A Scourge for a Railer, Treatise · Part 3

A Scourge for a Railer · Treatise · Part 3

p. 28The 3. imputation of vntruths.

The accusation.

Next after his vncharitable slaunders, followeth the imputation of vntruths. In the front of Limbomastix he findeth no fewer then sixe vntruths.

1. He taketh exception to the title Limbomastix, which he would hauehave to signifie, a scourge of the hem or border of a garment: and so he chargeth the Replyer in his rude discourse (as he more rude himselfe calleth it) to cut a sunder the hem of the precious garment of Christ, the doctrine and discipline of the Church: he saith also that it is a new found name: and it should hauehave beene entituled Limbopatrum mastix, the word patrum should hauehave beene added to limit the generall signification. 2. b. p. 2.2. b. p. 2.

2. Vntr…th. That he forgeth a new matter neuer questioned in this Church, whether Christ descended into hell to deliuer the Patriarkes. ibid. p. 3.2. b. p. 3.

3. Vntruth. That the Replyer ac…useth his answer as enclining to that opinion (of Limbus patrum:) for what one word (saith he) thorough the whole booke doth insinuate so much as any suspition thereof? p. 5.2. b. p. 5.

4. Vntruth. The abuse and misapplication of Saint Pauls words, Phil. 3. 15. Let vsus, as many as be perfect, be thus minded. p. 8. for the Apostle speaketh not this of doctrine, but of perfection of life, if you will credit S. Chrysostome. p. 10.2. b. p. 10.

5. Vntruth. You abuse that auncient and godly father S. Augustine in peruerting his words. p. 12.2. b. p. 12.

p. 296. Vntruth. That he maketh the ignorant beleeue that the defenders of this article of Christs descension into hell, ioyne hands with none but with Bellarmine and other Papist. 2. b. p. 33.2. b. p. 33.

The iustification.

1. FIrst, if the Replyer had missed somewhat in the title and inscription of his booke, had that beene so great a fault, as to deserue to be counted an vntruth? Cicero was more equall toward his deadly enemie Antonie: who saith,Philippic. 10. Te verbi inopia lapsum putarem: I would hauehave thought, that you were ouerseene for want of a word. 2. What though Limbus originally signifie the purle, hem, or gard of a womans garment: yet seeing the Romanists hauehave appropriated that word, to signifie that place which is in the brimme and skirts of hell, where they imagine the fathers to hauehave beene, we must vnderstand it according to the vsuall sense: as Hierome saith in the like: non possumus quae dicuntur, Hieron. de v…te sacerdotal.nisi consuetis vocibus intelligere: we can not vnderstand what is said, but by the accustomed words. 3. That the Replyer scourgeth the doctrine and discipline of the Church (which is as the hemme of Christs garment) is a meere slaunder, as is before shewed, slaund. 6. but the Replyer is beholding to this forger of vntruths, that he maketh him but a scourger of the hemme of Christs garment, which commeth not neare the flesh and bodie: as the saying is, neare is my shirt, but nearer is my skinne▪ whereas he himselfe hath whipped the very members and parts of Christs bodie, holding his brethren, because they dissent from him about the locall discent, no better then dissemblers, schismatikes, yea heretikes, and maintainers of blasphemous paradoxes: as hath beene before declared, in the two former imputations of rayling, and slaunders: so that I may iustly returne vponupon him Augustines words against the Donatists: Venit persecutor, & non fregit crura Christi, venit Donatus, & diripuit Ecclesiam Christi: integrum p. 30corpus Christi in cruce inter manus persecutorum est, & inter manus Christianorum, non est integrum corpus Ecclesiae: In Psalm. 33. 2.Ps 33:2The persecutor came and brake not the legges of Christ: Donatus came, and spoiled the Church of Christ: the bodie of Christ is whole amid the hands of the persecutors; but in the hands of Christians, the bodie of the Church is not whole.

