The English Nonconformity Under King Charles II and James II, Chapter 16 – Chapter 18
CHAP. XVI. Point XIII. Of Pronouncing all saved that are Buried, except the Vnbaptized, Excommunicate and Self-murtherers.
L.
WHat are the words hear that you dislike?
M.
I told you before, [For as much as it hath pleased Almighty God to take to himself the Soul of our dear Brother, here deceased.] and [We give thee thanks for that it hath pleased thee to deliver this our Brother out of the miseries of this sinful world] and [That we may rest in him as our hope is this our Brother doth]
L.
What harm is in these words? must not charity be used in our judging of all mens final state.
M.
We like all the Office, and these words very well, if used over the Corpse of capable persons; and if true Discipline in the Church did make a just Separation of the capable and uncapable.
L.
Then the fault is not in the Liturgy, but the Government.
M.
It only follows that the fault is Primarily in the Governours corruption, and neglect of Discipline; but it's next also in the Liturgy? For the matter of fact and right is presupposed to the Declaration of it: And it followeth not that because I may speak well of good men, I may do so of bad. Christ will condemn those that feed not, visit not, harbour not his Servants, Mat. 25. All men ought to be his Servants and deserve this. Yet multitudes in Scotland suffer now, for feeding and harbouring rebellious subjects: Suppose they say now that the fault was not in us that fed them; but in them that were Rebells; we were bound to feed honest men, and they were bound to be honest, and charity judgeth the best. I think this will not save some from the gallows.
I think if the Bishops were but to bury Souldiers killed in fighting against the King, and at the Grave should pronounce them all good Subjects, it would be ill taken; much more is it to pronounce them saved.
Charity is no excuse for dangerous errour and falshood. It must not follow a blind understanding. I am sure that the Clergy in their Sermons and Writings, condemn abundance whom at the Grave they pronounce saved.
L.
But what danger is it to judge too charitably?
M.
It hath all these dangers. 1. The guilt of speaking falsely to God.
2. The contradicting of God's Word, which saith, that no Whoremonger, Drunkard, Railer, Murtherer, shall enter into the Kingdom of God, and that the impenitent shall perish.
3. The hardening of ungodly men against all fear of God, when they hear that the same men, that in the Pulpit threaten damnation to them, recant it all in their Application at the Grave, and pronounce them saved. How could they more dangerously deceive men, who take that in deeper usually that is said at the Grave, than in the Pulpit.
L.
But some say none of those words signifie the persons Salvation, but his removal hence.
M.
Read them; If those do not, none do.
L.
But some say, that by [Excommunicate] is meant [Excommunicable] or such as ought to be Excommunicate, and then what more can you desire?
M.
Their saying is a presumptuous contradiction to that which they consent to, what reason have they for it: Is Excommunicate, and Excommunicable all one? Or may they put what sense they list on Laws? If they do but tell the Bishops this much, they will make them know that they are not made Judges of who is Excommunicable: When I have craved but the alteration of that word, they answered me with contempt, that so every Priest or Curate should have the power of damning whom he please. But sure Si…encing our judgment of a man, is not damning him.
But what place is there for any doubt, when the Book nameth the three sorts excepted, & exceptio firmat regulam in non exceptis. Yea the express exposition in the Canon …8. is [If he shall refuse to Christen the one, or bury the other (that is, Any brought) except the party deceased were Denounced Excommunicate, Majori Excommunicatione, for some grievous and notorious Crime, and no man able to testifie of his repentance, he shall be Suspended by the Bishop of the Diocese from his ministry by the space of three months.] And alas how many thousand Infidels, Hobbists, Sadducees, Hereticks, Adulterers, Thieves, Perjured, Scorners at godliness, &c. are among us unexcommunicated. If all in England be saved, except the Unbaptized, Excommunicate, and Self-murtherers (which, de singulis, one by one must be said of all the rest) either Scripture and Pulpits are much mistaken, or else we that live among men are in a dream, and our senses are all deceived.
