet ſinneth naturally, neither ceaſeth to ſinne, but ſo farforth as it is kept vnderunder with violence: euen ſo once our hartes ſinned as naturally with full luſt and conſent vntounto the fleſhe, the deuill poſſeſſing our hartes, and keeping out the light of grace. What good towardneſſe and endeuour can we hauehave to hate ſinne, as long as we louelove it? What good towardnes can we hauehave vntounto the will of God while we hate it and be ignoraunt therof. Can the will deſire that the witte ſeeth not? Can the will long for and ſigh for that the witte knoweth not of? Can a mā take thought for that loſſe that he wotteth not of? what good endeuour can the Turkes children, the Iewes children, and the Popes infantes hauehave, when they be taught all falſhead onelyonly, with like perſwaſions of worldly reaſon, to be all iuſtified with workes? It is not therefore as Rom. 9.Rom 9Paule ſaith of the running or willing, but of the mercy of God, that a man is called and choſen to grace.

The firſt grace, the firſt fayth, and the firſt iuſtifiyng is geuen vsus freely ſayth M. More, which I would faine wete how it will ſtand with his other doctrine, & whether he meane any other thyng by choſyng them to hauehave Gods ſpirite geuen me and fayth to ſee the mercy that is layd vp for me & to hauehave my ſinnes forgeuen without all deſeruyng & preparyng of my ſelf God did not ſee onelyonly that the theſe that was ſaued at Chriſtes death, ſhould come thether, but God worketh by diuers to make vsus to call vpō and to truſt in his mercy.God choſe him to ſhew his mercy vntounto vsus that ſhould after beleue, and prouided actually & wrought for the bringyng of him thether that day, to make him ſee and to receaue the mercy that was layd vp for him in ſtore, before the world was made.

The xij. Chapt….

IN y^t xij. in chaffyng himſelf to heape lye vponupon lye, he vttereth his feleable blindneſſe. For he axeth this queſtion wherfore ſerueth exhortatiōs vntounto faith, if the hearers hauehave not libertie of their frewill, by whiche together with Gods Frewill.grace a man may labour to ſubmitte the rebellion of reaſon vntounto the obediēce of faith and credence of the worde of God. p. 338Wherof ye ſee, that beſides his graunt that reaſon rebelleth agaynſt fayth, cō trary to the doctrine of his firſt booke, he will that the will ſhall compell the witte to beleue. Whiche is as much to ſay as the carte muſt draw the horſes and the ſonne beget the father, and the authoritie of the Church is greater thē Gods word. For the wil can not teach the wit nor lead her, but foloweth naturally: ſo that what ſoeuer the witte iudgeth good or euill, that the will loueth or hateth. If the witte ſee and leade ſtraight, the will foloweth. If the witte be blynde and leade amiſſe, the will foloweth cleane out of y^t way. The witte leadeth the will.I can not louelove Gods worde before I beleue it, nor hate it, before I iudge it falſe and vanitie.

He might hauehave wiſelier ſpoken on this maner, wherfore ſerueth the preachyng of fayth, if the wit hauehave no power to draw the will to louelove that whiche the wit iudgeth true and good. If the will be nought, teach the wit better & the will ſhall alter and turne to good immediatly. Blindneſſe is the cauſe of ali euil, and light the cauſe of all good: ſo that where the fayth is right there the hart can not conſent vntounto euill, to folow the luſtes of the fleſh, as the popes fayth doth. And this concluſion hath he halfe a doſē tymes in his boke, Mores wittes are captiuated.that the will may compell the witte and captiuate it, to beleue what a mā luſteth. Ʋerely it is like that his wittes be in captiuitie and for vauntage tangled with out holy fathers ſophiſtrie.

His doctrine is after his owne feelyng and as the profeſſion of his hart is. For the Popiſh hauehave yelded thē ſelues, to folow the luſtes of their fleſh, & compel their witte to abſteine frō looking on y^e truth leſt ſhe ſhould vnquiet them and draw them out of the podell of their filthy voluptuouſneſſe. As a A prety example.carte that is ouerladen goyng vp an hill draweth the horſes backe, and in ☞a tough mire maketh them ſtand ſtill. And then the carter the deuill whiche driueth thē is euer by and whiſtelleth vntounto them and biddeth them captiuate their vnderſtādyng vntounto profitable doctrine for which they ſhal hauehave no perſecution but ſhal reigne and be kynges and enioy the pleaſures of the world at their owne will.

The xiij. Chapter.

IN the xiij. hee ſayth that the Clergie burneth no man. As though the pope had not firſt foūd the law, & as though all his preachers babled not that in eueryevery Sermon, burne theſe heretickes burne them for we hauehave no other argument to conuince them and as though they compelled not both Kyng & Emperour to ſweare that they ſhall ſo do, yer they crowne them.