Secondly, though Limbomastix may seeme a new name for the application, yet in respect of the manner of deriuation and composition, it is not new: as the vsuall words, Homeromastix, Rhetoromastix, doe shew. Againe, if Limbomastix be a new found name, what is his Symbolomastix, and Cleromastix, epist. dedid. p. 10. and that new tearme of discreeding, wherein he glorieth beeing vsed thoroughout his, not onelyonly rude, but rauing and rayling writing: whereof I may say, as Tullie doth of a certaine straunge word in the Latine tongue, which Antonie vsed: quod verbum in lingua (Anglicana) nullum est, id tu novum propter diuinam tuam pietatem inducis: Latinae Cicero Phil. 13.that word which is not at all in (the English) tongue, you take vp new, because of your diuine pietie.

Thirdly, whereas he would hauehave it entituled rather, Limbopatrum mastix: 1. what neede the word patrum be inserted, seeing vse hath obtained among the Romanists (who are masters both of the word, and error therein implied) that Limbus, without any addition should signifie that place and part of hell, where they imagined the fathers to be imprisoned: as his ringleader could hauehave told him, after whose pipe he might hauehave daunced here, as well as in other places. 2. And if he would needes hauehave formed a word,Bellar. illuminauit sanctos patres, qui erāt in limbo, &c. Durandus dicit eos fuisse in limbo. lib. 4. de Christi anim. c. 15. to his owne fashion, he that is so cunning in declining and inflecting of nounes (as his daily exercise with his grammer boyes doth make him perfect) should rather hauehave said, Limbopatrimastix, to auoide the concurrence of a double (m) euphoniae gratia, then Limbopatrummastix. 3. And why els doth he so must striue for this p. 31sesquipedale verbum, Limbopatrummastix, but to obtrude, as Hierome, saith,Hieron. ad Theodor. magis portenta, quam nomina, monstrous tearmes, rather then names: simplices quos que terrens sono, vt quod non intelligant, plus mirentur: terrifying the simple, with straunge sounds, that what they vnderstand not, they may wonder at, as Hierome saith of Basilides.

2. The question in deede concerning Limbus patrum, was neuer controuerted among sound Protestants: and therefore while he falleth vponupon that rocke (as is discouered in the preface) he bringeth his Protestants faith into strong suspition, as not holding a straite course by the direction of the true compasse of Euangelicall truth: he wresteth here against the Replyer a sentence out of Augustine: as though he could have had nothing to say, vnlesse he had imagined an aduersarie to raile vponupon. But the truth is, that if this brasen face, I would say, brasen-nose master of art, had left out his rayling, slaunders, vntruths, errours, absurdities, and such like: he should neither hauehave found what, nor against whome to hauehave written. And Augustine shall be returned againe vponupon himselfe, who may vse his words in his owne person:de natur. & grat. lib. 1. c. 25. Procliviores sumus quaerere potius, quid contra ea respondeamus, quae nostro obijciuntur errori, quam intendere, quam sunt salubria, vt carcamus errore: we are more readie to seeke rather, what we may answer to those things, which are obiected against our error, then to consider, how wholesome they are, that we may be without error.

3 How vntrue it is, that there is not one word through his whole booke, that doth insinuate any suspicion of holding Limbus patrum, let the Preface be witnesse, wherein this Popes▪ liuerie is fitted so close to his backe, as if hee himselfe had of purpose put it out to making. Therefore, the title of Lambomastix misseth not an haires breadth, (in that respect) of that marke which hee aimeth at in his first booke. Indeed, his leaues are fronted throughout with false and presumptuous inscriptions; the defence of 3. testimonies p. 32of scripture. For, what a vile slaunder is this, that any of those against whom he speaketh, and carpeth (according to his name) should denie any testimony of Scripture? and what presumption is it, to take vponupon him, & professe to be a defender of Scripture; wheras, both the truth, and whosoeuer professeth the truth, is by it defended: the Scripture should be driuen to a great straight, if it needed his poore defence. Here therefore, Augustines sentence fitteth him well; Haeretici ad defensionem possessionis suae, Christi titulos ponunt, sicut nonnulli faciunt in doma sua: ne domum suam inuadat aliquis potens, ponit ibi titulos potentis, In Psal. 21.Ps 21titulos mendaces, ipse vult possessor esse domus, & frontem domus suae titulo alieno vult muniri. Heretiks for the defence of their possessiō, do set vp the titles of Christ, as many doe in their house: least some mightie man should inuade his house, hee setteth vp the title of some great man, but a false title: hee would be the owner of the house, but the front of his house he would hauehave priuiledged by another mans title. Wee will pardon him the first name of heretiks, though we might as iustly returne it vponupon him, as he sendeth it to vsus: but all the rest most kindly agreeth vntounto him. For, he vnderunder colour of defending certaine testimonies of Scripture, obtrudeth his owne priuate sense of scripture.

