Arrow Against the Separationists, Discourse · Chapter 12 · Section 7
Section. 7.
Hen. Ainſ.VNtoUnto our 5. allegation, from the leprous garments compared with the Apostles doctrine, Iude v. 23. warning us to hate even the garment ſpotted of the fleſh, and conſequently to hate the houſes of Antichriſt which are not onelyonly defiled with idols, but are idols them ſelves: you ſay nothing hereto, but take occaſion from an other place to ſpeak againe of Gods indulgence for ſome things of neceſsary uſe, wherof there is ynough ſayd before, and I ſhal leave it vntounto iudgement.
You here lay ſore blame vponupon me, for that in ſhewing out of the pontifical the popiſh manner of Ordination, I ſet it down with croſſes, as it is printed in that book before. You ſay, I erect them a nevv, and ſet them up for religious uſe, &c. Wherto I anſwer, Howſoever you aggravate this thing, the moſt that you can truly ſay, is that I ſeek to pull them downe frō religious vſe after an unlawful manner, if ſo it be found: but let us weigh your reaſons. The 1. is, that a Papiſt ſeing them, may come to bleſſe an idol in his hart, or adore one of them that he ſeeth. And ſo (ſay I) when he ſeeth or heareth the name of St. Peter, or any other St, or of a croſſe or crucifix, he may haply come to bleſſe an idol in his hart, and with his mouth too: ſhal they not therfore be ſpoken of, or written? 2. Therfore you ſay, this diviſed kinde of inſtruction hath no warrant from God, and ſo the ſyn comes on the instructours head. Your reaſon is, for that God in his word cauſeth not the ſhapes or figures of idols to be pourtrayed, whē he nameth Chemoſh, Moloch, &c. therfore there is no excuſe left for me herein. I anſwer, neyther doth God in his word, ſet down any figure of his Tabernacle, Ark, Temple, or of any man, beaſt, or other creature, or mapp of any countrie: is it not therfore lawfull in private books to pourtray any of theſe? If it be, then your reaſon from a deuiſed kinde of inſtruction without warrant from God, wilbe litle worth in this caſe. But wheras you ſay, that I neglecting the examples of all the Churches of Chriſt in that which is good, doe folow a few in that errour which I would ſeem moſt to condemne: I wil therfore leave it to the iudgement of the Churches of God, and ſtrive no more. For be it that I have offended herein, (as I confeſse I ſyn many other wayes, and ſo may in this though I ſee it not) yet is there no help to your cauſe therby at all. For, to iuſtifie evil becauſe an other man doeth the like, is but a ſorie plea.
Anſwer.
Io. Pa.VNtoUnto your allegation of Levit. 13. & 14. Chap. with Iude 23 I ſayd the leſſe becauſe I ſuppoſed you did not direct the ſame againſt our temples, but againſt the garments mentioned alſo in the ſame place of your Apologie: yet had you well regarded mine anſwer, you might have found ſufficient therein, to ſhew you that there is no conſequence from the burning of an vnproffitable leprous garment, to the aboliſhing of our temples. I alledged divers zLev. 11.32.33. & 6 28.ſcriptures vntounto you, teaching that God allowes the reteyning of ſuch things as are of more proffitable vſe, though they have bene formerly polluted: The aLev. 15.12earthen veſſell being polluted was to be broken; but the veſſell of wood or braſſe was to be rinſed and ſcowred onelyonly, and then made lawful for vſe againe. And is there not as much difference be twixt our temples and a rag: as there is betwixt an earthen and a woodden veſſel? To theſe ſcriptures you ſay nothing. I ſhewed bPag. 214 & 250.251before that the goodnes and bountifullnes of the Lorde towards his people was to be diſcerned herein: but you deſpiſe the bountifullnes of the Lord and will have his benefit to bereiected.Your complaint againſt all you write againſt, is that they bring not ſcripture: but when it is brought, we ſee that you are willing enough to paſſe by it ſometimes, as if it had not bene brought at all. You ſay that touching things of neceſſary vſe, there is ynough ſayd before: but touching this new reaſon from the ſcripture, nothing was ſayd before: and that which you have ſayd before for the reſt is ſhewed to be inſufficient. Yourſelf do often alledge one and the ſame ſcripture ſix or ſeven times over: And muſt we ſo often give anſvver vntounto your allegations, vvhiles you give no anſvver at all vntounto ſome of ours? But for the vveight thereof, I am content to leave them vntounto the iudgement of the reader.