CHAP. XVII. Point XIV. Of Consenting to Read the Apocrypha.
L.
WHat harm is there in reading the Apocrypha?
M.
I told you that we scruple not reading most of it in the place of Homilies or other Books; especially the books called Wisedom and Ecclesiasticus.
But, 1. Many Bishops and Doctours of the Church of England have accused the books of Tobit of down right lies, and the books of Iudith, Bell and Dragon, &c. as being meer fictions. 2. And when we read these, it is to be done in the same order as we read the Scripture, by the name of Lessons, which is the Title given to the Chapters read out of the Old and New Testament. 3. And, if we could yet read all these, that will not serve unless we declare our Assent, Consent, and Approbation of the Appointment of them in the book, which we cannot do.
L.
But they are for the most part to be read but on week days, or holy days.
M.
The Conforming Clergy Consent and Covenant to the Imposition that requireth them to read the Common-Prayer every day in the week, unless they be hindred by sickness or some urgent cause. And so it is still the publick Service.
God's Service is all to be done with holy Reverence, and if the Book of Tobit and some others be guilty of so many gross falsehoods, as Protestants have and do still accuse them of, I fear both to use them as Lessons in the place of God's Word, lest it be prophanation, and also to subscribe, or declare my Approbation of the Calender, and that use, lest I be guilty of the sin of all the Ministers in England that so use it. And it's dangerous to seem to tell the people that so many books are God's Word that are not such: For they understand not the Greek word Apocrypha, and every Reader at least that is not Licensed to Preach, is forbidden by the Canon to expound even that one word to them.
CHAP. XVIII. Point XV. Of Assenting to Mistranslations, and Subscribing that they are not contrary to the Word of God.
L.
ARE not the Epistles and Gospels used according to the last Translation?
M.
Yes, in the new Books they are, but the Psalms are not.
L.
What great mistranslations are there?
M.
Sometimes a whole Verse or more is left out, and sometimes the Translation is quite contrary to the Text. As Psal. 105. 28. [They rebelled against his word] instead of [They rebelled not against his word] And in the Book (which this justifieth) are many in the Epistles and Gospels; I have cited them at large elsewhere.
L.
How cometh there to be so many faults in the old Translation?
M.
The work was an excellent good work: But the Authors (it seems for want of skill in the Hebrew) followed the Septuagint Greek translation, which hath these and many such defects.
L.
Sure it is lawful to use and follow the Septuagint, for the Apostles did so in the New Testament.
M.
1. The Apostles some times use it, and sometimes follow the Hebrew against it, and sometimes neither. 2. But to Use it is one thing, and to Justifie it is another thing. It was in common use in the time of Christ and his Apostles, and they used that in speaking to the people, which use made intelligible and acceptable. And we scruple not using it: But all the works of Man are imperfect, as Man is: And why must we subscribe that there is nothing in it contrary to the word of God? When as every mistake in it is contrary to it.
L.
It seems then you would not subscribe to the Bible, that there is nothing in it contrary to the Word of God?
M.
I will subscribe to the truth of all that is in the true Copies of the Original, if there by any such: And I will subscribe that the various Lections in those Copies that we have, are not the failing of the Holy Ghost, or Apostles, nor are such as leave us in just doubt of any necessary Truth? And I will subscribe to the Translation so far as it agreeth with the Original. But I will not subscribe that any Translation is perfect or faultless▪ or to this or that Hebrew or Greek Copie, as if in every word or Lection it certainly agreed with the Autographs. And why should men make snares for the Church, by imposing Professions, that any mere man's works are perfect, when all mortal men are confessedly imperfect? Is it not enough peaceable to use them, and to profess that all the word of God is infallible Truth?
L.
But I cannot think that an Approbation of all the Translations is intended in your Assent and Consent.
M.
Are they no part of that which is contained in the Book, and prescribed by it? Or could not the Parliament speak sense.