4 First, some Fathers also vnderstand that place of the perfection of knowledge;Orig. l. 10. in epist. ad Roman. as Origen vponupon those wordes, Rom. 15. 14. filled with all knowledge, alluding vntounto this place, thus expoūdeth the one by the other; Paulus, & si qui sunt tales, ad comparationem caeterorum perfecti dicuntur, &c. Paul, and if there be any such, are said to be perfect by way of comparison with others; ad illam summam scientiam, quae est in coelestibus ordinibus, &c. in respect of that high knowledge, which is in the heauenly orders, none among mortall men can be called perfect. Likewise, Augustine thus interpreteth the 13. verse, of the which, this other place dependeth:de divers. ser. 13. Ergo non arbitror meipsum p. 33apprehendisse, id est, qualis sit Deus: I doe not thinke, that I hauehave apprehended it, that is, what manner of one God is. 2 Yea Chrysostome himselfe, in the same place addeth these words, which are not truely alleadged by the Carper: Et ne putent seipsos perfectos esse: that they should not thinke themselues to be perfect. Quisquis putat se totum esse assequntum, nihil habet: He that thinketh he hath attained the whole, hath nothing. And a little before he saith, Non dixit, Deus inducet, sed reuelabit, vt res ista videatur magis esse ignorantiae: He said not, God will induce, but reueale, that all this matter may seeme to be ignorance. Where then, there is opinion on the one side, and ignorance of the other; there the matter treated of, belongeth to knowledge, not to practise or perfection of life onelyonly. Chrysostoms meaning then is, that the Apostle speaketh not, de dogmatibus of (speculatiue) doctrines, for that must be his meaning, vnlesse he wil make him contrarie to himselfe; but of practised knowledge, which belongeth to the practise of life. That no man should thinke, that he hath any other perfection or righteousnesse, but onelyonly by faith in Christ; for, that is the principall argument handled in this place, as appeareth verse 9. And further, what Chrysostoms meaning is, appeareth by his interpretation of the very like place, 1. Cor. 2. 6. Wee speake wisdome among those which are perfect: Sapientiam autem praedicationem, & salutis modum, hoc est, per crucem salutem, perfectos vero credentes appellat, &c. Wisdome he calleth preaching, and the manner of saluation; that is, by the crosse, and beleeuers he calleth the perfect. Here it is cleare, that he vnderstandeth not the perfection of life, but of faith. 3 There is no sense vrged of the Apostles words, but onelyonly the sentence produced; and therefore this exception of the Apostles meaning is superfluous and impertinent. 4 Concerning that false charge of dissembling the Apostles wordes following, Neuerthelesse, whereunto we hauehave attained, let vsus proceed by one rule, that we may be of one accord. First, if p. 34he dissembleth, which citing a place of Scripture, omitteth either the verse before going, or following; he will make S. Paul a dissembler, who vseth eueryevery where, as chap. 3. to the Romans, and chap. 10. throughout those chapters, only to alleadge that part of the sentence, and testimonie of Scripture, which was to his purpose, leauing the rest. Secondly, the Replyer also, euen produceth this sentence afterward, where he had cause to vse it,epi. d…d. p. 5. 2. b. p. 12. and this the Cauiller himselfe confesseth: how then was he not ashamed, to charge him herein with dissimulation?