Then hee bringeth in prouiſions of Kyng Henry the v. Of whom I aſke. M. King Henry the. v.More whether he were right heyre vntounto England or held hee the land with the ſworde as an heathen tyraunt, agaynſt all right. Whom the Prelates, leſt he ſhould hauehave had leyſure to hearken vntounto the truth, ſent into Fraunce, to occupie his mynde in warre, and led hym at their will. And I aſke whether King Hēry the 4. was an vſurper of y^e crownehis father ſlew not his leige kyng and true inheritour vntounto the crowne and was therefore ſet vp of the Byſhops a falſe kyng to mainteine theyr falſhead? And I aſke whether after that wicked deede, folowed not the deſtruction of the comminaltie and quenchyng of all noble bloud.

The xiiij. Chapter.

IN the xiiij. he affirmeth that Martine Luther ſayth it is not lawfull to reſiſte ☜the Turke. I wonder that hee ſhameth not ſo to lye, ſeyng that Martine hath The Turk is to be reſiſted.written a ſingular treatiſe for the contrary. Beſides that in many other workes he proueth it lawfull, if he inuade vsus.

The xvi. Chapter.

IN the xvi. he alledgeth Councels. I aſke whether Councels hauehave authoritie to make Articles of the faith with out Gods worde, yea and of thynges improued by Gods word?

He alledgeth Auguſtine, Hierome & Cypriane. Let him put their workes in The vnion of Doctors a good booke.Engliſh and S. Proſperus with them. Why damned they the vnion of Doctours, but becauſe the Doctours are agaynſt them.

And when he alledgeth Martyrs, let him ſhew one and take the calfe for his labour.

And in the end he biddeth beware of thē that liue well in any wiſe. As though they whiche lyue euill can not teach amiſſe. And if that be true then they be ☜of the ſureſt ſide.

M. When Tyndall was appoſed of his More.doctrine, yer hee went ouer ſee, he ſayde and ſweare, he ment no harme.

Tyndall. He ſware not neither was there any man that required an othe of Tyndall ſweareth.him: but he now ſweareth by him whō p. 339…e truſteth to be ſaued by, that hee neuer ment or yet meaneth any other harme then to ſuffer all that God hath prepared to be leyd on his backe, for to bryng his brethrē vntounto the light of our Sauiour Ieſus which the Pope thorough falſhead and corruptyng ſuch Poetes as ye are (ready vntounto all thyng for vauntage) leadeth in the darkeneſſe of death.

M. Tyndall doth knowe how that S. Auguſtine and S. Hierome do proue with More.holy Scripture that confeſsiō is of neceſſitie vntounto ſaluation.

Tyndall. That is falſe if ye meane eareconfeſſion. Why alledge ye not the Tyndall.places where? But ye know by S. Hierome and other ſtories and by the conuerſation Eare confeſſion.with Eraſmus, how it came vp and that the vſe was once farre other then now.

M. I meruell that Tyndal denieth Purgatory, More. Purgatoryexcept he entend to go to hell.

Tyndall. He entendeth to purge here Tyndall.vntounto the vttermoſt of his power & hopeth that death will end and finiſh hys purgation. And if there be any other purgyng, he will commit it to God & take it as he findeth it, when he cōmeth at it, and in the meane tyme take no thought therefore, but for this that is preſent wherewith all Saintes were purged and were taught ſo to be. And Tyndall marueleth what ſecret pilles they take to purge them ſelues whiche not onelyonly will not purge here with the croſſe of Chriſt, but alſo bye out theyr Purgatory therof the pope, for a groat or vj. pence.

The xviij. Chapter.

M. The Clergie doth nothyng vntounto More.the heretikes but as the holy Doctours dyd.Clergy.

Tyndall. Yes ye put them in your priſons Tyndall.and diote them and handle them after your faſhion as temporall tyraū tes, and diſpute with them ſecretly and will not come at light. And ye ſlea thē Note.for rebukyng you with Gods worde, and ſo did not the old holy Doctours. If a man ſlea his father, ye care not. But if any man touche one of you, though he hauehave neuer ſo great an occaſion geuen him, ye curſe him, and if he will not ſubmitte him ſelfe vntounto your puniſhmēt, ye leaue him vntounto the temporall power whome ye hauehave hyred with y^e ſpoyle of his goodes to be your hangman, ſo that he muſt loſe his life, for geuyng one of you but a blowe on the cheke.

M. Saint Paule gaue two heretickes vntounto the deuill whiche tormented theyr More.fleſhe whiche was no ſmall puniſhement and haply he ſlew them.

Tyndall. O expounder of the Scripture like Hugo Charenſis which expoſideth Tyndall.haereticum hominem deuita, take the hereticke out of his lyfe. We read of no payne that he had whom the Corinthians Paule dyd excommunicate, but our Byſhops do burne.excommunicated and gaue to Sathan, to ſlea his fleſhe, ſaue that hee was aſhamed of hym ſelfe and repented, when he ſaw his offence ſo earneſtly taken and ſo abhorred. But ye becauſe ye hauehave no power to deliuer them to Sathan to blynde theyr myndes, ye deliuer thē to the fire to deſtroy their fleſh, that no more is ſeene of them after then the aſhes.

¶ FINIS.

p. 340¶ The practiſe of papiſticall Prelates, made by Wylliam Tyndall. ¶ In the yeare of our Lorde. 1530.