Touching the grand Idol, erected by your ſelf, pourtrayed & printed in your booke, theſe are the things which I commend vntounto your conſideration, 1. You do therfore deſerve the ſorer blame to be layd vponupon you, for ſetting vp this Idol, becauſe your ſelf do ſo vniuſtly labour to bring the blame of ſo hainous Idolatry vponupon all the Churches of God: and you ſhould not complaine (as you do) that this thing is aggravated againſt you, becauſe the ſight of your errour herein may be a meanes to bring you vntounto ſome feeling of your ſelf and of your raſh iudgement. 2. Your fault hath not bene ſo aggravated againſt you, but that it may yet be ſhewed to be far greater, for though it be great in ech of the reſpects which cPag. 24.25before I ſhewed, becauſe without any neceſſary vſe, you do a new erect, not a monument onelyonly, but a very Idol, and a principall Idoll of Antichriſte, even the Idol of the croſſe, though in your anſwer you have not bene able to deny any one of theſe reſpects: yet your offence in ſetting vp this Idol is by far the more haynous and notorious in reſpect of the place, where you have ſet it. The ſettle or ſhrine wherevpon you have placed this Idol, is the name of God, even of the moſt holy Trinitie, as appeares in your printed dAnimad-verſ. pag. 6.book, where you have affixed the idol-croſſe vntounto the name of ech perſon in the Trinity, even as it is done in the idolatrous pontificall: And thus you do moſt vnworthily abuſe the name ofGod, in making it a foote-ſtoole for a moſt filthy idol to ſtand on and tread vponupon the ſame. VVhen the hetheniſh Idols or gods that could not cary them ſelves, were eEſa. 46.1.2.caryed vponupon the bunches of the camelles or vponupon the backs of other beaſts that bowed and fell downe vnderunder the burden, it was folly to be laughed at and ſin to be condemned; but to ſet the moſt abominable idol vponupon the back of the moſt holy and pure God; this is a ſin of greater indignity, to be abhorred and trembled at. It is odious to ſee the pope that great beaſt caried vpō the ſhoulders of men; but that the popes Idol croſſe ſhould ride vponupon the ſhoulders of the holy Trinitie, as in a chariot of Triumph, as in your book you have made it, this is far more odious and deteſtable. The ſin of Solomon was greater in reſpect of the place where he ſet vp Idols, even f1. Kin. 11 7.in the mountaine that is over againſt Ieruſalem: The ſin of Manaſses was yet greater in reſpect of the place where he ſet vp Idols, even g2. Kin. 21 4.5.7.in the houſe of God: but if he had placed an Idol in the oracle, in the moſt holy place, even vponupon the Mercy-ſeate over the ark, this had bene more horrible: And if yet further he had placed there betvvixt the Cherubims the moſt vile Idol, even Beelzebub the Prince of the devilles, this had bene out of meaſure ſinfull and impious above the reſt: And yet even this is the ſin vvhichwhich you ignorantly run into, vvhile yourſelf do confeſſe the image of the Croſſe to be hArrow againſt Idolat. cap. 5. ſect. 13.Beelzebub Prince of the Devilles, & yet place it over the ark, even vponupon the Glorious and fearful name of the Holy Trinitie: You that ſo raſhly blame all the Churches of Chriſt for their vſe of temples formerly polluted vvith Idolatrie, have not feared to make the name of God an Idol-temple, vvhere to this day the Idol-ſtands ſtill: vvere your bookes as much vvorth as the Epheſians Act 19. you ſhould do vvell to burne them all, that are yet in your hands, for a teſtimonie of your repentance. And for ſo much as you have condemned the Church of Rome, for imprinting the very ſame Idol of the croſſe not onelyonly in their Churches and houſes, but alſo iIbidem.in their bookes and writings; aboliſh your ovvne book and vvriting vvherein you have cauſedit to be imprinted. 3, whereas you plead, the most that I can truely ſay, is that you ſeek to pull them downe from religious vſe after an vnlawfull maner, &c. I am indeed willing to judge the beſt of you, and think that your entent and meaning was to doe God good ſervice, (as I wrote before) in teaching men the evill of Idolatry. But the beſt that we can judge hereof is evill enough: we ſee many Authors of playes and comedies do ſet forth ſuch enterludes with intent to pluck downe vice, but doing the ſame without any warrant of Gods word, & vſing ſuch a kinde of inſtruction as God never appoynted: they do ſtrengthen the vices & wickednes which they would reprove. And what is the maine breach of the ſecond cōmandemēt but the ſerving of God after an vnlawful maner? Therfore when you ſee yourſelf cōvicted of this vnlawfull maner by ſetting vp an Idol, & making the name of God an Idolie for the ſame, your evill therein may be great enough though there be no more then that. 4, In ſetting downe your anſwer to my reaſon againſt your Idol, you deale deceitfully, and vſe a fallacie ab iniquâ diviſione, dividing that reaſon in to two, which was but one. The ſumme of it was: that ſuch kinde of inſtruction as did occaſion men to ſtumble, to bleſſe an Idol in their hearts, and to worſhip the ſame, and withall was a deviſed kinde of inſtruction without