5 Neither is Augustine abused, or his words peruerted; for, the Replyer writing in other characters, erraueris, and tibi, did insinuate that those words were otherwise in Augustine: and hee followed rather his sense, then vrged the sentence. Could he make no difference betweene a Rhetoricall imitation of an authors sentence, and a logicall allegation of his testimonie? the one beeing vsed for illustration onelyonly, the other for probation: the one following the …ense, the other tied to the words. As Hieroms alleadgeth Cicero to hauehave done the like: Non conuerti vt interpres, sed vt Orator: I did not turne and translate him (meaning Demosthenes) as an interpreter; but as an Orator. And Hierome further addeth:Hieron. Pammac. de optimo genere interpret. Non me ea annumerare lectori debere putaui, sed tanquam appendere: I thought I was not bound to deliuer the wordes by number, but by waight.

6 In the sixt vntruth obiected, he committeth two vntruths: for neither doth the Replyer make mention of other defenders of the locall descension, but of the immodest pamphleter onelyonly: neither saith he that he ioyneth hands onelyonly with Bellarmine: but that the places first vrged by Bellarmine to that purpose, were seconded by him. But thus cunningly to couer his owne wickednesse, he would hauehave the lappe of an others garment cast vponupon him: and where his owne credit serueth not, he would be maintained by other mens fame. And to make the Replyer p. 35more odious, and himselfe more popular: he seeketh to iustifie himselfe, by extending the accusation to others. So that saying of Hierome may very well be applied against him:Hierom. Ocean… tom. 3. Indecens est vnum tueri, vt plures accusare videaris, & qu…m ratione non possis, societate peccantium defendere: It is an vnmeete thing, so to iustifie one, that you seeme to accuse many: & whom with reason you cannot, to defend with number of offenders. This was an olde tricke of the peruerse dogmatizers in times past,Ephesin. 2. in…ostum Cha…e… nens. as Dioscorus cried out in the 2. Ephesine Synode: Ego cum patribus eijcior: Ego defendo patrum dogmata: I am cast out with the fathers: I defend the opinion of the fathers.

The Recrimination.

Vntruths boldly affirmed and falsely forged in theaaAnapologist, that is, a defender without defence. Anapologists Reioynder.

It may seeme strange that a man should be so besotted with his owne conceit, and blinded with enuie, that hee should obiect error and vntruth to another, not knowing to tread one right foote himselfe: and to cauill at anothers tripping, when he stumbleth and falleth downe right. For any one vntruth surmised by him, he shall be apaied tenne for one. It may truely bee said, if a diligent examination were had, that he hath not so many leaues in his booke, as leasings; nor so many numbers, as errors: a dogge trotteth not so fast, as his pen droppeth forgeries (as the common saying is:) for plainely to giuegive him the lie, the Replyer wil forbeare, as this sophisticall forger for want of manners doth more then once, beeing ten times more worthy the whetstone himselfe. Archidamus said of an olde man of Chius, that beeing sent of an Embassage to the Lacedemonians, had coloured his graie haires, before he deliuered his message: foreign: what truth is to be expected from p. 36this man, which carieth about a lie not onelyonly in his heart, but in his head. And if this Chian coyner doe so forge with his hand and penne, who can iudge his heart to be cleare. But I will now open this pedlars packe, and bring to view his sophisticate wares.

1. Vntr. I doe maruell to see an Article of our Creede in so ill credit with Christians: epist. dedicat. p. 9.epi. ded. p. 9. he laboureth in what he may to discreede my Christian and necessarie defence of this article of our Creede. pref. p. 5.pref. p. 5. 3. Vntruths. Here are three vntruths couched together: for what Christian denieth any article of the Creede? his defence is neither Christian, beeing full of vncharitable rayling, and slaunders: nor yet necessarie: as though both other learned men had not written better of that argument, and as if there were not many that could handle their penne with more wit and learning, if he had held his peace.

2. Vntr. In the propheticall testimonie of Dauid you will needes hauehave the word (soule) to signifie the humanitie of Christ, and here (that is, in this place of Peter) you will needes hauehave it to signifie the diuinitie. 1. b. p. 24.1. b. p. 24. Whereas in that place of Peter, there is no mention made of the soule of Christ, but of the spirit.

3. Vntr. Bellarmine most truly defendeth with me against you, &c. that Christ after his death descended in soule to those places of hell, where dolours and torments were; and where the soules of sinners wont to be tortured. 1. b. p. 35. where fowre vntruths are wrapped vp together. 1. b. p. 35. 4. Vntruths.1. Bellarmine saith onelyonly, probabile est, &c. it was probable, that Christ descended to all the places of hell; whereas this fellow defendeth it to be an article of the Creede so to beleeue, and consequently of necessitie: therefore his Ringleader and ghostly father therein agreeth not with him. 2. Those first are not Bellarmines, but Augustines words: dicit Augustinus, Christum descendisse, &c. Augustine saith, that Christ descended to those places of hell, &c. where dolours and torments were. 3. These torments Bellarmine p. 37vnderstandeth to hauehave beene spoken of the purgatorie paines, and not of the torments of hell: restat, vt loquatur de animabus quae adhuc luebant poenas purgatorias: it remaineth that he (Augustine) speaketh of the soules which suffered purgatorie paines. in fin. capitis. 4.Bellar. lib. 4 de Christ. anim. c. 14. The other words, vbi solebant peccatorum animae torqueri, where the soules of sinners were wont to be tortured, are not Bellarmines but Fulgentius his words: see the place.

4. Vntr. Howsoeuer you bestirre your selues first to kill and crucifie the blessed soule of our Sauiour vponupon the crosse. 2. b. p. 35.2. b. p. 35. A great slaunder, with vntruth: the Replyer is farre from that blasphemie, to say that the soule of Christ can be killed.

5. Vntr. H. I.Whose arguments are eueryevery where seconded, vrged, and intruded by you: 2. b. p. 44.2. b. p. 44. whome with a scurrilous tearme, he calleth one of his chiefest captaines, and greatest masters: p. 51.p. 51. and eueryevery where he calleth him, the Replyers Patriarke, 3. b. p. 3.3. b. p. 3. and in diuers other places: whereas the Replyer professeth ex animo, that he knoweth not what arguments are vrged by him (whome this forger noteth) as hauing not read his defence:Synops. p. 1049, 1050, 1051. and beside, the Replyer did first els where write somewhat of this matter, and therefore he was rather seconded by the other, then did second him. And how absurd and inconsequent a speech it is, who seeth not, to nickname him a Patriarke, whome his cauilling spirit eueryevery where inueigheth against as an impugner of the reuerend calling of Bishops.

6. Vntr. 2 Vntruthes.That he verily beleeueth the Replyer to be one of those, which writ the vnchristian letter to M. Hooker: p. 49.2. b. p. 49. whereas the Replyer knoweth not to this day, who were the writers of that letter: which he that calleth vnchristian, beeing for the manner modest, and for the points of doctrine there maintained sound, seemeth rather himselfe to hauehave small Christianitie. If his beleefe of Christs soule discent into hell, be of no more certentie with him, then this his beleefe, (as it may be thought verily it is not p. 38with him, howsoeuer it is with others) his faith and beleefe is very weake.