warrant of Gods word, that was vnlawfull. The latter part of this reaſon I ſet downe by way of preoccupacion, to prevent thoſe vaine anſwers, which yet you have made vntounto it: as may be ſeene in my kPag. 25.former writing, This reaſon being taken thus together, your anſwers do both vaniſh preſently: for that which you anſwer firſt of men being offended and brought to bleſs an Idol, by ſeing or hearing the name of a croſſe or crucifix, is cut of by the ſecond part of my reaſon: becauſe there is warrant in the ſcripture to write or pronounce the name of an Idol, but not to picture them for religious vſe, as you have done the croſſe: That which you anſwer in the ſecond place touching the tabernacle, ark, temple, and ſuch like things deſcribed in mappes, is cut of by the firſt part of my reaſon: becauſe theſe figures and deſcriptions are not Idolatrous and ſcandalous as is the paynting of Idols & images for religious vſe. That you may more plainely ſee how vnequally and vnreaſonably you match theſe things together, which are ſo vnlike: do but conſider, that in the deſcription of carnall adultery & vncleannes, it would be a ſinfull and ſcandalous thing to picture many ſtories in ſuch maner, as they are recorded to have bene done in the ſcriptures: as for example, to paynt Bathſheba as ſhe was l2. Sam. 11 2.4.ſeene of David, & defiled of David, to pourtray the images of mGen. 38.18.Iudah & Thamar: of n2. Sam. 13.14.Amnon & Thamar, & of divers others as they are deſcribed in the word of God. You acknowledge, I doubt not but that their ſin is great which make ſuch offenſive pictures, oEzek. 23.14.16.occaſions of luſt. And if the naked pictures of carnall adultereſſes be vnlawfull, then are the pictures of ſpirituall whoredom in the caſe of offence vnlawfull alſo. And who ſees not the great difference betwixt theſe vncleane ſcandalous pictures, and the mappes of countries or figures of the temple and ſuch like things as you ſpeake of? 5, of the 7. reaſons which you bring againſt our vſe of temples, though they be all inſufficient againſt vsus: yet there are 5. of them that do condemne this vnneceſſary vſe of the Idol-croſſe erected in your booke; namely, the firſt, ſecond, fift, ſixt and ſeventh which ſerve to reprove the Idols and monuments of Idolatry, whereof there is no proffit to the Church of God. 6, whereas you ſeek to diminiſh your fault, by aſking whether it be not lawfull in private books to pourtray any of, &c. You wāder far from the matter, and do ill apply this demand to the queſtion in hand: for who ſees not that your printed booke wherein this Idol ſtands is a publique writing, publiſhed vntounto the world, and to the eyes of all that can read? yea herein you reprove yourſelf, in that in your //Pag. 3.former writing you do twiſe or thriſe call your printed bookes your proofes in publique: reaſons ſet forth in publique: how can you now make them to be private? And yet if your bookes were private onelyonly for your owne houſe, yet to pDeut. 27.15.ſet vp an Idol in them in ſecret, is not free: The qIbid. c. 13 6.ſecret entiſer vntounto Idolatry is ſubiect vntounto judgement. 7. whereas you ſay concerning this Idol, that you will leave it to judgement, & ſtrive no more: and confeſſe alſo that you may ſin in this matter though you ſee it not: you do hereby ſhew ſome doubting and vncertainty in this queſtion. It is alſo ſome ſigne of remorſe in you, in that here rPag. 175.before having as much or more colour to paynt croſſes in ſhewing the maner of conſecrating Churches out of the pontifical, then in ſhewing the maner of popiſh ordination, yet have you now (after admonition and warning) abſtayned from making theſe Idols. But as yourſelf ſayd before, The abſteyning from the practiſe doth not clear the Synner; vnleſs you do further repent and renounce your ſin: yea if sPag. 82.your reaſoning againſt vsus were ſound, your miniſtery ſhould be vnlawfull and not to be communicated withall vntill you had repented for making this Idol. If therfore you ſee not your ſin herein, as you ſay, you ought not to reſt, but rather to deſire to heare more of this queſtion in ſpeciall, that your conſcience might be ſettled and you come to ſome reſolution. But as for your ceaſſing to ſtrive vponupon that pretence becauſe I ſpake of ſome that had done this before you and of following a few herein, neglecting the examples of others, &c. this is very vaine: if vponupon ſuch pretences men ſhould ceaſs to ſtrive for the truth, you may ſee that many moſt neceſſary controverſies would be cut of, and the truth not mainteyned as is meet. Laſtly, I do not juſtify our evill by your doing the like, as you warne me not to plead: but I labour to condemne your evill, your making of an Idol without cauſe: if this were like vntounto our temples I ſhould condemne my ſelf alſo: And I ſhew your fault herein to this end, that you ſeing your errour touching the nature of Idols and Idolatry, might learne to be more ſober, & more ſwift to heare and ſlow to ſpeak againſt the Church of God, and more ſlow to wrath in plucking downe our temples over our heads, vnleſs you could better ſhew the wrath of God againſt them.