7. Vntr. 2. Vntruthes.The auncient fathers doe interpret it of a mortall sinne, not secretly but openly committed against others: 2. b. p. 67.2. b. p. 67. he meaneth that place, Matth. 18. 15. If thy brother trespasse against thee, &c. In this indefinite speech, he seemeth to meane all the auncient fathers, whereas he alleadgeth not one to prooue this his assertion to be true. But in deede in this his bold speech, he bewraieth his ignorance mixed with vntruth: for the first he is to be borne withall: for his schoolemasters skill can not be supposed to be able to attaine vntounto any great reading in the fathers. But his other fault is not to be excused:The blind Confuters ignorāce in the fathers. his ignorance in the fathers should hauehave made him doubtfull and scrupulous, not bold and presumptuous: but in him the prouerb is verified, who so bold, as blind bayard: for here he hath with one breath vttered two vntruths: first, that the auncient fathers doe interpret this place of mortall sinne: Origene I hope (in his calender) is one of the auncient fathers, yet he expoundeth the place of light and small offences: Qui in peccato levi correptus ter, Tractat. 6. in Matth.&c. non se emendat, nos quidem sic eum debemus habere tanquam publicanum, &c. He that in a light sinne beeing thrice reprooued, &c. doth not amend himselfe, we must so hold him as a publicane.

Secondly, that the fathers doe expound it of sinnes openly committed; and therefore to be openly and publikly censured, is an other vntruth. For the author of the Homilies vponupon Mathew, fathered vponupon Chrysostom, writeth thus vponupon this place;Homil. 61. in 18. cap. Math. Inter duos solummodo redargutionem fieri iubet, &c. He biddeth that the reprehension should be made betweene two alone, lest by the testimony of the multitude, &c. he should shew himselfe more hard to bee corrected. Likewise I suppose, that Augustine will bee allowed for one of the Fathers, but he giueth this interpretation;Serm. 16. de verb. Dom. caus. 2. qu. 1. c. 19. Quid est (in te peccauit) tu scis, quia peccauit, quia enim secretum fuit, quando in te peccauit, secretum quaere p. 39cum corrigis, quod in te peccauit: What is this, hath sinned against thee? thou knowest that he hath sinned, because therefore it was secret, when he sinned against thee, seeke him in secret, when thou doest correct that, which he hath sinned against thee. Now then, his owne words may bee returned vponupon his owne head;2. b. p. 68. it was either great ignorance, or grosse ouersight in you, to say, the ancient Fathers doe interpret it of mortall sinne openly committed.

8. Vntruth. That the Replyer presseth Carliles very reasons, &c. and acknowledgeth him for a sound interpreter. p. 92.2. b. p. 92. & that he borroweth diuers things of him. p. 125.p. 125. whereas the Replyer doth protest, that he neuer yet read, or so much as sawe Carliles booke: but what will not euill will imagine?

9. Vntruth. 3. Vntruths.That Bellarmine agreeth with all antiquitie, in taking the Hebrew and Greeke words, sheol, and foreign, that they signified onelyonly soule and hell. 2. b. p. 119.2. b. p. 119. Here are three notable vntruths; for neither antiquitie, nor yet Bellarmine, nor any learned interpreter, euer tooke these two words sheol, and hades, to signifie the soule and hell: for neither of them was euer taken by any to signifie the soule. Secondly, not all the auncient interpreters tooke sheol, Cyprian. seu Ruff. in Symbolum.translated infernus, onelyonly to signifie hell; for Cyprian vponupon the Creed, which is also ascribed to Ruffinus, doeth take it for the graue, in these words: Sciendum est, quod in Ecclesiae Romanae symbolo non habetur additum descendit ad infernos, &c. We must knowe, that in the Romane Church it is not found added in the Creed, he descended to hell, &c. Vis tamen verbi eadem videtur esse in eo, quod sepultus dicitur: but the same force of the word seemeth to be in that he is said to be buried. And Chrysostome also concurreth: Descendit ad infernum, vt ibi à miraculo non vacaret, &c. He descēded to hell, that he should not there be without miracle;See more of Augustines iudgement. Imp. 11. Recrim. for many of the bodies of the Saints rose with Christ, and died againe, hom. 2. in Symbol. Here by infernus, hell, hee seemeth to vnderstand that place, p. 40from whence Christ raised the bodies of the dead, that came out of their graues; which is none other, but the place of buriall,August. loc. 5. and the graue. And Augustine expoundeth that place, Psalm. 88. 3. My life draweth neere to hell, by these words of Christ, My soule is heauy vntounto death. Thirdly, neither doth Bellarmine take the wordes sheol and nephesh, onelyonly to signifie hell: for the first, hee saith,Lib. 4. de Christ. aenim. c. 10. Ordinariè accipitur, &c. it is taken ordinarily for the place of soules vnderunder the earth: & vel raro, vel nunquā pro sepulchro: or seldome, or neuer for the graue. He simply denieth not, but that it sometime signifieth the graue, though not ordinarily. For the other word, thus he saith; Nephesh est generalissim… vox, Bellar ibid. c. 12.&c. Nephesh is a generall word, and signifieth without any trope, as well the soule, as the liuing creature; yea the body. Hee may be ashamed therefore thus to belie his ring-leader, and grand captaine; with whom, he saith he is beholding to the Replyer for ioyning him, being a learned Papist. p. 119.2. b. p. 119.

10. Vntruth. That hee doeth fasten all the torments of hell vponupon the blessed soule of our Sauiour. 2. b. p. 154.2. b. p. 154. wheras the Replyer simply denieth against the false charge of Feuardentius,Synops. p. 1814. That Christ suffered in his soule the whole paines of the damned in hell.

11. Vntruth. 4. Vntruths.That you expound in the former testimonie, soule, that is, body; hell, that is graue: and here, spirits, that is, men; dead, that is liuing. 3. b. p. 71.3. b. p. 71. Here are foure vntruths fardelled vp together. 1. Neither doth the Replier by soule vnderstand body; but either the person, or life. 2. Neither by hell, the graue; but only sheweth that the hebrew word sheol, which signifieth hell, is sometime taken for the graue. 3. Nor yet doth he expound spirits, that is men; but that they are called now spirits, with S. Peter, which sometime were men. 4. And they which are now dead, were sometime liuing.

12. Vntruth. OnelyOnly Beza may seeme to fauour you, that is,2. b. p. 118. in taking soule for life. 2. b. p. 118. What boldnesse is p. 41this, to set downe such peremptorie negatiues, as though he had himselfe runne ouer all writers, both new & olde? What a great vntruth is it to say, onelyonly Beza, when as Caluine directly affirmeth the same:In Act. 2. 27.Acts 2:27 Neque enim anima tam spiritum immortalis essentiae significat, quam vitam ipsam: for the soule doth not so much signifie the immortall essence of the spirit, as the life it selfe. Is Caluin in his base opinion no bodie?

13. It turneth Christs euerliuing soule into a dead bodie: 3. Vntruths.it siteth hell in the superficies of the earth: maketh hell a place of corruption, and there burieth the blessed soule of our Sauiour. 2. b. p. 164.2. b. p. 164. All these impieties and absurdities he chargeth the Replyer with for so vnderstanding that place, Act. 2. 27. that Christs life seemed to be raked vp in the graue: for here he hath vttered three vntruths: 1. the soule beeing taken for the life, turneth not the soule of Christ into the bodie, but maketh the life onelyonly to be as laid vp in the graue: 2. they which take sheol here for the graue, which also signifieth hell, denie not, but that beside this sheol in the graue, there is an other also in hell: sheol taken for the graue is a place of corruption, not sheol when it signifieth hell: 4. he is the man, that burieth and shutteth vp Christs soule in hell, holding and affirming, that it was there three daies.

14. That Durand held an opinion contrarie to all the rest of the Romanists, that Christs soule descended not to hell in substance, 2. b. p. 190.but by certaine effects: Thom. 3. p. q. 52. art. 2.p. 190. whereas Thomas Aquinas held the same in effect: that Christ onelyonly descended per realem praesentiam, by his reall presence to Limbus patrum: to all the other places of hell, per effectum, by effects:Bellar. de Chr. anim. c. 16. and thus Bellarmine himselfe citeth him: take away that conceit of Limbus patrum, which to all Protestants is but a dreame, and in the rest these two agree.

15. Neither Protestant, 2. b. p. 190.nor yet Papist (of any account) will take your part: for the Papists, they are fitter mates for him: but diuers Protestants of great account are in p. 42this question of the Replyers iudgement: as instance is giuen in twelue of them before, 13. slaund. therefore, it is great vnshamefastnes in this brabler, to vtter so vnreasonable and improbable a speech.

16. He calleth A. Humes his first instructer,1. b. p. 195. p. 195. whereas he shall finde that the partie giuen in instance in his Reioynder, Synops.hath reference vntounto some of the Replyers works, euen in this argument.

17. Vntr. In this sense the word foreign is vsed eueryevery where throughout the Bible, that is, is meant for the soule. 3. b. p. 57.3. b. p. 57. A most audacious speech, and full of vntruth: for the word foreign, spirit, is as often taken for the diuine spirit of God, as for the soule of man: as is euident in these places, Ioh. 4. 24. God is a spirit. Rom. 1. 4. declared mightily to be the sonne of God touching the spirit of sanctification. 1. Tim. 3. 16. iustified in the spirit. 1. Tim. 4. 1. the spirit speaketh euidently: and many other such places might be produced: he sheweth how shamelesse a man he is therefore, that dare vent forth such a great vntruth, that this word spirit, eueryevery where is taken for the soule of man.

18. He saith, that sixteene of the fathers cited by Bellarmine, make no mention of the deliuerie of the fathers, by Christs descending to hell: 3. b. p. 79.3. b. p. 79. whereas there are fiue of that number wanting: for Bellarmine citeth in all 36. Councills and fathers, of the which 25. doe either directly, or by necessarie consequent affirme, that Christ descended to hell to deliuer the soules of the fathers: so that to make vp the full number, there remaine onelyonly an eleuen, which make mention onelyonly of Christs descending to hell, and speake not of the deliuerie of the fathers, and these they are: Lateranens. Concil. Irenaeus, Clemens, Gregor. Nyssen. Chrysostome, Theodoret, Augustine, Leo, Fulgentius, Vigilius, Arator subdiaconus: all which notwithstanding, or most of them, if not in those places, produced by Bellarmine, yet els where in their workes, doe giuegive testimonie with the rest for Limbus patrum.

p. 4319. Vntr. Synops. p. 1000.You flatly denie this distinction of the soules death by sinne or damnation, as insufficient: 3. b. p. 84.3. b. p. 84. whereas the Replyer directly saith, we approoue that sentence of Augustine, which maketh mention onelyonly of those two kinds of the death of the soule: speaking properly: though in a more generall sense, the deepe perplexitie and terrour of the soule, may be said to be a kind of death of the soule: where the Replyer further addeth in direct tearmes, I will forbeare to vse this phrase of Christs dying in soule. ibid.

20. Vntr. He calleth the Replyers exposition of that place of S. Peter, new fancies, hauing the approbation of Augustine for the most part, and of Bede more fully: whereupon the Replyer inferreth, that this exposition is not newly deuised. Limbom. p. 45.

21. Vntr. The word descending, is neuer spoken of the graue: 3. b. p. 139.3. b. p. 139. whereas Dauid saith thus to Salomon concerning Ioab: thou shalt not suffer his hoare head to descend into the graue in peace: where the word iaradh is vsed, which signifieth to descend: and the other word sheol beside the consent of the interpreters, Pag. Mont. Tremell. Vatab. and the Chalde translatour, and both our English translations, which all read or vnderstand, the graue; the circumstance of the place giueth it so to be taken, because he speaketh of his gray haires, which goe not downe to hell, but to the graue.

22. He saith that all Latine interpreters turne sheol, infernum, 3. b. p. 151.hell: Psal. 139. 8. p. 151. 3. b. when as Iunius readeth, stratum ponerem in sepulchro, if I should make my bed in the graue: and so Vatablus, though he reteine the word infernum, in the text …yet in his annotations he vnderstandeth it of sepulchrum the graue. An other vntruth it is, that all translatours and interpreters are condemned of falshood by Limbomastix: when as the Replyer saith onelyonly thus; neither doe some of the best interpreters read hell, but the graue. ibid. 3. b. p. 151. in marg.